Real Amp - Amp Modelers

Discussion in 'Rock, Metal' started by metaller, Oct 15, 2018.

?

Which One?

  1. Real Amp (Mesa Dual Rectifier)

    14.1%
  2. Fractal Audio Axe Fx III

    7.1%
  3. Line 6 Helix (Native)

    17.6%
  4. IK Multimedia Amplitube 4

    22.4%
  5. Kazrog Thermionik

    7.1%
  6. Overloud TH3

    20.0%
  7. Native Instruments Guitar Rig 5

    17.6%
  8. Peavey Revalver 4

    3.5%
  9. Studio Devil Amp Modeler Pro

    1.2%
  10. Positive Grid Bias Amp

    12.9%
  11. Line 6 Pod Farm 2

    4.7%
  12. Brainworx Mega Dual

    7.1%
  13. Audified AmpLion Pro

    3.5%
  14. Lepou Lecto

    7.1%
  15. JST toneforge Misha Mansoor

    4.7%
  16. Fortin Nameless Suite Plugin

    10.6%
  17. Fortin NTS

    3.5%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. metaller

    metaller Rock Star

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    @JST
    This is the best answer to you:
    and If you mean 6 people by everyone, everyone has also agreed that they sounds like shit in my post:
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2018
  2. m9cao

    m9cao Producer

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    no, i mean - everything, and everyone
    so did it meaningful to post that vote? even a cheap audio interface below $600 has great DI, built in DSP amp fx and plugins, original mastering console channel
    can you launch a new topic, 'interface built in dsp amp comparison', i believe nobody will use those shit warz plugin again
     
  3. metaller

    metaller Rock Star

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    I used your answer for giving an answer to JST.

    Yes, I agree with you. However, recently Toneforge Misha Mansoor has impressed me with the sound. It is the first time, I have recorded a real track with that, and It sounds good. Not only it sounds good, but the feeling is just like an amp!
    The finger slide sound is one of the things to detect the quality of amps.:guru:
     
  4. JST

    JST Ultrasonic

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    This is one of the most ignorant things I have ever heard.

    Tons of albums are and were recorded with the ampsims that you denigrate. You are unaware of it because musicians are paid to use equipment Live, that they don't record with. Stephen Carpenter of the Deftones used Guitar Rig in his Live rig in 2010, Here's a link, Axe-FX had bought him out by 2013 as they did many touring pros in that time, it's called marketing 101. I Guarantee you Guitar Rig did not pay him. Trent Reznor is also noted for his use of Guitar Rig, again, unpaid endorsement. Please share any other examples that you are aware of. Palmer speaker simulators were very popular. Artists endorse equipment that pays them, not that they necessarily love, and rightly so. It's a part of paying your dues to navigate the marketing BS. Tonewood anyone?

    Now, let me just say that I am going to spend more time with the Misha amp. I did not give it a thorough chance. I was trying it with other simulations and I got frustrated because it was not working out the way I hoped. I was building rigs with Blue Cat's Patchwork so I could try all the amp sims and pedal sims that are not stand alone. I am going to try again. But My first impressions were not good. Are there any combinations of effects and amp sims that you guys recommend. I realize misha is meant to be used alone. I was trying effects through it, and probably not the best combos. Well anyway I tried Helix, so far not that impressed. The interface is kind of ugly, but if you have the hardware it probably translates well. The sliders instead of knobs are probably better for touch screens. I'm sure it sounds great once you dig in, but my first impression is not good, I only played with about ten of the built in presets. I'll have to try POD Farm anyone do a versus, is there a difference in quality?

    I am going to try the other Toneforge Amps also, any opinions?

    I am going to try Blue Cat's Destructor/Axiom, any opinions?

    I will also give Hotone V-stomp a try, any opinions?

    @burket Thanks for sharing the settings. I'll give it a try.
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2018
  5. Guitarmaniac64

    Guitarmaniac64 Platinum Record

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    To be fair there is litterally thousands of stomboxes not to mention rack FX units for those who uses real amps and want to add color to their sound very few choose to just plug in and play.
    I have both ampsims and real amps i use 4CM method (No amps just effect well sometimes i switch to a modeing preamp) and i use modelling when i wanna play at home on low volym
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2018
  6. Guitarmaniac64

    Guitarmaniac64 Platinum Record

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    Is that why Jon (The one who made the video) sold his Kemper?
     
  7. Guitarmaniac64

    Guitarmaniac64 Platinum Record

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    Tonewood exists if you dont hear difference between different kinds of wood in a guitar you are tonedeaf
    To hear it you need to play them unplugged as its all about density in the woods and the microphone in the guitar is there to HELP to amplify that tone period!!

    After reading your post i see that you are the type of guy that fire it up an ampsim play a few notes and if it DONT look good on screen you have already made up your mind a little bit and if the FIRST tone you get dont suite's your needs you have made up your mind a little bit more etc etc.
    Kind of like the ones who search for the perfect Daw and never finds it beacuse they dont take the time to really LEARN how to use it.
    I say you can get good tons out almost everything if you just try.
    With that said i also say that most ampsims sound very similar if you play them thrue the same IR and also turn OFF all crap like delay, exciter, filters and other stuff that vendors have built in by default.

    That is if it can be turned off and even if it cant they still sound pretty similar
    What really made them sound different is their choice of cab emulation and how they approach that topic.

    Nowadays more and more move over to IR (thankfully as i havent heard a convincing modeling cab yet to this day) but even than you tons of option for you sonic experience 4x12 2x12 1x12 10" tons of mics and combination of mics etc etc..

    As for amps there are only about 7 "types" or should i say schematics? of amps and they have been reproduced in 1000,s of new costumes over the years.
    The builders just add a little component here and there or take away a few (like modders mostly do) to make them sound just a little bit (or hugh depending on the listener of course) different.
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2018
  8. JST

    JST Ultrasonic

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    You are ignorant, and influenced by advertising BS. Your pick, your bridge, your frets, your nut, your fingers, and your pickups affect tone. The Wood does not! What evidence do you have, other than marketing BS, were you a catalog junkie? I know where you acquired the myth, so I do understand. I have played guitars made out of many different woods and other materials. So many in fact, that when luthiers talk about their wood selection I cringe, because it's a sure sign that they are trying to rip you off, or they are profoundly ignorant. How does paint and other finishes affect the Sound? How do inlays affect the sound? does flame maple sound better than regular maple? how about birdseye maple? spalted maple? basswood? alder? ebony? ash? rosewood? cocobolo? cedar? koa? mahogany? spruce? metal tops? pick guards? carvings? cutouts? plastic? plexiglass? aluminum? plywood? fiberglass? How does neck material affect the tone? Some woods are more expensive than others, and better looking, I'll give you that. Leo fender designed his guitars with inexpensive wood, because he knew it did not matter. Now, fender tries to convince you that the inexpensive woods were chosen for their magical tone. Sucker! Do you how Brian May made his guitar?
    Red Special Link Link#2 Red Special Too
    I try them all, but they only get a limited time, because I have the best ones, and that is what they are compared too. I have been arguing through this whole thread the very point you are making. In fact, offer up some opinions on your favorite Sims You @Guitarmaniac64.
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2018
  9. Torrao

    Torrao Platinum Record

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    Yeah, there are a lot of weapons in the world if you purposedly want to kill yourself :rofl:

    My point still stands. Also, money is another limiting factor with real stuff. AND you probably get more stuff overtime, after trying things live, having some extra money, or just wanting something new, etc. Having everything at your disposal anytime in the digital domain creates too much of a choice for me. In fact, it's one of the reasons I've never got back to playing 6 strings again. The market is way less diverse with 7 strings and the urge to buy other guitars is much more controlled!

    But to each their own. :bow:
     
  10. Guitarmaniac64

    Guitarmaniac64 Platinum Record

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    I don't listen or watch "MARKETING" stuff i hate capitalism so much that i wanna puke every time see the american flag
    But that also has alot to do with their foreign politics their search for imperialism (New Rome) and their sort of selfemploye role as world police which they dont have a commision to run from the UN
    And lots of other crap that went wrong in that country after WWW2.

    But enough of that

    I get my FACTS from guys that is building guitars and also from trying it out myself

    And from working on guitars myself for many many years
    When i grew up in my little town we didnt have a music store that did setups and stuff to our guitars if it was needed
    And the only music store we had also had very few guitar models but alot of accordions and organs so we had to drooled and dream when we looked at Fender/Gibson catalouge's (they had those for some strange reason but no physical guitars) and also a Fender/Gibson cost so much so very few could afford them

    So instad we had the choice to buy japanese copys with varying quality or a built guitar from the only local guitar builder.

    So whenever i needed something fixed on my guitars before i could do it myself i had to go to my old friend who's happen to be a guitar builder aswell
    He didn't have a bussiness he just build guitars and helped the very few musicians that lived in that town beacuse he also couldnt afford to buy a Gibson/Fender so he decided to try to built one instead and learned the hard way about how to build guitars he was of course a very handy man and also an electrical genius

    I bought a heavily modified guitar from him with 3 dimarzio Paf pickups lots of switches (i think it had atleast 9 miniswitches) and it had a built in dist and it had infinite sustain and this was looong before the sustainer system was released.

    It was done beacuse he replaced the backplate with one he made out of brass and it actually also was the neckplate and instead of screws in the neck he used bolt and a nuts that he put in the neck he connected the electronics to that plate and somehow it made a "loop" thats how the infinite sustain was happening i have seen a similar method for sale recently.

    His "wisdom" words was always it's all in the wood the microphones in the guitars are only their to amplify the sound of the wood
    He also said that if the mic had such a big role as the mic manufacture says (back then it was only two manufactures that made replacement mics DiMarzio and Duncan well Burns had their tri-sonic mics but those was kind of replacement and they didnt offer a zillion versions of them ) i would sound like Sinatra or Pavaroitti if i sing thrue the same mic,s as they use.

    I do everything on my guitars when it comes to "fix them" except from building them from scratch but i gonna do that aswell in a near future i need some more tools like a bandsaw and a plane bench and many more clamps before i can build my first guitars from scratch i have done some "kits" though but thats more like building with Lego than making a guitar from scratch.

    Here is a "hint" WHY do you think EVERY luthier KNOCK on the wood with the EAR against the woodpiece when they choose which piece they want for their build?

    Every bloody piecie of wood sounds a little bit different from eachother even if they are the same size and same type of wood thats a FACT period!!!
    So don't listen to some youtube sensation that wanna have some click bait debate build your own opinion instead and hear is another fact violin builders also search for the perfect TONEWOOD why is that?

    If wood wasn't that important they wood have choose plywood (which can sound very good of course) or any cheap wood that would last long and sound decent unless the buyer is interrested in the look of the wood if it isn't painted.

    Now that aply to guitars aswell another fact is the COMBO of woods used on guitars Les Paul use Mahogny with a maple top it would have sounded a little different if they had choosen a combo of say birch and alder or spruce and poplar etc etc.

    Stradivarus violins is made from a special type of spruce tree that ONLY grow in one place in italy and when hey try to analyze what make those old violins so special they found out this.

    (Dendrochronologists, scientists who study the rings of trees, started with the long-standing assumption that denser rings result in more resonant wood. They proposed that the spruce trees used by Stradivari and other Cremonese luthiers had grown during an unusually cold period between 1645 and 1715. The low temperature caused the trees to grow very slowly, creating dense clusters of rings and a tighter grain, which they suggested led to a better sound.)
    Other analyses also found some metals in the wood like magnesium you can of course be very nerdy about it still anyone must admit that it is strange that pro concerto virtuosos choose those instruments over a newly built one )

    And guitarist do that aswell even on ELECTRIC ones i have met so many players that say their 50,s or 60,s Gibson sounds better than their new ones but the playability might not be on pair.

    So to confirm this topic just go and knock on some wood pieces yourself and to make it more simple choose twovery different typs of wood like alder and mahogny and if you dont hear a difference i suggest EAR-TRAINING classes as you must be tonedeaf

    And as i told in my earlyer post its all about the density in the wood.

    You should really go and visit a luthier at work and TALK to them especially those that has working for MANY MANY years not some young youtube guy that have no knowledge.
    And also a luthier's that play themself and build with thier HANDS not some guy that buy a CNC machine and does the guitar design in a computer cad program and only wanna make some money building cool looking guitars and can barely play 3 chords and dont hear a difference between a single coil and a humbucker and believe me those guys exist
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2018
  11. Xupito

    Xupito Audiosexual

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    OMG LOLLL :rofl:
    :lmao:
     
  12. freefeet12

    freefeet12 Platinum Record

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    American-Flags.jpg
     
  13. Torrao

    Torrao Platinum Record

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    Had to... :rofl:

    [​IMG]
     
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  14. metaller

    metaller Rock Star

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    This is the sickest plugin :woot: ever made, check the video :
     
  15. Torrao

    Torrao Platinum Record

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    Those Fortin plugins sound neat indeed!

    Although I have my share of different plugins and I tend to buy and love Mercuriall stuff, I terribly miss a proper guitar suite that wows me. I had high hopes for Helix Native but I ended up not liking it very much. I think developers realized they get more money out of separate plugins than the typical amp modelling suite, which is sad because it sucks big time workflow-wise.

    I like to swap amps, cabs or FX without changing what's already on, like I would on a hardware unit. Change presets, not having to enable disable plugins or switch tracks to change sounds, etc sucks for me and kills the spontaniety. Let's see who is the next bad boy to shake the ground :)

    At this point I'm seriously considering buying an AMT SS11 preamp and go straight to the interface w/ Ownhammer impulses. I have the Diezel model of the Legend Series and it sounds amazing.
     
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2018
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  16. Moleman

    Moleman Producer

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    the FORTIN NAMELESS SUITE is probably one of the best ever sounding amp sim vst plugins, lately i was so impressed by its sound that i decided to buy it and even picked it up for $69 on last blackfriday sales. Presented to sound "metal", but not only.. just turn down the gain & drive knobs and you obtain amazing rock / crunchy / near clean tones too!
     
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  17. tooloud

    tooloud Guest

    I do the much the same thing. Run my Variax into the Helix Rack direct into my UA Apollo, then mic the signal from my Vox AC30 with an SE Voodoo ribbon mic. Blend the two in Logic. Sweet.
     
  18. Sweet like syrup, thick and gooey till it runs down our chins. I love the Vox thing. I used to be a Mesa man and maybe one day again, but for now....
     
  19. Emptiless

    Emptiless Newbie

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    How about headrush gigboard?
     
  20. Stryves

    Stryves Platinum Record

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    Older thread, lots of new stuff out there. THU, STL has several new simpler amp sims. Gotta start a new 2020 Vote.
     
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