Vinyl vs. Digital (PCM and others)

Discussion in 'Music' started by martel80, Dec 23, 2016.

  1. DarthFader

    DarthFader Audiosexual

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2014
    Messages:
    883
    Likes Received:
    747
    Location:
    Atlantis
    Good post, @kjfarrell. I enjoyed the challenge of determining whether I'm a 440 Hz or a 432 Hz guy. It was interesting to see how I have been thoroughly indoctrinated to regard A=440 as the industry standard reference tone. I was never 100% comfortable with that but, hey, whomever holds the moolah calls the tune. So, technical DarthFader works with A=440 while musical DarthFader tends to drift towards 432Hz.

    Long story short, each of the A=432 examples sounded "wrong" to me - but I liked them.
     
  2. Andrew

    Andrew AudioSEX Maestro Staff Member

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2011
    Messages:
    1,980
    Likes Received:
    1,180
    Location:
    Between worlds
    Also, there's always NwAvGuy's take on this:
    http://nwavguy.blogspot.com/2011/05/subjective-vs-objective-debate.html
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
    • Interesting Interesting x 1
    • Useful Useful x 1
    • List
  3. kjfarrell

    kjfarrell Platinum Record

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2014
    Messages:
    248
    Likes Received:
    159
    That's the point. It's easy to tell the difference in a normal A/B test because you can hear the pitch difference. It's always going to be an unfair test because our preconceived notions take over as soon as we hear the pitch drop. This test he deliberately changes the keys of the songs so you can't tell the difference. I've found that when I tell people to check this test, it's always the 432 believers that hate this process.

    I neither believe nor disbelieve, I'm on the fence.
     
  4. kjfarrell

    kjfarrell Platinum Record

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2014
    Messages:
    248
    Likes Received:
    159
  5. Immunity

    Immunity Member

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2016
    Messages:
    18
    Likes Received:
    7
    Location:
    Europe
    I have nothing to do with hate nor 432 believers.
    What was the point then in the test if he deliberately changed the keys ?
    Why not play in same key at 440Hz & 432Hz, that would be the real & honest test !

    432 Hz is said to be mathematically consistent with the patterns of the universe.
    It is said that 432 Hz vibrates with the universe’s golden mean PHI and unifies the properties of light, time, space, matter, gravity and magnetism with biology, the DNA code, and consciousness. When our atoms and DNA start to resonate in harmony with the spiralling pattern of nature, our sense of connection to nature is said to be magnified. The number 432 is also reflected in ratios of the sun, Earth, and moon, as well as the precession of the equinoxes, the Great Pyramid of Egypt, Stonehenge, and the Sri Yantra, among many other sacred sites.
    taken from http://www.collective-evolution.com/2013/12/21/heres-why-you-should-convert-your-music-to-432hz/

    Another interesting factor to consider is that the A=432 Hz tuning correlates with the color spectrum and chakra system,
    while the A=440 Hz does not.

    Joseph Goebbels has no musical knowledge as Giuseppe Verdi has, so why then, should 440Hz be more natural than 432Hz ?

    My intention is Not to change your or anyone else's opinion, I'm here to keep mine, & it stays at 432Hz :yes:
     
  6. kjfarrell

    kjfarrell Platinum Record

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2014
    Messages:
    248
    Likes Received:
    159
    If you play them at the same key, 433 is going to be lower. 433hz is lower than 440. So you will always know when a sample is 433 compared to 440 because it's lower in pitch. hz relates to pitch remember.

    So it's never a true test when done like this. I refuse to keep going in circles, I'm not trying to change your mind, and I'm not anti 433. I took the test and failed, which has made me question the validity of that argument. Doesn't mean I'm anti 433, but I believe in the scientific method, and I've observed a discrepency.
     
  7. junh1024

    junh1024 Rock Star

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2011
    Messages:
    1,333
    Likes Received:
    394
    No, 80% are upscaled from CD-ish masters

    Why bother going back to the source? (in fact, most of the sources are around the 44/16 mark too), when you can upscale? There's higher profit margin.

    Scroll right to the BW column.

     
  8. Immunity

    Immunity Member

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2016
    Messages:
    18
    Likes Received:
    7
    Location:
    Europe
    Everybody would fail the test, cause it's not given enough time to feel the -8Hz.
    I know You didn't try to change my mind, take care, & enjoy the christmas :thumbsup:
     
  9. The Teknomage

    The Teknomage Rock Star

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2015
    Messages:
    715
    Likes Received:
    488
    If you were to change all that is 440hz to 432hz without the comparison, most people wouldn't even notice, and if they did, it would not take long for their brain to accustomize to the new sound. The tests are too short for that to happen for most. When I listened I noticed the change, but it wasn't better or worse to me; just different. It's like when you start to play in Eb minor pentatonic. At first it sounds weird and out of tune, but soon your ears and brain get used to it and all is good. Now go back to A or C and it will sound woeful, for a short while, until your ears and brain accustomize again.
     
  10. Sofia 19

    Sofia 19 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2016
    Messages:
    13
    Likes Received:
    13
    daaaaaamn , no wonder you guys arent booked for some Cali or Miami festival or got a billions of youtube likes and Beatport Sales and are still posting @ almost 2017 all these graphs and maths

    go make some music! NOW !

    (...as a friend)
     
    • Funny Funny x 2
    • Like Like x 1
    • List
  11. dragonhill

    dragonhill Guest

    The 432 theory is an interesting topic. I was ready with pen and paper but neither one sounded better or worse to me. As long as the instrument is in tune doesn't seem to matter to me.

    http://www.audioease.com/IR/VenuePages/giza.html
    Apparently the Giza Pyramid's King's Chamber IR resonates to 432.

    I wonder if that rumored Hendrix and Miles Davis healing music collab had 432 in mind?
     
  12. Herr Durr

    Herr Durr Guest

    agree on that.. perhaps the poor guy is having a really bad day... the holidays can be a real bummer for people sometimes..
     
  13. Iggy

    Iggy Rock Star

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2011
    Messages:
    1,080
    Likes Received:
    428
    Actually, I was mainly talking about HD audio outfits that record, mix and master specifically at 96 kHz/24-bit for the audiophile crowd, like HDTracks. A lot of latter-day re-masters are also being done with the HD (streaming, DVD-A, etc.) market in mind.
     
  14. cooper

    cooper Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2015
    Messages:
    67
    Likes Received:
    15
    I went down that rabbit hole once, the more I read the more I called B.S.
    So, what if I decide to play every note except A4?
    Or something like a twelve-tone piece minus A?
    If we're going to discuss tuning, we might as well talk about just intonation vs equal temperament too...

    Some music sounds more interesting in 432, but that's all..

    Guitars (particularly, it might be the case for other stringed instruments, but I have no experience with them..) are never perfectly tuned across the fretboard, and pressure slightly changes every single note, so unless you're playing just a keyboard, or a signal generator, it doesn't make much sense, as it's never going to be perfect...

    *Note: Pantera tuned down their guitars by a few cents... You can bet a few of Dimebag's squeals hit some harmonics from 432 hz..
     
  15. junh1024

    junh1024 Rock Star

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2011
    Messages:
    1,333
    Likes Received:
    394
    Rip CD, convert to 96/24, apply maximizer, export & sell on HDtracks.

    That's "mixing & mastering in 96/24" these days on HDtracks. The studios themselves do this, or pay other studios to.

    https://www.google.co.nz/search?q=HDtracks+scam

    Whole upscaling services exists. "本作品は16bit/44.1kHzのマスター音源をビクタースタジオ FLAIRが有するオリジナル技術『K2HDプロセッシング』"

    We got the 44/16 master and upscaled it using the FLAIR/K2HD system.

    http://mora.jp/package/43000005/VEAHD-11180_F/

    You'll be hard pressed to find genuine 96/24 content.
     
  16. Herr Durr

    Herr Durr Guest

    I gave up on being rich and famous a long time ago.. so I resort to nitty gritty considerations such as this to give my life meaning now...
    demented and sad.. but...keeps ya going at least.. :wink:
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Dislike Dislike x 1
    • List
  17. GangamStyle

    GangamStyle Ultrasonic

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2012
    Messages:
    247
    Likes Received:
    23
    The test was interesting, i ended up guessing them all right just by what sounded most pleasing to my ears.
    Given one of the tests, i'd have to conclude i was picking based on the key more than a perceived difference between 432 and 440.
    I definitely had a strong preference in each set though.
     
  18. Moogerfooger

    Moogerfooger Audiosexual

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2016
    Messages:
    976
    Likes Received:
    542
    Take a joke bruh
     
  19. [​IMG]

    Give it a bit of grit I always say.
     
  20. [​IMG]

    Give it a bit of grit I always say.
     
Loading...
Similar Threads - Vinyl Digital (PCM Forum Date
Preparing A Digital Master For Vinyl Pressing Mixing and Mastering Jan 21, 2021
Modded Technics 1200 plays digital files as well as vinyl! DJ equipment Apr 21, 2016
How to crack freeware lesson? (Izotope Vinyl allow OFFLINE) Software Dec 3, 2020
iZotope re-introduces Vinyl (2020) FREE: New GUI and New Lo-Fi feature Software News Nov 19, 2020
For all Vinyl and Kraftwerk Fans Music Sep 11, 2020
Loading...