With this tecnique you will know what's the magic EQ plugin/hardware is doing to your signal

Discussion in 'Mixing and Mastering' started by Banz, Jan 21, 2019.

?

Have you ever done this before?

  1. Yes

    8 vote(s)
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  2. No

    5 vote(s)
    38.5%
  1. Banz

    Banz Ultrasonic

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    With this technique you will know how exactly a plugin / hardware does in your signal.

    Have you stopped to think that sometimes a plugin adds a 'color' that changes the equalization of your track and sounds great or bad but you do not know exactly what?
    For example a hipass of Neve 1073 or just the fact of putting a tape simulator your track already becomes more soft and midrage... does not need much more to sounds good.
    Or even a Waves CLA plugin that just inserts into the channel drastically changes the sound.

    With this plugin, you can see virtually what each equalizer does to your signal and so you end up understanding how they act and is a great tool to learn and see curves of eq's and their variations of models.

    The plugin is Q-Clone [A little bit old but GOLD]

    It's a plugin that copy the frequency curves of any signal that passes through it, unfortunately does not copy saturation, but in it we can get a base of which plugin / equipment does with your signal (if it is equalization thing).

    I'll post some photos of known plugins that you know have coloring, but do not know exactly what happens (and how interesting this is for your learning).

    VEQ3 (Neve 1073) - Hipass 70hz
    [​IMG] https://www.dropbox.com/s/zsitnfmlj178oqy/VEQ3.JPG?dl=0
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    Kramer Tape 15 IPS
    [​IMG] https://www.dropbox.com/s/6zpr8pz5tvs64ie/Kramer Tape 1.JPG?dl=0
    [​IMG]
    Kramer Tape 7.5IPS
    [​IMG] https://www.dropbox.com/s/edn6yfha8j7ce4a/Kramer Tape 2.JPG?dl=0
    [​IMG]
    Virtual Tape Machine 30ips 1/2 "2
    [​IMG] https://www.dropbox.com/s/80wpq4lsvv50dr0/Virtual Tape Machine.JPG?dl=0
    [​IMG]
    Virtual Tape Machine 15IPS 1/2 "2
    [​IMG] https://www.dropbox.com/s/8fcexplpkwcck5t/Virtual Tape Machine 2.JPG?dl=0
    [​IMG]

    Puigtec Curves [Pultec from JJP] Boost / Attenuation
    [​IMG] https://www.dropbox.com/s/ufjt0u4ssk13px4/PuigTec.JPG?dl=0[​IMG]

    Some Simulation of famous console coloration (Saturation and EQ thing, let's see how Q-clone Reacts)
    NLS - Spike [SSL Channel] (Drive at 6)
    [​IMG] https://www.dropbox.com/s/pihvi0pxtqzatc5/NLS Spike.JPG?dl=0
    [​IMG]
    NLS - Mike [I think it's EMI] (Drive at 6)
    [​IMG] https://www.dropbox.com/s/af9w0wdzt4zvg1l/NLS Mike.JPG?dl=0
    [​IMG]
    NLS - Nevo [Probably one Neve model] (Drive at 6)
    [​IMG] https://www.dropbox.com/s/6mfk8uq88f1n6j3/NLS Nevo.JPG?dl=0
    [​IMG]

    Now one of the most popular signature plugins (with everything turned off)

    CLA Drums (Kick, Snare, Toms, OH, Room)
    Kick https://www.dropbox.com/s/h9my34p76o0sa8s/CLA Drums [Kick].JPG?dl=0
    [​IMG]
    Snare https://www.dropbox.com/s/rswq9ss6b50imlc/CLA Drums [Snare].JPG?dl=0
    [​IMG]
    Toms https://www.dropbox.com/s/gss6u17oemds2vy/CLA Drums [Toms].JPG?dl=0
    [​IMG]
    OHs https://www.dropbox.com/s/n62u1v1zmpso1c9/CLA Drums [Overheads].JPG?dl=0
    [​IMG]
    Room https://www.dropbox.com/s/gx6zjqb1ur0ra09/CLA Drums [Rooms].JPG?dl=0
    [​IMG]



    Isn't that so cool? The possibility to understand the curves that each plugin does to a track (even if it does not simulate saturation), you can really understand how everything is working, great tool to learn.

    I hope you can take advantage of this tool that is not widely spoken but for me it is one of the most valuable tools!

    Here I will leave a photo of the signal flow of the plugin so that you can copy in your daw and take the test
    [​IMG]

    The REAPER project
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/h5kza2eh78jsg7k/Q-CLONE Reaper.rar?dl=0

    Good studies!
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2019
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  3. Banz

    Banz Ultrasonic

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    If someone know how to upload jpg photos to show in the post, please, help me! Haha!
    Thanks
     
  4. digitaldragon

    digitaldragon Audiosexual

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    I do copy/paste, but you typically have to reduce the dimensions to something like 800x600 or 1024x768. Can't remember which.
     
  5. korte1975

    korte1975 Rock Star

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    i use this site for jpg sharing.
    http://tinypic.com/
    and pick "direct link for layouts" when done. insert image (next to smiley)
    can do things like this
    [​IMG]
     
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  6. fiction

    fiction Rock Star

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    These pics only show the amplitude frequency response, which is about 20% of the story.
    No phase response/group delay, no linearity measurement, no transient response...
    What you see might look fun but it doesn't say much about what a plugin does to sound.
     
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  7. Hybridstudios

    Hybridstudios Member

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    ive been doing this for years with hardware and plugins
     
  8. DAW

    DAW Kapellmeister

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    Agreed 100% :mates:.
     
  9. Banz

    Banz Ultrasonic

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    Well, I don't think so, 20%? If you compare A/B I really garantee you in 80% of the cases, you'll not be able to judge the difference between them.
    The transient response I can agree with you but honestly, I've been making A/B a lot and the difference is smooth, it depends...

    But if you don't agree, its all good! I'm sharing this because I really see this as a tool that can open your eyes when talking about equalization and how they set some start points.
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2019
  10. Andrew

    Andrew AudioSEX Maestro Staff Member

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    IMHO better save those $49 and run a spectrum on a generated white noise file processed through a plugin of choice if you need just the frequency domain.
    I'm no expert on this, but pretty sure one could write simple JSFX for Reaper that'd do the same thing and more.

    Edit: There actually is a JSFX plugin exactly for that:
    https://geraintluff.github.io/jsfx/#Spectrum Matcher
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2019
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  11. fiction

    fiction Rock Star

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    Indeed EQ is the most obvious influence on sound, well, at least if there are no drastic phase or transient or linearity changes.
    But you know, if this was the whole story, then you could emulate every plugin sound just by EQ'ing and that's definitely not the case.
    An EQ can not even properly rebuild artificially generated harmonics...
     
  12. MaXe

    MaXe Kapellmeister

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    You sound like you don't know there is a sister site in which you can have all goodies with dope hoodies :)
     
  13. Andrew

    Andrew AudioSEX Maestro Staff Member

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    I know that, but it's better to stack up on free and quality plugins. Makes it easier to go legit, better than to relearn the workflow later.
     
  14. Slaking_97

    Slaking_97 Kapellmeister

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    I do this sometimes and i like to use Plugin Doctor by DDMF, you can find it on AZ. It does everything you described above and more: it shows phase changes, dynamics, saturation and even harmonics analysis to show you non-linearities in analog modeled plugins. Really golden program, and has both 32 and 64 bit versions (for 32 and 64 bits plugins). Only downside: it's not a VST, but it's perfect if you want to control this nerdy stuff like i usually do

    https://ddmf.eu/plugindoctor/
     
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  15. metaller

    metaller Rock Star

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    This is exactly what he does here and reveals that Acoustica audio is just selling you digital stuff!
    He uses plugin doctor


    Plugin doctor does more.
     
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  16. Slaking_97

    Slaking_97 Kapellmeister

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    Yeah with plugin doctor, even the free version, you can tell if a plugin is a real analog simulation or a fake like that one. I was impressed when i first run Waves NLS into it, it's a really complex and accurate simulation
     
  17. Banz

    Banz Ultrasonic

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    Hey, dude! Thanks for share this, looks like I'll wave some fun! Lol
    Thanks for comment, I will search more informations about that for sure!
     
  18. Slaking_97

    Slaking_97 Kapellmeister

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    You're welcome, this plugin is pure fun! but be careful, it can make you spend all night watching phases and curves. I say this from experience.
     
  19. Baxter

    Baxter Audiosexual

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  20. SineWave

    SineWave Audiosexual

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    Too much watching, not much listening. That's bad. Learn how to listen. Watching is much easier.
     
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  21. Slaking_97

    Slaking_97 Kapellmeister

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    The thing is that some of us like me for example don't have access to highest quality studios + speakers so that they can hear the difference between a -50db hardware simulation process and the unprocessed signal. I work with headphones for example, not bad headphones but still headphones, because i have no access to neither speakers nor studio. Things like plugin doctor help me to know what i have to pay attention to when i A/B the things.

    P.S.: also i find it someway fun to go and see what my plugins are doing, call me crazy (maybe i am a bit), but i am mad at phase shifting and all that stuff, very scary for meee. And you can't see what phase shifting is in any other way than graphically.

    P.P.S.: aaalso i think that a double check both visually and audibly is the best thing since most of the times there are things ears can't hear, and that could cause you problems later. For example how would you hear a 5 Hz bleeding that needs to be high-passed?

    P.P.P.S: ok i stop it
     
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