Not Necessarily. You can call it sonic composition, and it can make a bridge to infinite possibilities, or it just give you enough variation in something you're already really happy with to help it evolve. Don't suffocate the creative process with rules, especially when some of the rules were made by people who only ever wrote in one key.

 

Thanks @Lean and also @The Teknomage:
Do you believe I created this one after your comments in just 15 minutes in the mentioned key?

 

Last edited by a moderator: May 20, 2016

See Foster That to me is far more interesting to listen to than the first one you did. The first one was made me think Baroque Dance, heard it before becauase of the juxtaposed harmonies etc. This on the oother hand contains interesting note choice, great timing structures and above all is interesting. From my perspective a good fusion guitarist would love to play a lead over the top of this and it would make a greta song. You can then further extend by have a break and half time and go off on a wild tangent. Then in writing the lead thats when the modal theory really kicks in because you are then able to take any given scale shape and apply it toany key. That's the whole poinnt. The next mode in the main is simply the starting your interval run whatever on the next note of the scale. HUGE improvement imo & interesting above all

I also completely agree with the Teknomage. In that sonic composition is a great description as essentially you ARE changining the composition of the tune. When I said double track.

Well many guitarist will cheat and simply split their signal with a DI and delay one track a few MS & Pan. This creates the illusion of a double tracked lead.

skilled guitarist such as Shawn lane, Paul Gilbert, Vinnie Moore will replicate the lead almost exactly at blistering speed and pan. So it is in a way a total form of composition. example

Huge improvement Foster well done

His guitar signed for real by Tom Jones so he must be good lol

 

Last edited: May 20, 2016

@Lean is right you now, it was kind of my point while evoking sonic texture, a lot of evolution of the tracks today is induced byt changing that...You have to combine every variation techniques if you don't want to be boring.
You should experiment yourself and see what suits you. I know you guys don't agree, but I think personnal taste do matter.

 

Foster i dont think you`re cut up for this hobby,occupation,business or whatever,some people are some arent,perhaps you should find things that you understand,playing ping pong or decorating Christmas trees.

 

"Workflow" has become a buzz word. The most important thing is a song, composition, film score/soundtrack, or project that needs to be done, with a vision or concept of what you want for a final product. How the process proceeds ("workflow") from there is determined by what needs to be recorded and the sounds you are trying to create. Your methods and how things get done will follow on their own from there. Creative energy and the ability to plod through the mundane parts are what get things done, no matter what tools you use or how you use them. In this case function follows form.

 

Coming up: Christmas tree decoration workflow.

 

Hi Ya, just throwing in my 2c

I have 5 or 6 methods that I tend to use:
1. The Midi approach - Start track from first note/sounds and work from beginning to end (not looping 8bars), only adding what you naturally hear.
2. The Sample approach - Spend a month making your own loops*, sweeps, whooshes etc even recording random sounds with mic (rice on baking tray etc) then after a month or so and you have a couple of gb of your own unique sounds jam with them like you would any loop player, personally i try hard not to make any new sounds once i have my sample set with this method.
3. Start with Rhythm and build track
4. Start with Melody and build track.. someone before mentioned that they find they get stuck more when they start with melody, its easy to throw parts into a track that have little relation to the root note and no consideration of counterpoint etc. I won't say rules as that implys restraint... but more theory needs consideration if you start with melody IMO.
5. (I love this method) Again using Midi make every part using only a Piano instro, once you're happy with the parts, hook, structure etc. Swap all the piano sounds for sounds from other synths. This also works well in reverse, take what you feel is a complete track try this, change all of your midi parts to a piano sound.. if something is fundamentally wrong often you can hear that it just doesn't fit. Moreover, if if your music sounds good when transcribed in this way then there is a good change that it will also work well as a score (think ibiza at the proms or the 'Strings of life' orchestral concerts of the last few yrs.. this method i love as it is a great way to see if a track can transgress genre.
6. Get a ghost producer/engineer LOL (I laugh but having an engineer doing some of the menial shit can help you stay focused on music)

*I have nothing against sample packs, but I tend to only really use them to gain some inspiration or to get past the beats to the notes.. then i strip the pack samples out as much as applicable, I don't really want my music to sound like i just used the latest Vengeance or Loopmasters sample pack... but thats just me, there are enough successful producers out there who do, there is no right or wrong but to me that's kind of lazy and not creative enough and you know if your just making music with another persons loops you may as well go play with Lego!

After all this I should point out the obvious that the biggest thing that affects workflow can be what you use for your DAW !!

 

1- Are you doing your tracks respecting a specific workflow? I mean you know you should start from the point A and finish in the point Z?

Yes but not always. Depends on inspration, passion and where i stuck.

2- Which element is your most favorite one as the starting point? 1-Bass 2-Melody 3-Chord or 4-Drums? Which of these ones causes you to get inspired more for the next steps of you production?

Bass (Rolling and Sub Bass) or Melody (pluck, chord and main lead melodies).

Melody cause me get inspired. I try to find true scale for my feels .

3- OK, every genre has its own characteristics but could you apply your own workflow to all of them and expect the final result to be OK?

No .

4- Do you hate some genres because you don't like them or because you're not able to produce them with your workflow?

I hate some genres but not because of not able to produce , my style is harder than them. I just hate them because they are so easy chessy shit.

 

@Von_Steyr and @jayxflash
Keep out of mischief!
We're friends!

 

@Lean and @The Teknomage
This is for you (the same key)!

BTW, do you have any idea for its expansion structurally for converting it to a complete track? I really don't know what this is. Non of my loops or tracks are similar to my previous ones and this causes me not to be able to act precognitively and not to focus at their completions.

Also I can not find any similarity between my loops and other producer's songs so I get visionless about the structure.

 

Last edited by a moderator: May 21, 2016

I think the reason it's not flowing out for you is because you limit your imagination with the mindset of "it should only be done this way or it shouldn't be done at all!" Relax and have fun once in a while! I think the left side of your brain is far too active and might be burdensome to your artistic flow on the right. One of the best parts of production for me personally is experimenting, and not having anything planned. Usually the only plan I have is the BPM, the genre and then I go from there. Accidents in production can often become a seed that grows and branches off to a slew of new ideas!

I'm not sure the goals you have concerning the sound you want. If it's that track you supplied in an earlier post (the down tempo one), you would probably want to start experimenting with beats and go from there.

I think your quote should be reversed to get that right side of your brain more active "more producing, less thinking and learning!"

Good luck!

 

Last edited: May 21, 2016

Foster. How do u actually record this stuff? What DAW do u use. Do you like just take use a loop and play some midi over the top or something?Do u use a keyboard or piano roll and do you quantize your notes? Do you use a metronome? What time signature did u do this in coz it seems a little messed up. I mean how did you make your beats or did u just use a ready made loop from a pack coz it sort of way out ? I'm not being nasty am just curious as to how you did it exactly?

Forget workflow, theory and everything and just tell me how exactly u made that last loop thing type thing?

 

I agree. Especially if, like you said Foster, you are having trouble composition-ally. Then perhaps a more thorough analysis of how you work would be more helpful to you, then everyone else telling you how they work. Because clearly, people explaining their process to you hasn't once allowed you emulate it.

 

Another thing you really want to consider is effects and massive layering to give your tracks depth. For instance, this little bite from something I'm working on consists of 13 channels. If you can EQ and get your mix right, you can make all that layering meld and flow well. Use several different synths for a melody instead of one. Layering is your friend.

 

I seriously think the perfect path for you to go when it comes to genre is 8bit style video game music. It consists of compositions like you are aiming for. If you are interested in that retro sound, it's pretty popular right now, since classic gaming is making a big come back. If you are into that kind of music, I would really look to Chrono Trigger for inspiration. The compositions are right in your direction. Still great to listen to, even after 20 odd years!

 

Well if you wan't to make your stuff sound anything like the vid you just posted u need to do a shitload of work.

Video was cool though really liked it. Nice melodies.

I don't know Foster. Don't think I can help man because I don't work in that sort of area.

As said I'm mainly a simple guitarist and not that bothered about theory and all workflow crap as long as the end product comes out nice.

My only personal advice is that if u gonna be serious and set up a decent project then learn or program your own drums percussion rather than using loops coz that's just lame imo. It also messes up and many loops are tempo embedded so u need acidized and all that shite that i personally hate.

It a lot more difficult to have any measure of control without sounding crap. I guess mainly the way I start out is setting up just that all your percussion tracks etc as the tempo/drums especially as they in the main the driving force.

So best of luck in working it out. Hope u come out of it with something like the vid coz that was nice

 

Thanks @Lean!
If you want more of these video typed songs just listen to. I found the above one from there. All of its selected songs are beautiful:
http://somafm.com/groovesalad/
I love it but I need more tempo and fast movement of the notes at least 100.

@Trevor Gordon
Thanks man for the idea. I have heard it from some of my friends too. I need to take it serious.

 

Last edited by a moderator: May 21, 2016

I will have a look thanks for the info

 

You're welcome.
It has a big director (Rusty Hodge). It seems that being a director is better than being a producer. His mind is more open.

 

Last edited by a moderator: May 21, 2016