it will never cease to amaze me how some people are so good with such limited tools while others have the best tools and still make average or mediocre music it's like if these people were born to be great musicians (makes me doubt if there is a god) it also makes me a little envious to say the least somedays i wonder why i still make music probably becouse i have nothing else to do but yeah all these people wanting uad plugins for example looks like they dont seem to realize that wont make them great musicians listen im not saying the rest of people here have the musical limitations i and others do have or that having these very wanted tools isnt something valuable but it amazes me how some people are so good with so little that's all what do you guys think does talent beat tools? i think so

 

Basically: yes

 

There are those who can play Bach with garbage. I can play Smoke on the water with a rubber band.​

 

So what?

Talent + good tools>Talent + mediocre tools
Lack of talent + good tools>Lack of talent

etc.

The best musicians tend to seek the best instruments and I don't think there is anything wrong with that. Likewise, those of as who were born with less innate talent, haven't had the time or physical ability* to play instruments for decades, we can use tools to help us make better music.

 

Last edited: Oct 2, 2023

Knowledge and experience beat tools. Talent is, at best, a faster way to acquire them. And talent does not beat dedication.

 

This talent thing sounds interesting, where can I download it?

 

I have the impression you mix up music and sound. Composition, arrangement and performance vs performance, recording, mixing and mastering.
Other than that, you can for instance make great orchestral music with a piano, a pencil and some sheets of paper.

 

Agreed, mostly. There is a certain point where you become bottle-necked by your gear, whether it's software or hardware. I don't think that's as common of an issue as many would make it out to be though, not if people are serious enough about making music that they seek out information on what they actually need and then find a way to acquire it, but it is real thing.

 

Normally, I'd have pointed that out, but I ran with where I thought he was coming from, in general.
Mildly related, having run in various circles of music over the years, from Soul to Metal, from Indie to Hip Hop (to whatever,) I think the word "producer/producing," which you left out, is lost to us forever, as it's come to mean everything and nothing now.

 

Folks look for the best tools because in a piss pool of mediocrity when it comes to "tools" these days very little can be called "the best" - only the "least shitty". The best tools aren't going to make a silk purse out of a sows ear (which doesn't require a post thread to figure out) but it will make it much easier to use one great single tool that replaces 10 or so shitty ones.

As far as talent goes, it's quite obvious who has it and who doesn't. No Thing on the planet can change that. I have also found that those who piss and moan trying to criticize and pit one attribute against the other usually has no fucking clue what they are talking about in the first place.

 

Last edited: Oct 3, 2023

IMO taste beat talent and skill.

 

Talent beats tools every day and twice on Sunday. Two words...Elliot Smith.

 

They aren't of the same kind, so incomparable.

 

The truth is that we millionaire artists can afford any gear and our music will always sound better. This bizarre idea that "talent beat tools" is a fairy tale that poor people invented to feel less miserable

goodbye bums

 

Taste is a cultural thing which is more related to the society and era in which a person lives than to the individual himself,

Talent is an innate thing that you are born with,

Skill is also normally associated with a person's effort and knowledge.

A tool is a thing that turns people's ideas into tangible realities.

All of them are like links in a chain and needed to produce the final product.

 

Talent where though? Performance? Composition? Arrangement? Writing? Instrument playing ability?

I've seen guys have crazy talent with hardware samplers, sequencers, and composition but can't play well. And vice versa. Excellent players that can sight read, but can't come up with an original 8 bar pattern to save their life. So idk. There's a lot of variables and exceptions to agree fully in a general sense. And cases where one can become very talented with a given tool, or at using said tool. Take for example mastering engineers. I've seen many that aren't great musicians, but superb engineers. I guess it really depends on specifically what we're talking about. There's an ocean of talent. There's also an ocean of tools. But...Never underestimate the power of one inspired person and a single piece of gear. Seen guys spend years with one board or machine and from then on really grow into amazing musicians as time passed.

But in terms of playing ability, I suppose I can see that. We've all seen talent search shows. But even that, some come back years later and grew or corrected issues. Others well... So kind of true on those cases I guess. I agree with the taste comment. Because I recently played with an extremely proficient metal guitar player and yeah it's great but I'll take a guy that plays with feeling and aims to nail the vibe over Johnny Scalemaster like 85% of the time.

 

Are you talking about composing, "making music"? Like melody, harmony, rhythm etc??
I googled uad plugins. Those are AFAIK mostly tools for mixing/mastering. Very limiting for "music making".

*ok, while I was writing, I can see others are confused too..

 

A lot of wording in here. Not so much of understanding those.

 

Another one of those links in the chain that I mentioned in my previous post is the listeners of music. If the listeners have a low level of apprehension of the music, it will have a destructive effect on the final product of the artist.

The artist makes his music to present it to the listener. No matter how much an artist has a high artistic taste or talent, music listeners can flourish that talent or reduce its effectiveness. Without good listeners, the dormant talents in the artist will not be awakened.

 

The Brian Eno defense... well played