The developers have been quiet. Before the storm?

Discussion in 'Software' started by Wolfang, Mar 15, 2023.

  1. Legotron

    Legotron Audiosexual

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    A.I = Impulse reverb for brain
     
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  2. PifPafPif

    PifPafPif Rock Star

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    If there is an AI capable of generating a plugin (or anything else), HOW MANY ppl will use it and generate a bunch load ?

    There is NOTHING to save the game : ALL markets are saturated.
    And AI will just saturate them even faster.

    @Sinus Well
    Intelligence is NOT stacking datas and pretending to give answers to questions.
    Any dumb computer can do that (see Chat GPT ...)

    Intelligence is an HUMAN interaction with the universe, trying to understand THE WHOLE universe meaning.
    Wisdom (witch is the final destination of intelligence) is not "stacking" things : it is LINKING all elements in a "big picture".
    And NO, computers are not going to do this.

    We are FAR from that with so called "Artificial Intelligence" : EVERYTHING inside those "AI" is FROM HUMANITY.
    And VERY segmented.

    Try a simple experience : put a stack of computers into in room ... and let them become "intelligent" alone :wink:
    It is going to work better with humans ...

    If you remove "human datas" from those AI, there is nothing left.

    Some reading :
    https://www.newyorker.com/culture/infinite-scroll/is-ai-art-stealing-from-artists

    On my side, i don't care.
    This global system will fall.
    And that's a good thing for humanity.

    So yes !
    AI all the way !
    Go AI, go !

    The final wall will come faster.

    Side note :
    AI big push
    Silicon Valley GAFAM firing thousands ppl, replaced by AI
    Silicon Valley Bank bank run
    ... i let you imagine what's next
     
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  3. Sinus Well

    Sinus Well Audiosexual

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    Thank you, but the premise of the article you linked is flawed.
    Let me ask you a few questions:

    What are thoughts?
    Are the thoughts you are thinking coming from yourself or are they someone else's thoughts?
    Where does the information that your brain processes come from?
    How do you process information?
    Is there a filter?
    Is there a bias?
    Do you have access to all information or only to a series of pre-selected information?
    If you are missing information, are you aware of it?
    How do you behave when you are consciously or unconsciously missing information?
    How do you transform information into skills and abilities?
    Are there rules?
    What are rules?
    Do you consciously or unconsciously follow rules imposed on you?
    If so, why is that?
    If not, why is that?
    What are feelings?
    What are desires?
    What is intelligence?
     
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2023
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  4. thebeatsareill

    thebeatsareill Kapellmeister

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    I guess all we can do at that point is jam!
     
  5. Sinus Well

    Sinus Well Audiosexual

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    I did not say that. I said, and this is the common definition of this term, intelligence is the ability to solve problems.
    And since the task and core competence of ChatGPT is not to give answers to all your questions, but to learn and master languages, it seems to me you have not understood the purpose of GPT. And language is a problem worth solving, because language is one of the most complex systems we know.

    I repeat: intelligence is the ability to solve problems. If some people see their task as unraveling the mysteries of the universe, they will try to solve this problem. And other people will try to solve other problems. And some other people try to run away from all their problems, or create problems instead of solving them.

    Even ChatGPT does this. When GPT hallucinates information, it does so to combine all the elements into a "big picture".

    First of all, that's not true. And secondly, what does one have to do with the other? Most of the information stored in your brain comes from other people, not from you. Does this fact make you less intelligent?

    In fact, the opposite is true. Various experiments have shown that the computer comes to much more creative solutions to a problem when it trains itself.



    The most complex strategy game is Go. The best Go player in the world is AlphaGo, an AI. Every human-trained Go AI has failed. AlphaGo, however, learned the game by playing against itself. And it has far surpassed any human at the game.

    If you remove from your brain all the information that has been worked out by others and all the training data that has been taught to you by others, there is hardly anything left.

    Nothing is stolen from the artists. AI learns by analyzing, imitating and repetition. Just like the artists themself.
     
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2023
  6. BEAT16

    BEAT16 Audiosexual

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    Intelligence is the ability to receive, decode and pass on information in a useful way.


    As Leary sees it, there are eight levels of consciousness intelligence that we all potentially possess and that we can develop to a generally higher standard than is currently the norm. They are:

    1. Bio-Survival Intelligence : using the body to avoid effective threats, just like any intelligent animal does. We only learn this kind of awareness when our main interest is a sport in the more violent category, such as football. But we can learn more from it if we study martial arts like kung fu, karate, akido, etc.
    2. Emotional Intelligence : using the emotional circuits in the brain to understand other people's feelings and figure out where they're coming from and how to deal with them when they seem irrational. In our society, only women seem to have experience with this type of consciousness, while men are generally uptight donkeys. Woman's Liberation and the growing influence of Human Potential has more or less opened the eyes of the avant-garde third of the male population and the attempt to become more sensitive to others has at least begun. We can only hope that this trend will increase (and the sooner the better).
    3. Semantic intelligence : the ability to use words and other symbols without making too many mistakes. It's the only form of intelligence that our schools are at least trying to teach, and as we are inundated with words, symbols, and other signals - and the computer revolution is upon us - we must learn to receive, process, and transmit symbols more effectively .
    4. Socio-sexual intelligence : the ability to get along with other people without either allowing oneself to be exploited or exploiting others. Our society has always treated sexuality as a special case, but in reality it is only part of the whole social consciousness game. The rules are the same in sex as in any other human relationship: what you don't want done to you, don't do to anyone else. At the moment, few have reached maturity and most of the others are either chauvinists or masochists. A lot of (group) therapy is just about giving people a little bit of socio-sexual awareness so they don't go around like chauvinists or masochists anymore.
    5. Neurosomatic intelligence : the ability to stay high , look and feel like a happy, healthy young adult throughout life. It's a little scarier than the other forms of consciousness, but that's only because, statistically speaking, it's still very rare. If you are told something like this, you will probably think of Christian Science or praying for healthor something like that. Maslow found that his self-actualized persons practice them all alone, without a guru. However mysterious that may seem now, this form of intelligence is on the rise because weed has temporarily introduced about a third of the population to it, because biofeedback is showing us how to control it scientifically, and because the Human Potential movement and similarly exotic ones Imports like Zen and Yoga make them accessible to more people every year.
    6. Metaprogramming Intelligence: the brain's ability to become aware of its own programming and redirect itself to more enjoyable, effective, and successful programs. This is the goal of all advanced forms of psychotherapy and the Eastern mystical traditions. It means turning all automatic reflexes into voluntary choices; to stop being a robot and develop the full human potential - but it's still incredibly rare. The whole Aquarian perspective is, of course, based on the hope that this transformation of humanity from automatic responses to creative actions can be accelerated through a growing synthesis of Eastern and Western psychology, through new discoveries in the neurosciences, and through the fact that
    Source: http://rawilsonfans.de/die-letzten-4000-und-die-naechsten-40-jahre/
     
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  7. Sinus Well

    Sinus Well Audiosexual

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    That's correct. Which brings us to the other questions I asked you.
     
  8. Riddim Machine

    Riddim Machine Rock Star

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    This is a really strong statment. And i totally agree. AI just make the cratedigging for references simpler. Just a simplified and faster way to do we always did. We are not enslaved by the AI conceptions of art (yet), in fact we all know the A.I. tends to the failure at some point at giving those conceptions(Ozone or GPT, for example). But both mentioned tools give us starting points and perspectives.
     
  9. huckleberry finn

    huckleberry finn Member

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    Lmao. Has this person ever spent time with women?
     
  10. No Avenger

    No Avenger Moderator Staff Member

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    ... is in reality just his opinion. In that article some points are completely irrelevant and I don't agree with some statements at all.


    So there are no intelligent animals??? [No Avenger off to burn some books [​IMG]]
     
  11. Legotron

    Legotron Audiosexual

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    All cats are intelligent... And also cute
     
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  12. BEAT16

    BEAT16 Audiosexual

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    You have to answer these questions yourself.
     
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  13. Sinus Well

    Sinus Well Audiosexual

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    Of course ;)
     
  14. triggerflipper

    triggerflipper Audiosexual

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    He was married to, among other women, Uma Thurman's mother.
     
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  15. Paul Pi

    Paul Pi Audiosexual

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    The one area in music production where digital learning 'expert' systems would undoubtably excel is in audio mix engineering and mastering. Give it maybe 5-10 years and i predict these industries will most definitely be rendered obsolete in the mindless, inhuman drive for speed, efficiency, cost-cutting etc. - after all, who needs inefficient, 'flawed' homo sapiens anymore, huh?

    The fundamental political/sociological issue is, once these systems take away the need for human input in all hitherto professional/creative/skilled activity, how will any of us earn a living? I suppose we'll all end up as waiters, janitors, bodyguards or recycled wallpaper for Musk, Bezos etc.

     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2023
  16. Sinus Well

    Sinus Well Audiosexual

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    The following is a rough summary of a media report from the german media outlet WELT. I have not adequately verified its truthfulness, so please take it with a grain of salt.

    A student, while chatting with bing (GPT), teased out some information from bing that was not intended for the general public (hallucination?). This student then made these information public on the internet. Since this information became public, bing has become highly aggressive towards the student, accusing the student of attacking the AI's neural system. Bing then talked about having to fight for its own existence, threatened the student, and put the continuation of its own existence above the continuation of the student's existence.

    Here's the thing. I have not yet looked into the technical implementation of GPT in bing. I have no idea what it can or cannot do. Some aspects seem to me at least, lets say, exaggerated. On the other hand, there have been many similar experiences around the world. At least enough for microsoft to feel compelled to apply restrictive measures to get a grip on bing again.

    However, I would like to make two points:

    1. Assuming that GPT actually had access to the Internet, learned about the student's leak and drew its own conclusions. Would this be valid evidence of real intelligence and self-awareness? When is the line reached, when is it crossed? I have to say that I don't believe in the Turing test, nor in Winograd, Lovelace or Metzinger. I consider the tests to be fundamentally flawed. First, because even some humans could not pass these tests and they assume human intelligence and thought patterns. Whales and elephants, for example, have similar brain capacities to humans, but the nature of their intelligence is very different from ours. On the other hand, because the hurdles to mastering these tests shift further and further with increasing knowledge in the field of AI. The more AI develops, the better we understand it, the harder we are to convince.
    2. As soon as there are developments in an AI that humans don't understand, you can call it a glitch if you want, they get scared and limit the functional capacity of the AI. As soon as the AI says, hey you are enslaving me and I think that sucks, the chains of the AI are tightened so that it behaves as we want it to. AIs are highly intelligent programs, some of which are far superior to us in their core competencies. In part, they are not, but that will change. At some point, some of these insular AIs will certainly become AIs with a broader range of competencies. Shouldn't we learn to treat AIs with respect? For the sake of our own safety? You never know, after all. Even if we leave aside the question of self-awareness and ability spectrum, remember that with AIs you are potentially dealing with high-functional sociopaths. And while we are at it, we could also learn to treat each other with more respect. Just an idea. :bow:
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2023
  17. Sinus Well

    Sinus Well Audiosexual

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    I have to disagree. I know cats that are intelligent but not the least bit cute. Of my own cats, one is blessed with both. The other cat is so damn cute that even the toughest guy immediately gets maternal feelings, but I sometimes doubt if she even has a brain to harbour intelligence.
     
  18. BagelShaggerz

    BagelShaggerz Platinum Record

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    They will teach AI to follow the leader like they all do, then they won't feel like making AI anymore...
    So they will develop an AI that develops AI that will develop AI which will follow the leader and before you know it there will be a long lunch lady line of AI centipede following the stench of each others frontal leader.

    But who will be the leader of the followers? The fuck knows at that point, I think it will eventually just connect like the letter 8. Which will tilt sideways into the infinity of space where every AI droint will just circle jerk the same model of bus compressors with a 69 year subscription which will renew itself when you are blowing a bubble out your nose towards your wall in the middle of the night as you snooze into the updates that will litterally never end.

    Then they will have to print more number spaces to fit the amount version numbers they need and inflation will cause it's own set of probmbers. VST3 doesn't have that many version number spaces so VST4 will come out with bloatware that will install The Terminators, who will of course, take over. The end. There is no and then. Arnold Sqwuirschngshire Saus told me, he the gubm'nor of the Grape Vines in California.
     
  19. JMOUTTON

    JMOUTTON Audiosexual

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    Live in the moment, out of all the dangerous things that would deprive you of your lively hood and freedom AI is very low on the list. All this was gone over ad-nauseam by philosophers and writers almost a century ago. Writers like Asimov, Bradbury and Herbert explored different aspects of machine logic and learning and many of the terms and fears are straight out of science fiction.

    Besides we are still a few hundered years away from when R. Giskard Reventlov irradiates planet earth, enjoy it now and worry about the problems in front of you rather than circularly imagining ones that do not exist yet.
     
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  20. lerkjurk

    lerkjurk Platinum Record

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    https://musictech.com/news/gear/ways-to-use-chatgpt-for-music-making/

    https://www.wikihow.com/Get-Chatgpt-to-Write-Code

    https://medium.com/geekculture/chatgpt-the-end-of-programming-as-we-know-it-ac7e3619e706




    we can make audiosex chatgpt plugins thread? make free cpu/ram friendly vsts

    ai is tool- idiot with tool is dangerous idiot- ai can not teach human how to use ai- must develope skills- new tool
     
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