Sonarworks reference plugins, hype or truth?

Discussion in 'Mixing and Mastering' started by Von_Steyr, Oct 11, 2017.

?

Your experiences?

  1. Hype.

    7 vote(s)
    38.9%
  2. Its ok , my mixes didnt improve drastically.

    1 vote(s)
    5.6%
  3. My mixes translate a lot better when i take my headphone mix to my monitors.

    7 vote(s)
    38.9%
  4. I dont know if you`ve heard, but i dont shine shoes any more.

    3 vote(s)
    16.7%
  1. metaller

    metaller Kapellmeister

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    In my own logic, I think It isn't important which signal to play. You can try different signals the result will be the same.

    Now when I delve into this discussion more, I feel this task is nonsense:rofl:
    You have listened to music in your generic headphone for some period of time and your ears are accustomed to, and during mixing, you just need to make your music like others! Now, considering the music consumer equipment, I guess having a flat response is nonsense :woot:
    In other words, the difference between your song and the mixed reference is important, not how they actually sound.
     
  2. digitaldragon

    digitaldragon Audiosexual

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    My take is make the headphones really flat. Your mix will have a much better chance at system translation that way.
    For example me. I've had to retrain my ears to listen a different way. I love hard rock/metal so my eq curve when I listen is scooped mids. Kind of how I like to eq my guitar. So my initial mixes tended to be bass heavy and harsh on the high end. Sounded awesome in my mix room. But translation to other systems was bad. So I've had to do lots of referencing against pro mixes. Bit by bit I'm getting the eqing straight and my mixes now have some depth to them, and a clarity I couldn't achieve before.
    For me calibrating headphones and monitors/room means things which are hidden now (for example the low end sub region) will be more easily heard. My mix decisions should improve with this extra audio information. Frequencies which are boosted, after calibration/treatment should be same volume (flat).
    I'd be wary of using that SM-57 unless you could remove that 6K boost somehow. Eqing maybe but not sure.
    Looking at the curve of the Behringer I just ordered, it looks relatively flat.
     
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  3. spiggy

    spiggy Ultrasonic

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    "The only problem that remains is that should we make the headphone really flat? or there is an ideal frequency response. The consumers use headphones that aren't calibrated! so we should factor them in."

    You should master with the phones (or monitors) as flat as possible, just like Digitaldragon said above. Sure, commercial headphones are going to have their own curve enhancing certain frequencies. So will home stereos, car stereos, etc. The problem is they will all be different. If you mix/master with cans that are not flat you can get it to sound perfect on those headphones, then play back in a car, a small portable boombox, a high end audiophile stereo, and it will sound different on each. The bass may be way over powering, certain frequencies may be too harsh. But if you get something to sound as good as you can on flat headphones it will translate well to any playback source. That's the whole point.
     
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  4. TW

    TW Producer

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    They are by far the best headphones I ever used. To be honest i only have them cause i got them really cheap. I did not expect they would be much better than my loved beyerdynamic dt 880 or the 702. But wow they really sound great. Infact they are the frist headphones I like as much as loudspeakers. They got better (more lows and more defined) bass than the 702. Thats the biggest differnce i would say. And they are analytical but not as sterile as the 702. They are great to work and pleassant enough to just listen to music.
    They got 1 flaw they are really loud. No way you can track with them. They are easily twice as loud as the 702 in a room. But for tracking use my dt 880.
     
  5. Von_Steyr

    Von_Steyr Audiosexual

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    Awesome, i believe you. Will jump to 712 now and sooner or later get the 812 as well.
    They have a new model k872 master reference, closed back though, should be interesting to test them as well.
    http://www.musictech.net/2017/08/akg-k872-review/
     
  6. The_Disturbed

    The_Disturbed Noisemaker

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    Albeit the 702 (non 65th anniversary edition) is a little low on the bass, i've found it to be very precise.
    The curve is flatter than the 712 i believe. Though I do read the 712 has a better soundstage and warmth.

    I'm interested in those 812's too, after i've had these 702 for a few years now.

    Why not save up for the 812 altogether?
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2017
  7. Von_Steyr

    Von_Steyr Audiosexual

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    Next year. :winker:
     
  8. The_Disturbed

    The_Disturbed Noisemaker

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    Where and how? :D

    This thread has made me excited for one of those, and I think I will go for it.
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2017
  9. Von_Steyr

    Von_Steyr Audiosexual

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    Where are you from, Europe, US, South America....?
     
  10. The_Disturbed

    The_Disturbed Noisemaker

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    Europe. I was thinking Thomann.
     
  11. Von_Steyr

    Von_Steyr Audiosexual

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    You can get em for 600 on kleinanzeigen, barely used.
     
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  12. The_Disturbed

    The_Disturbed Noisemaker

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    Very interesting. Thank you! I am however somewhat cautious in buying second hand gear like this. I mean, I am going to keep it for 10 years at least.
     
  13. Von_Steyr

    Von_Steyr Audiosexual

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    Of course, though many have receipts with warranties, some buy them and sell them like after a a few months....
     
  14. The_Disturbed

    The_Disturbed Noisemaker

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    Yeah. I think its more psychological to pay 150€ more for a new version.
     
  15. taskforce

    taskforce Rock Star

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    Irrelevant but i am saving for these https://www.focal.com/headphones/utopia/
    A couple of months ago i gave these a thorough test drive at my country's Focal rep (i still wonder how come we still get to have gear like this around here, as the whole country is falling apart). Literally speaking, i haven't listened to anything better in my life be it headphone or speaker regardless the price. For me, these cans are by far the most revealing acoustic experience one can get in this plain of existence lol. I actually think the price is low (yeah i know wtf) for what i experienced. Highly recommended if you can afford it.
     
  16. Von_Steyr

    Von_Steyr Audiosexual

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    I would rather put 4k into monitors but hey , if you can afford it and it helps you to the next level, sure, why not.
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2017
  17. digitaldragon

    digitaldragon Audiosexual

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    Too rich for my blood, lol. Maybe if my production abilities ever start paying the bills...
     
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  18. The_Disturbed

    The_Disturbed Noisemaker

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    The utopias have non-transferrable warranty it appears, could be an issue when buying second hand.
    They get mixed reviews, but the negative reviews I read are from people who don't use them for mixing, but for listening enjoyment.

    I haven't heard them, and am no expert. Am no millionaire either btw.

    I'm looking at a 4k monitor right now! :D
     
  19. vladdrac

    vladdrac Ultrasonic

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    Hello, I'm testing Morphit and have a few noob questions:

    • I'm worried about clipping when I bypass the plugin, how do you guys avoid that?
    • What's the point of having a built-in limiter if it's going to be bypassed before mixdown?
    • Should I use Hear/Redline Monitor BEFORE or AFTER Morphit? Again, clipping issues?

    Still trying to figure out the ideal workflow for these plugin, appreciate any help!
     
  20. The_Disturbed

    The_Disturbed Noisemaker

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    1. Leave more headroom in faders
    2. Morphit is not used for it's limiting features. Use a separate limiter if you want that.
    3. Initially i would say i think most people say you use the sonarworks/morphit correction before the soundstage correction. However, people on this site are arguing differently.
    I'm trying waves nx with sonarworks after it, and it sounds crazy flat tbh.
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2017
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