Sonarworks and how to use it

Discussion in 'Software' started by Rorer, Oct 12, 2019.

  1. Rorer

    Rorer Kapellmeister

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    First of all, i bought this software with microphone.

    The first stage that people need to know is that you need an standard to keep the microphone on ear level to make the measurements.

    First you need to put everything that you use in your studio on your table or sideways and keep it that way.
    every object in your studio will give reflections to the measurement microphone back to the analyzed data.

    1. Take away your stool/Chair.
    2. Use an Microphone standard/stand on ear hights with your monitors.
    (the studio monitors need to be ear hight too with at least auralex paths to remove the unwanted vibration)
    3. Sit on the ground and move the standard/stand to the position that the software is asking for.
    Keep it linear to the speakers. The software shows bending of the mic. ignore this.

    Tip. If you have a refrigirator or other objects in your room that make sound, disable them.
    Don't use an hammer :)

    I also tested this with an ECM8000 Mic and it works.
    do not forget that every Mic has it's own frequency responce.

    On top of this, i usen an Behringer DEQ2496 to push up the Bass and Hights to get an more HiFi Sound.
    SPDIF (Digital connection) is preferred.

    *Edit
    Also measure the distance (CM/Inch) that the software is asking with an old scool hand meter to get the best results.
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2019
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  3. Rorer

    Rorer Kapellmeister

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    Ok , so let's do SYSTEMWIDE
    On windows it goes like this.

    1. Open Systemwide program.
    2. Play a song so that the system gets activated
    3. Go to Sound Preferences.
    4. You see Playback Tab
    5. Set as default Sonarworks Output.
    Then you have Zero Latency
     
  4. phloopy

    phloopy Audiosexual

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    Thanks Rorer :like:

    I´ve bought the IK ARC system with the mic some time ago, and I just wonder if Sonarworks works better?!? Untill now I´ve used the ARC system for measuring a completely far out room for recording, editing whatever sonic-wise and so far with very poor results.

    IF you´re familiar with the ARC system then could you tell me if Sonarworks works better or just the same as ARC?
    Thanks for sharing your experiences etc with Sonarworks :bow:
     
  5. Rorer

    Rorer Kapellmeister

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    I will not discuss software.
    IK ARC has it's own frequency.
    Sonarworks Also.
    So you need to test it in your own room to be convinced of it.
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2019
  6. phloopy

    phloopy Audiosexual

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    Hi Rorer

    This is not about dicussing sofware as a challenge (what is the best)! I guess (from your reply) you havent tested ARC, and that quite ok.
    Im not a rich person, so testing another piece of expensive measuring software isn´t an option here.

    Cheers
     
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  7. Rorer

    Rorer Kapellmeister

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    I understand. I used alot of Hardware ARC, and i came to the conclusion that Software in a state of 0 Latency is also the best.
    The part that makes "Room Correction" perfect is the fact that there are many measurements.
    For example.
    I use an DEQ2496 with ECM8000 mic.
    Now... This is not perfect.
    Do we do this with software and measure multiple positions.... Then the end result is different.
    What they don't tell you is this.
    Room correction algorythm is alive (it moves)
    Old room correction is like an EQ without movement.
    See it like this
    20H to 40kHz.
    Between the old do just 8 or 16 in the frequency to alter.
    Nowdays it is 20H to 40kHz all the way. So every single frequency will be ananyzed.

    Also i make music in 96kHz 32Bit.
    I bet you are on 44.1 or 48? :)
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2019
  8. tzzsmk

    tzzsmk Rock Star

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    I have a bit different experience, not saying it's better or worse way, but for me it works (for a long time):
    1) leave chair where it is (it's part of the environment anyway)
    2) just grab a mic in hand while standing - if it's decent mic, it will work just fine, make sure to hold it at correct "ear" (when sitting) height
    3) just hold hand forward, so mic isn't close to my body when measuring, always aim mic to middle of my computer screen

    devices which make sound can be a problem - I prefer to spend a bit more time at initial stages to properly setup mic gain and monitor output - the ratio between those two defines signal/noise ratio when measuring, which can partially solve the issue with background noises

    actually I liked ARC 2.5 more (than older Sonarworks 3), because it allows custom-drawn EQ frequency curve targets by user, with use of either Rogue Amoeba Hijack (on MacOS) or Cantabile Lite (Windows) plugin hosting, those let "systemwide" use of ARC (or, if audio interface does provide hardware loopback, Bluecat Patchwork is probably best way to host ARC systemwide),
    recently I decided to give Sonarworks try again, and the Sonarworks Reference 4 is quite decent - I love the ability to adjust phase/latency ratio - it does sound different - I prefer "mixed" balance; and also the entire measurement process is one big show I'd definitely enjoy trolling people with in future
    also about ARC, it was really easy to copy/paste measurements between computers (in situation when more computers or just dualbooting, are using monitors in same room) - I will explore such ability in Sonarworks
    EDIT - I just tested Sonarworks preset import/export - it's easy to locate calibration file for a backup, and when launching Reference on another PC (or system, when dualbooting), it asks for measurement or measured file in the beginning, so very simple

    also since I'm primarily on Mac, there is an additional thing to be careful about on Windows - within Reference audio settings, there is an option to switch (and relaunch whole app) to ASIO mode, which theoretically shall provide better latency (default Windows audio mode introduced about 2x more latency than default MacOS audio mode with very same audio interface at very same buffer settings LOL)
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2019
  9. phloopy

    phloopy Audiosexual

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    I edit mostly in 24/96 and sometimes in 24/192 <---- just for your information.

    I have used the ARC soft with both the mic that comes with it and the Behringer you refer to and the result is about the same.

    It´s time I bite the bullet and start preparing a room for these tasks..... and then make some measuring with what I already have (IK ARC)!!
     
  10. Rorer

    Rorer Kapellmeister

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    It's irrelevent.
    96k with 32bit is the standard nowdays.
    Sonarworks does the job, and i heard it.
    Downsample to 48/16 goes easy.
     
  11. Rorer

    Rorer Kapellmeister

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    Fruity Loops :)
     
  12. phloopy

    phloopy Audiosexual

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    Thanks for your comment @tzzsmk appriciated :like:
     
  13. phloopy

    phloopy Audiosexual

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    Yeah that´s not really a hard task - you can do that with various apps.
     
  14. Rorer

    Rorer Kapellmeister

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  15. ThrashHead

    ThrashHead Newbie

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    Thanks for posting this thread, I have been thinking about buying the sonarworks mic package and wasn't sure what was involved. :wink:
     
  16. Von_Steyr

    Von_Steyr Kapellmeister

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    Mix a song with your tweaks and then you can really tell how much it helped.
    In my opinion, these measurements, if not done by people with proper equipment with lots of experience, can do more damage than good.
    These measurements are supposed to help you build a room and physically correct the problems with quality panels, diffusers, bass traps or a complete studio renovation, we are talking some money here.
    I would never put an EQ curve on the stereo bus and mix with that trough speakers/headphones, that just my personal opinion.
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2019
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  17. Xupito

    Xupito Audiosexual

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    Great explanations, thanks man.
    This really cranked me up :rofl:
     
  18. EAR TO LEARN

    EAR TO LEARN Producer

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    I agree. I'll admit I'm an amateur mixer and I don't know how on earth to use it with headphones...My drum samples all sound terrible while it's on
     
  19. Rorer

    Rorer Kapellmeister

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    Advantages of Recording/Mixing at 32-bit float bit depth over 24-bit

    If you have utilized the maximum bit depth recording capability of your audio interface (such as a soundcard), you will be recording at 24-bits. The digitized signal only has 24-bit resolution; however adding extra 8-bits will provide additional headroom and dynamic range to your digital signal with the following benefits:

    1.) 32-bit audio allows processing of signals above 0dBFS “internally” without clipping in the digital domain. It is because of increased headroom or dynamic range. “Internally” means within your DAW (digital audio workstation software).For example in Cubase manual; it recommends projects to be recorded in 32-bit float format for two obvious reasons:

    a.) Prevent digital distortion and clipping during tracking.
    b.) Cubase internal audio processing is in 32-bit float (like most DAW) and tracking in 32-bit float means that the recorded quality will be intact /untouched (because it is also in 32-bit float). If you are using below 32-bit float, possible audio degradation will occur.

    2.) While you prevent high possibility of clipping with 32-bit float, you have the same signal to noise ratio (SNR) as the 24-bit audio.

    Max SNR = 6 x bit depth used during recording

    So a 16-bit recording has a maximum SNR of 6 x 16= 96dB. Below are the maximum SNR of 24-bit audio and 32-bit float resolution:

    Max SNR of 24-bit = 6 x 24 = 144dB
    Max SNR of 32-bit float = 6 x 24 bits (removing those extra 8 bits) = 144dB.

    https://www.audiorecording.me/32-bi...epth-vs-24-bit-complete-beginner-guide.html/2
     
  20. Rorer

    Rorer Kapellmeister

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    It's an article from 2017

    Room Correction Software - IK Multimedia ARC 2 vs Sonarworks Reference 3 Go Head to Head

    https://www.pro-tools-expert.com/home-page/2015/10/2/arc-2-vs-reference-3
     
  21. Rorer

    Rorer Kapellmeister

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