I don't understand what is being talked about, or what views you are saying that I have or what views you are defending .lol
It seems like Everytime I try to bring clarity to what I am talking about you just tell me that I have a view different than what I actually do.
Then bringing up these names of people I never said anything about and accussing me of something to do with them that I can't figure out lol.
I don't know, I thought maybe my last long comment couldn't have been written any clearer what I'm speaking about but I just get basically
Told my view is different than I articulate.
I'm sorry the massive amount I have written does not sum it up all I can do is quote the last 150 comments I wrote in this thread and repeat myself.
But you are showing you are not interested in what my view is.
Instead , you are interested in what you imagine my view to be . ( Making it up in your thoughts )
I don't think badly about you at all however I believe a critical error was made on your part when you knowing put words in my mouth which I gave never done to you. And then attach names and situations with accusations which never came from me at all.
Lol
I am not having this situation cause me to assume anything about you in any negative way I am just sorry you were not interested in communicating with the actual me that's typing this that's what I thought we were doing.
Sorry if I made some mistakes that led it in this direction , if so I don't know what they are .

 

I'm coming from the direction of the subject of music. ( Ex subject of mathematics, subject of find making)
It's just with music the way we phrase it the same
If you taking about the subject of music you say the one word . Where saying your talking about the subject related to movies you say " film making"
Which implies you mean the entire thing all 120 individual jobs the whole thing.
I'm always coming from the perspective of music as a subject in totally , unless I say in s thread
" For guitar playing, it drumming, mixing, mastering composing,playing the triangle,singing ,trumpet)
I'll identify the individual area , but when I use the word music I mean the whole subject
Like " history" ,"science", " mathematics "
Maybe that helps .
Yes I'm aware someone can play the triangle well in fairly short time ,or sing something ,or play guitar, or be a drummer,
But regarding doing everything in the entire subject of music to there so much it takes a lot of time.
I don't know if that is where things went haywire 9r not , ( that you thought I meant someone couldn't play the harmonica in less than 8 years type thing)

 

lol... i could tell this was going to end up here. MMJ2017's buzzwords, obfuscation and deflection did not deter you, you dared to persist -- now its personal. get ready for more dis-associative 1980's pop psychology.

unless you accept MMJ2017's subjective narrow contrivance of what 'music' is you are (according to MMJ2017's subjective, supremely reductionist [somewhat misguided] stance) objectively wrong. MMJ2017's shows no interest in discussion (i doubt MMJ2017 even read what you had to say), just dissertation. if this is trolling, it shows such a great dedication to the task.

i am interested to see how you will argue against this brick wall of ignorance, at least without having to humor or engage the truncated point of view. pop corn at the ready.

 

Last edited: Apr 29, 2019

So there was naming calling in your comment but not a description of anything .
How do you fit in the convo again ?
Just expressing your freedom of speech with listing adjectives? Classic refix.

 

OP
Thank you for your thread . It was a good time

 

You stated your view quite succinctly when you created a list of rules that bear little or no basis in reality, and I have taken great interest in your view in order to counter it so that others hopefully don't buy into a false narrative and belief system. I completely disagree with your list, have countered your arguement with concrete examples which you haven't, won't or cannot respond to, nor do I believe have you even attempted to reveal at this late date in the thread how you get a musical idea down which by the way is the topic of this thread and not a thesis concerning a nose and a grindstone.

Your last post now talks about "music as a whole" to sidestep actually engaging my comments, and which is totally beside the point from a creation standpoint and the crux of what the OP was asking of the gathered, and not some dry and depressing treatise on a wholly unrelated subject. You confuse apples with oranges by blurting

"Nobody argues that they want a man off the street with a white lab coat but no training doing their surgery . They want a person dedicated to learning for years the way the body actually works. Nobody argues for the town drunk to build bridges to save money, they want one built that will hold up". That blather has absolutely nothing to do with art and resides not at the origin, the crux of what sparks people to to open their open arms to their creative muse. Creating music that can touch others is not brain surgery, architecture or bridge building (although great art has been created by famously alchoholic artists such as my far and away favorite poet Charles Bukowski, painters Mark Rothko, Pablo Picasso, Van Gogh, and a prolific collection of music has of course been written and performed while under the influence of just qbout everything under the sun. Perhaps the town drunk after all is a world renowned architect like Alvar Aalto (spelled like the soft synth)





You advocate for, in the context of which we speak, a musician's, and by extension, any artist's need to study theory for many, many years and to internally intellectualize cold facts before they can be of value and merit. That is exactly what you profer and which is utterly ridiculous in the light of all of the great music made by musicians that don't adhere to your proclamations. Remember your words seemingly written in granite...

It takes 15 years of learning doing everyday to be a pro
It takes 9 years to be knowledgeable and xapabile of doing something valuable.
It takes 5 years of either schooling or self taught to be at a point to create anything amateur level.

The Beatles, The Who, The Clash, Mozart, Eminem, Tupac, just to name a few which you peg by your logic as not pro...hardly. Film? How about Kubrick and Spike Lee, just again two of many. How about Physicists; Fermi, Michio Kaku, Stephan Hawking, so many young geniuses creating in their youthful exuberant early 20's (think; A Beautiful Mind).

It takes 15 years of learning doing everyday to be a pro
It takes 9 years to be knowledgeable and capabile of doing something valuable.
It takes 5 years of either schooling or self taught to be at a point to create anything amateur level.

Like I intoned earlier on, perhaps qualify everything with "In my case..." in order to be transparent and unbiased otherwise you sink in the mire of the nebulous up to your neck in muck, your head covered by a blanket of fog for want of the light of transparency.



Disclaimer: I have WAY too much time on my hands today. I'm going to try to record a song that I wrote recently, that is if the workmen din down their hacking and hammering on the outside of our house.

 

Last edited: Apr 29, 2019

But it doesn't mean everything you write down on the paper is the right answer. The right answer needs pre-pondering before the exam starts and pre-pondering needs time. Making millions of songs does not mean pre-pondering. Making songs just hones the production skills.

 

Will be my last response .
So you honestly believe ( asking to tell the truth here)
That taking a tiny portion of a whole paragraph that was in a very specific context .
And removing that portion from 100 long comments all in the same specific context,
Then just removing this tiny portion and changing it to mean what you decide it means
Is the best way for one to interact with someone ?
Where is the integrity in such a behavior?
( I'm speaking about anyone doing that not someone specific)

 

You took a portion of something out of context ( 100 long comments worth if one specific context )
Then you fabricate some type of alternate point of view ,say that I have this new point of view then argue against that point of view .
That's literally a strawman fallacy .
The bizare thing I continued try to tell you is that these arguments you raise against the alternate point of view, I don't disagree with why do you think since the first comment you made to me I was saying I don't disagree with most of what you arguing against the strawman with .lol

 

Anyway things cannot go smoothly all the time I guess, even if it is nobodies fault .
The reason I post lot of theory information and make point with it , is not because I think that is the most important thing .
That is such a shallow accusation .
I post the theory content and point of view because that what was missing on audiosex , we all try to contribute with what is not there yet.
Of course theory is just one component of music ,
Music( the subject)

 

Okay noobs I think you all need to stop.

This thread has turned into a pointless argument from only a few members writing waaaay too many posts and too many essays no one is going to read.

This thread is no longer healthy because a few of you hijacked the thread and topic and no other member is contributing.

This isn’t the audiosex that we used to once have back in the day. Please take this argument to PM’s.

@MMJ2017 You have to stop double and triple posting. If you have more to say edit your original post don’t post one after the other common forum etiquette.

Please end this thread now no one wins. Take it somewhere else.

 

Yes...yes...massah

(Kneels down and bows , goes to lick the clown shoe but accidentally farts)

 

Which screenplay was this again?
( Rainbow polish for clown shoes?
Or
(Ronald McDonald dumptruck ," trumpin on the Fwatt Erffers spacestation with glass windows controlled by A.I.")

...
I can never get my lines right....

 

Actually, no, I did I hit on a bunch of your points, nothing out of context, and which none you felt a need to address. Also, you still have not felt the need to answer the OP's titled question. And it is not that we have a difference if opinion because your's is not an opinion but rather a road map, a rule that makes no sense, and all of your posts that touch upon your original idea are still propping up air without substance.

But I won't be posting any more as it is a waste if time conversing with you for the reasons so stated. Buona sera.

 

You can make music without knowledge of theory, though it helps a lot. It really comes down to what you consider as music. Even cavemans made rhythms with idiophones without any knowledge of music theory. It necessary doesn't have to be melody or bass line to start with.

 

The biggest problem common among most resistors is that they don't want to know. They start their musical journeys with some well-known styles and try to imitate them and be creative sometimes. All humans are capable but what you can do to a person who doesn't want to learn.

Taking steps in the contemporary-styles region doesn't teach great musical concepts and mentalities to the participants because anything that is related to the contemporary art (originating from the stupid post-modernism) converts the artists to unskilled labours with the production paradigm in their minds not composition.

 

This is a good midi track to learn about chord tones and non-chord tones by way of deconstruction.

https://www.hamienet.com/midi40072_...-Martyrdom-and-Suicide-is-Press-Coverage.html

1. Import MIDI file into separate DAW tracks
2. Delete the non-MIDI tracks
3. Slow the tempo to around 120 BPM
4. Add simple VST like piano and drums
5. Observe the interaction between melody and harmony

 

Last edited: Apr 30, 2019

Thank you for the conversation , peace be with you and let the musical magic flow through both of us :D

 

Something to lighten the mood ( really ties in) topic
But when I first heard this I peed a little haha

 

But @MMJ2017 liking our posts does not mean at all that our traditional long-term cold war on Ja.. has ended. It's immutable and entrenched.