Yes those are the descriptions I am taking about .

 

This not the way it's works .
Those who cannot do, cannot teach either .
Is the way it works .
They two separate things .
Understanding the information system, then being able to explain a particular individual based on where they currently at in development.
There many different skills

In my experience the only people that talk like this are people that cannot do 1 % of what I can do in any music area .
I challenge you to any musical contest for which you believe you have the about to demonstrate higher than 1% of the Ability.
Pick any criteria you believe you are the strongest.
We will make a song with said criteria time stamping along the way posting the progress from start to end .

Go ahead and select any criteria please pick what you believe that you are the strongest at .
It can be any criteria.
Theory can be learned very fast?
Yeah right .
Do you even know theory?

Which 4 dominant chords are Subdominant non Diatonic Substitutions in the KEY of F# major?

 

Last edited: Jan 11, 2020

This is great comment .

 

I'll try to explain again.
I believe every human being has the ability to be a music genius .
Because to be a musical genius , only requires the same type of behaviors we do everyday .
Except applying these normal human abilities into a different area .
We have a incredible ability to process patterns and descriptions and combine them together in many ways .
The basics of music is vibrations per second .
It is mathematic relationships at the core of understanding all the way to the most complex aspects of music structure .
Think about a child playing baseball the amount. Of pattern recongition and mathematical calculations the brain is doing ( that we mostly unaware of)
To hit a softball or to catch a softball .
In everyday life we get signal from our body and senses we process that .
For example if you look at tonic Subdominant and dominant categories in the KEY of C .
These are the 3 containers which everything from the most simple to the most complex fit inside of .
Next the interaction of these into chord Progressions song sections is just another level in detail .
Once you understand ( even if you don't. Consciously know like the mathematics your brain calculates to catch a football with the sun light blinding you )
We take it for granted the ordinary things we do .
I'm telling you they are not ordinary at all.
To have a conversation in realtime using a spoken language navigating the symbolic representations in order to select from an infinite variety of choices that what perfectly matches the meaning you wish to communicate all while composing this the way the language is structured .
We do this all whole initially thinking of the abstract topic and hand .
This is not ordinary this whole process
( It just we so used to it it seems mundayne )
This entire course of events happening except dealing with the vibrations per second which our eArs and vibrations our bones detect .
Is all that is required to be a musical genius .
Now, we don't know how many pathways there are for any particular individual to be able to do this with music .
( Imagine creating the music theory with only shapes to use symbolically or colors )
It could be that there are a large number of ways to organize understand and use the strucuture of music how it works .
So it's not important which way you understand the patterns the mathematics .
How you label and describe them.
It's only important that somehow to treat the whole process if dealing with music.
The same you do with your spoken language , or the visual system etc.
However, it's easy to see another aspect of this .
With a spoken language the person hearing you speak needs to understand you.
This means you share the symbolic system you use .music has the same benefits .( Cooperation)
However, ( especially nowadays )
There are paths and lifestyles where it won't matter that nobody understands the exact version of the information system you use for music .
Plenty people make music just on their own .
Or they work with others but have the other parts precomposed .there so many situations where just having your own way of understanding the way music works +( mathematical patterns structures relationships )
When I use the word " music "
I don't mean a series of sounds playing from the speaker overtime .
When I use the word " music "
I mean the exact patterns and relationships expressed through that medium of sounds changing over time . The deeper level ( not the surface level )
I think we really take for granted that the entire time
We are present in our thought process .
Everything we experiance is symbolic not literal.
If you picture your mom in your thoughts right now .
That's not her you are seeing .
It's a representation.
This is what we need to take advantage of to develop high skill with music .
Understanding that
The structure used the same principle
Subdominant function let's say in only 1 key has
A infinite amount of ways to represent it
( All type of unique variations that each have their own sound yet all possible subdom variations for that 1 key always fit together and can swap out with any other . It manifests in the form of chords as and voicings changing or melody with various embellishments happening .
So for us to understand that music is like any other system in that it is a information based system
Is the key to getting this aspect fluent .
( Just like getting good enough to speak English or french fluently )
Yes music is emotional , but so is using a spoken language communicating each other.
Our visual system is emotional.
Just because something is a information based system does not mean it's not emotional.
Why? Because emotions and feelings are a information based system as well.
If you do your best to learn the patterns and relationships nested inside of music itself
( Symbolically call them whatever you want or prefer(
Once you have that down.
Now you have a way to communicate your inner experiance.
( Like we do with spoken language )

 

Last edited: Jan 11, 2020

You have to understand that you have a particular view of things you are calling music theory and music knowledge.
I already clearly expresses I do not see it the way that you do and I described how I see it and what areas are different how it works.
Music theory is the whole structure based on mathematics and patterns relationships grouped together in 1 category dependant on the temperament system.
So it has to do with music itself .
Music knowledge is start from inside the human experiance that once you built of music theory understanding what to do with music theory .
So you have 2 main categories here .
1 reality
Music theory exists here
If there had never existed 1 single human being the 3xact mathematics patterns relationships of 12 equal pie slices is still the same .
It's from realities point of view .
Category 2.
Zooming from reality all the way inside a human perspective or experiance.
( A tiny tiny thing compared to reality itself )

Now music theory is about reality.
Music knowledge is about human experiance.
To build up the understanding of music theory
( Using any symbolic system that works )
Once music theory has a representation inside your mind .now the next step is what to do with it how to use it .
( For example music theory does not contain
Any format of choosing particular things and having them spread out over time in increments of a human time scale .)
We have to take our understanding of music theory
And bring it into our experience of time passing certain rate , cultural attributes etc.
All the ways to use the structure of how music works

So you must have music theory represented in your brain as a prerequisite for music knowledge
( Essentially how to use music theory )
If you don't have music theory in your experiance
( The patterns relationships connections mathematics of say 12 equal pie slices per octave)
You certainly cannot have any knowledge for something absent from your experience..

It's also possible to be at a moment where a person only has a certain percentage of music theory and music knowledge .it is a gradient

 

Last edited: Jan 11, 2020

I do not see a challenge, i see anger. You have not demonstrated anything so far.
I do not waste time writing nonsense on forums and i do not waste time writing songs for nothing. Try your act on Gearslutz, where most professionals gather. You know you will not do that and i do not have to explain to you why, you already know the answer.

 

You see anger? Why so my friend ?
What would I be angry about ?
You said some sentences that have no connection
To the real person typing this right now in any meaningful way.
You don't see a challenge?

Here is one.
Select a song which everyone knows from any genre .
We both do our own versions of it .
Myself I will use what I teach here in the song .
You use whatever it is which prompts enough confidence to say the things you did.
You see we can find out the answer to your idea you spoke of.
We can see I'm real life how your comment match's to reality that's all.
Nothing to be angry about .
You don't make songs for nothing?
That's great news , neither do I.
I'm asking to to create a song for a good reason.
Let's see if what you say is factual or fictional.
That's a good reason right ?
As far as I can tell the dice could fall in any direction .
If you want the challenge to be modified to what you are more comfortable with doing that's fine.
I want you to make the challenge based on what you believe to be your greatest strength.
( Something that could justify your behavior and what your comment spoke of.)
Whatever we need to do to create a challenge which you feel makes your odds of winning as close to 100 percent as possible and then see how it turns out ?

PS since music theory so easy and quick for you
Let's add in the stipulation that we cannot repeat the same thing twice in the song.
It help us stear away from the easiest bits of music theory .
And we can show whether your comment is correct .

 

I see a bit of myself in you, when i was a teen. Good luck on your journey.

 

It would be entertaining and educating to see you and MMJ change a song to each ones liking, why would you not want to do that? Is it to much work to do this simple task?

 

A Belief:
I know a lot about Jazz theories so I can make the most meaningful, complicated and beautiful music that other people without theory knowledge can't.

The Reality:
No, you can't.

Alternative Reality:
If you can, it won't be listenable and most people won't like it.


Sorry MMJ, It is what it is. I don't want to find fault with your belief, they are just the weaknesses of theories.

 

TBH, I'm not waiting for your proof because I firmly believe in the above realities.

 

There's some good points for many there.
Looking at who teaches in the colleges around the USA there is a lot of conflicting information. Pat Metheny, Wynton Marsalis and Victor Wooten have been teaching for decades. They can write and can play. I also look at the time of year. They do post in many places, just not here.
There is also no longer the work there was a decade and more ago. If you worked with the greats they would say much the same thing.
Many 'greats' these days make their money by marketing instructional materials too. They must have found the time to do those.
There are not a lot of greats under 30 these days. It is also unlikely the experience people over that age gained is owned by anyone under 30.
Greatness is also a perception. Some by reputation and some who shy away from it because they are the real greats, they do not need praise or accolades. If you said John McLaughlin I'd say for sure.

 

What an example of utter arrogance

 

Downbeat Magazine used to do the 'Blindfold test'

Seeing the floor is being washed with testosterone, maybe an ear test should do the job.
Put a series of music up and those that want to participate reply by naming the changes and lines being used within two minutes of the post. That way nobody can use audio converters.

As for me, I had to get into a lifeboat because the forum is flooded.

So unnecessary.

 

Advice to all participants: as of this moment starve this fire of oxygen. Do not be the meat for this carnivore. His boasts and self aggrandisement will perish without an audience. He is not here to help anybody but himself and his own sense of bloated ingenuity. Further proof of his total self focus can be found in the fact that his name never appears in any other forum where members ask for help. He has invented his own teaching methods and makes claims that can not be refuted since they are entirely isolated from accepted methodology. He claims his ideas can make anybody a musical genius, but he has not become one himself. And there lies the truth of this charade. It is sad and pitiable really. I have not come across another individual on this site with such delusions.

 

Last edited by a moderator: Jan 11, 2020

We been here before my friend

 

Jesus Crisis... WTF... I didn't expect that. Maybe he was watching a romantic movie and didn't want to break MMJ's heart.

 

To the trolls and posers.
You hide behind your screens yelling Angrily with no integrity .too terrified put your money where your mouth is.
That's a good place for you.
I'm going to start posting music and demonstrations.
I'm going to use my ignore button on the hate speech and ignorant storytelling .
I give you a chance and you blew it .
Decided making the descisions to behave as you have.
I will behave with integrity honor and demonstrate exactly what I can do .
Enjoy your hatespeech behind a screen too cowardly to demonstrate.
It's time to transition to the next phase for me .
I've spent years now creating the music theory threads in information form.
Now it is time for the next level.
Good luck using your anonymity as a crutch to be a coward.
To speak to others to
In a way you don't not in real life.
The behave in a way you wouldn't in real life .
While you do these things .
I am going to transition to demonstrating with music and video the information I have been sharing .
As well as creating premium content for products .

Integrity
Honor
Respect

 

Crisis was trying to be sympathetic and understanding,commendable if you ask me.Posting private conversations on the other hand is pretty low in my opinion.

 

It's interesting to bring up Victor, Pat and Wynton because even though all three are revered for their talent legend has it that two of those people are super cool and one is a close-minded dick. Is that relevant? I don't know. It certainly puts me in the mind that I'd want to hang with the other two.