LiveLogicLoopsTools

Like I said man, deep breath. You need to go back and see what all was said. I think you'll find very different meanings in what you think was said. I was in Nam 2X. I didn't take it as pressing war discussions on you. You were given a hypothetical. Sorry for what you've been through. I've been there, but I don't discuss it, nor do I wear it on my sleeve. Be proud, bro and Godspeed.

 

Look what's happened/happening in the Syria, Frito. As well as every other revolt against the govt.... NOTHING came of it but dead bodies. And you're implying that being a traitor is doing something in light of the shadow govt???? Come on, now.

 

like i said at the beginning of all this, i still hope we can agree to disagree

it is healthy to discuss things over a beer with friends

 

maybe you are forgetting france in 1787 and a little something i like to call the "american revolution"

 

Nothing gets someone more angry than being told that they're angry when they're not angry. (if that makes sense) Lol

I'm being told other things, which I don't have a prob with, but they stray away from my point which is stated above.

 

Damn Frito.........I could use a beer right now!! I'm buying, you in?

 

I'll get you one too LiveLogicLoopsTools!!

 

I'm not trying to be condescending, but if you can't understand that, then I can't help you. Well, I'll try:

People hit the streets to protest and rebel against the govt which they're oppressed by. The downtrodden people end up fighting and dying to no avail.

Maybe there is a way to overthrow or overturn a govt without violence. However, I still believe that what Edward did, wasn't a way.

 

Beers it is gentlemen.

frito
You answered with exactly what I was about to say (American Revolution)

LiveLogicLoopsTools
Edward simply created a platform in which the veneer has been lifted and we can all see things as they really are and make up our own mind. I choose to fight this injustice because it's only going to get worse. Do you think the government will wake up one day and say: gee we have too much power. Not going to happen. The same way all the ridiculous laws that have been passed are never going to be repealed. I mean there are more laws in America than anyone else can count and with only 5% of the world population we house 1/4th of the amount of prisoners on the entire planet. We also currently spend about half of what every other country combined spends on the military. We either make a stand or be ready to tell our kids where we were when freedom died and explain why we did nothing to stop it.

 

never underestimate the power of ideas, free will, free speech




we know what any totalitarian government fears most.



ideas.


that parasitic infection of free thought that lingers after torture and festers in the hearts of other like minded "thought criminals" that spread the disease from one idealistic host to the next. In as much free will coincides with the aspirations of the doomed, it must be crushed before it is allowed to infect the populace at large.

*sorry but im really high, that sounded like it should be in my next short story


now, lets DRINK!!!!

 

This is turning into a "Why America is shitty" convo. I'm not with it, because I love it here.

 

No it's addressing valid concerns about how we've strayed from the path that better men than I have fought and died for and we have ended up as a mere shadow of our former selves. I mean America was founded by people fleeing religious persecution and now look at us. I'd love to support what America is doing but I find it hard to do that and still look at myself in the mirror. You're talking about America the place, I'm talking about America the idea and I think it's of the utmost importance to have these kinds of conversations. With greater rights comes greater responsibility and it's our responsibility to care what happens there.

 

no doubt!


if i didnt love america, my home, then i wouldnt give a shit!

i protest because i was raised to believe america was the best, the shining beacon for oppressed peoples around the world to look at and know that a better way is possible. the america where anything was possible for anyone to become a success- whether you were black or white, a woman or a man. The America who fought the evil nazis and saved the world. The america whose manufacturing and economy were the strongest in the world.

Every morning we said the pledge of allegiance, and guess what? i still take it seriously. better or for worse.

Even when, later as a child i realized that america was stolen outright from the Native Americans, and built with the blood sweat and tears of slaves, and the american revolution was basically a bunch of rich white guys fighting other rich white guys , even then i held to my core belief that america had evolved from that horrible birth... even though the seeds of globalism were being sown with the WTO and NAFTA, i felt we cpuld reclaim the IDEA of the american dream (nightmare?)


I am still convinced that the land of the free and the home of the brave is not a lost ideal, unlike catalyst, who is ready to burn it all down. (So catalyst and i could debate for hours on that simple point and we would still be friends!!)

Im what you'd call a Super-Patriot.

The America in my heart is the purist ideal we can hope for, that utopia of democracy that actually functions in the best interests of the people and the earth we live on.




the civil right movement really was a consciousness shift that scared the shit out of the Hawks back in my fathers time. It proves ideas CAN matter, and it showed how the government can shoot unarmed college kids for protesting. we were so close to a real revolution there through ideas, but the government did its best to smother it before it could grow.

Ideas are dangerous, none as much as the American Idea..

its like they teach us this shit, then get upset and surprised when we actually remember it and want what we were promised.


If i refuse to believe in the ideal, then i am letting the american dream die

 

Frito
Awesome as usual but I would disagree that I want to burn it all down. I want to see some serious changes being made here and I'm not talking about making marijuana legal changes I mean end the war on drugs, fuck the farce that is the Federal Reserve, stop throwing everyone in jail for ridiculous non-violent crimes, end cash for government (aka lobbying), end surveillance, not waking up to another ridiculous scandal indicative of the disease of corruption eating away at the very fabric of this country, stop shitting on the Constitution kind of change. It's just that one might have a hard time convincing power to let go and I'm not willing to live like this. *no*

 

its true lobbying has deteriorated the integrity of our legislative branches... also campaign donations and eminent domain and ancient aliens and AND AND AND AND


the list goes on and on and on and on and on


oy vey my heads hurts

 

Whew!! That 440 oz beer really did a number on my head. What day is it? I was dreaming that Snowden became a Congressman from a small district in Texas and a group of people tried to visit him at his office because of recent Supreme Court rulings, but he wasn't to be found anywhere. I shouldn't have used that same beer glass for a shot of vodka!!