As a geek I've been following this lately. Nothing new to add to what's been said here.
Except perhaps lowering the RAM speed too. This was advised by one the main public researchers of this scandal, Wendell of Level1Techs.
He's featured at least on one of the first videos of this thread, the first MooreLawIsDead's

 

The intel warranty as long as its not a counterfeit chip should stand regardless.

That is called buyer beware. Most folks here (I think) are building their own production machines and ordering parts piecemeal on the net from known good vendors who have the best prices going. These sheister local (or even internet websites) "builders/integrators" only warrantying their work for 6 months doesn't say much for the quality of their designs and/or selection of parts in their builds. Which is why if you want true quality hardware builds you research, and do them yourself. That way you know exactly were all the parts came from and you have OEM warranties for every single part used.

 

On a separate note, I've been surprised the last years with Intel apparently keeping up with AMD.

Because Intel hit a wall with their famous "node process" of 14nm (is kind of the inverse of the density of transistors, thus the lower the better; this number is not equivalent between different manufacturers, mind you). That's the prime material on top of what every chip is built.

AMD and all other big chip makers (Apple, Nvidia and so on) use TSMC (7nm then 5 and now 4nm) and crushed intel with their Zen 3000 and especially 5000 series. Intel was forced to invest an immense amount of money and the 12gen (on Intel 10nm) was surprisingly good. But they lost a lot of money and they sold almost at cost value.

So, apparently, Intel again has hit a wall with their 10nm, and 13th and 14th gen are almost the same but "overclocked from factory" with the motherboard companies being accomplices (or perhaps pressed by Intel?) just to put an screenshot of "4 more FPS in games than AMD".

Now I'm not that surprised. Unfortunately...

 

Last edited: Jul 31, 2024

I have the i7 14700k, which is also affected.

Gigabyte (Aorus) have released a BIOS update with Intel's recommended defaults rather than the motherboard manufacturers defaults, which was part of the problem.

The motherboard manufacturers didn't realise the 14th gen processors are already close to their limit. 14th gen processors are just 13th gen processors pushed harder and repackaged.
A quick dirty trick from Intel to stay competitive in the short term.

With the Intel recommended BIOS settings update it will clock your RAM back down too. So you're not only losing processor speed, you're losing RAM speed too.

It's bad enough the mess with the Performance and efficiency cores. For example, my processor has 8 performance cores, 12 efficiency cores, and with Ableton (up until recently) only using performance cores, and I only use my computer to run Ableton, it means I was reduced to an 8 core PC, with CPU and RAM being underclocked.

I initially had to use a free program called Process Lasso, to set the CPU affinity for Ableton to only use Performance cores when it runs, and to set it to a high power mode when it runs. I still have it running and it works well, more so with Live 12 than Live 11.

Ableton have updated recently to work better with performance and efficiency cores, but gave very little info about it.

Not long ago Intel released their Dynamic Tuning Technology (DTT) application for my motherboard, that also helps with performance and efficiency cores, and manages thermal and power consumption much better too. This is useful because Windows 11 Pro doesn't optimise the usage of P & E cores, and software manufacturers like Ableton are playing catch up.

Intel's recommended defaults update to fix this mess to a degree, but it also increases temperatures, even though it's underclocking, because it messes with fan profiles. So, some adjustments are needed there. Once adjusted, with DTT also applied, and Process Lasso running, my system is much better.

Once Ableton release more info about what they've actually done to utilise P & E cores better I will try without Process Lasso, because their release info was a little vague, and that will deserve it's own thread.

Thankfully, my system is stable now, and I overspecced it to future proof it and it was overkill for music production anyway, so the downclocking etc isn't really a hit for now as I have plenty still in the tank and 64GB RAM.

This is a rare situation where I probably should have gone with a Ryzen, I've always chosen Intel for stability. It's also a side effect of jumping on a new gen processor too early, we're essentially guinea pigs.

Intel should be more vocal about making good because these could still be time bombs, lots of reports of CPU burnouts.

Nice one for creating a thread, I was waiting for this to appear on here, it was only a matter of time!

 

I was doing tests an hour ago and raised my limits to intel's official settings to find out that my i9 14900K is idling at 1.502 Volts for 5.7 Ghz lmao

 

In my country, ordering parts from the net is not an option due to government restrictions and corruption... The only option is to buy from these local stores as we don't have any official selling-points from these companies. All the parts were chosen by me and I do have all the boxes of them (some have five/six-year limited warranty from the manufacturer) but the sellers here never give anything official whether we buy the parts and assemble them by ourselves or choose the parts and let the seller assemble for us or whatever. Even if we fix the RMA problem by explaining to Intel we'd get screwed again with shipping outside the country lol

 

Some extra info maybe helpful preventing further cpu damage (if any): https://www.reddit.com/r/intel/comments/1eebdid/1314th_gen_intel_baseline_can_still_degrade_cpu/

Steps I took (Gigabyte Aorus Pro X WIFI7):
VCore Loadline Calibration: Standard
Internal AC/DC LL: Turbo
Enhanced Multicore Performance: Disabled
P1 Power Limit: 125watt
P2 Power Limit: 125watt
Core Current Limit: 307a
CEP: Disabled
IA Voltage Limit: 1400
P core locked ratio: 57
VCore offset: -0.03

Temps have dropped, so that's nice. Also performance doesn't seem to be impacted at all, running a full Reaper session together with After Effects and Illustrator. If anything, the system actually feels a lot snappier lol.

 

Last edited: Aug 1, 2024

If I had a 13/14th gen, I'd RMA at this point, sell the RMA-CPU as factory sealed/new on eBay and switch to AMD.

 

125 Watts will do 4.6 All P-cores/ 3.9 All E-Cores, still good and will not feel a difference unless you work on heavy orchestral templates like me, you can even decrease the core current limit to 260ish and it won't affect the results at all.
Another preservative setting I did is to disable XMP and lower the DDR5 frequency to 4800 MT/s instead of 6400.
Also, there is a bios setting that let the CPU boost during boot until the OS handles the frequency later and it is raising the voltage to insane levels during boot... better setting it to MAX BATTERY/MAX NON-TURBO instead of MAX TURBO BOOST.

 

No Worries my friend. Intel is releasing a microcode fix soon by Mid-August.

https://www.tomshardware.com/pc-com...s-are-the-root-cause-fix-coming-by-mid-august

Just don't overclock and keep the voltage adjusted. You will be fine.

 

Reddit quote: 'For those who just want to get to the setting on gigabyte boards its in tweaker>advanced voltage settings>cpu/vrm settings>internal vr control>ia voltage limit. I put 1400 for 1.4v though you could do 1300 - 1500 he says. Just to stop the spikes from going too high'

 

I'm waiting for it, but the microcode won't fix the CPU if it's already degraded.

 

Locked the P cores preventing the 6ghz boost (according to this post: https://www.reddit.com/r/intel/s/QR9BwkiLq6)

Cinebench Multi Core test: Temps dropped from 75c to 65, VCore never exceeds 1.35 and score dropped a bit to 31927 pts.

 

Remember i said heads will roll? This isn't good:
https://www.tomshardware.com/pc-com...ction-for-cpu-crashing-and-instability-issues
I was just thinking of a particularly evil scenario: a person gets a new cpu in RMA for their dead one and the new one breaks again lol. Ok it's not funny but when you invest in something that everybody serious said before even it was released it's the equivalent of a fkin oven in a pc case, you gotta be punished somehow for being the fanboy. This though, is far from a punishment but more like a prison sentence. Peeps who bought it are stuck with it. If Intel was truly fair they would fully refund with real money their customers instead of giving them another new -proven faulty- cpu instead. I can very soon see the second hand market flooding with 13th and 14th gen cpus. Or even brand new ones (the ones from RMA).
Cheers

 

What is your CPU cooler?

 

Noctua NH-D15 chromax.black

 

Mine is ASUS ROG RYUJIN III 360 mm noctua fans edition, but temps are quite high... maybe just because ambient temp is near 50s here.

 

Your cpu cooler is top notch. Ambient temps inside a case with good airflow should be around 24-28 Celsius. A case with excellent airflow should sit around 18-23 C depending always on the room temperature. These are of course idle temps. Whatever the case though, you should regard your 50 degrees ambient as unacceptable and investigate it my friend. Especially if your VRMs are overheating, meaning they are above 90 C or near there, your Intel system is slowly on the way to oblivion. VRMs are made to suffer temps as up to 102 C but with good airflow always and since the whole ordeal with Intel cpus is about temps & voltages mainly, you should be cautious. Also, even if they not all of the VRMs overheat but only the ones (or one depending on the mobo) that support the memory do so, still you are heading well to destruction.
Set a positive airflow from the front intake fans to back exhaust and make sure air flows from the front through the mobo to your exhaust(s). Please excuse my crude sketch, it should suffice to show positive airflow correctly.

Use PWM fans if possible so you can control them from the BIOS. Also set a good curve for your cpu cooler from within the bios or the cooler's app to keep the cpu as low as possible. Finding a sweetspot between good thermals and low as possible noise is mandatory, but in the case of the latest Intel cpus i 'd even suffer a little bit more noise if am to be absolutely sure.
I could help further if i saw a pic of your case open and know the mobo & ram you are using.
Cheers

 

Last edited: Aug 2, 2024

Hi my friend, great to hear from you! I'm more than OK and I hope you're too doing great
I don't have much to say on the actual topic regarding the hardware because I'm not affected myself. I tend to always buy a few generations older systems because I don't want to have these problems. What interests me most at the moment, and I read this from the last section of your post, is the poor performance in "modern (mis-)management".

It really hurts a committed person to see how top companies are destroyed by mismanagement. This also happened in my company, so at the beginning of this year I quit my job at a formerly extremely successful company in the financial industry. I just couldn't take it anymore. Now I am self-employed again, this time as a management consultant for smaller entities.

Unfortunately, things seem to be similar at Intel. I have the impression that the top managers of many companies are only interested in the period for which they were elected. Usually 5 years. If the company goes bankrupt after that, they don't care. They want to generate certain numbers e.g. by layoff of workforce within these 5 years that maximize their salaries and incentives. Intel is just one of many cases.
It seems to me that we are back to the communists' five-year plan

A few months ago, I read a book about these conditions at IBM*. It's almost a blueprint for the gradual destruction of corporate America. Disgusting.
I'm glad I no longer have to experience this first-hand

Sorry for the partly off-topic text. I vow to do better

Yessir!
And I don't think the RMA practice will satisfy clients (loyal customers, fanboys, OEM), because they need to pay a $25 fee or have to accept a longer period of outage of PC for Intel to replace their sh*t. With another sh*t as you said
This will not solve the incident. Too much blood in the water.
Photo -> Intel -> No hassel / no CC replacement or unconditional refund should be applied


*) The Decline and Fall of IBM: End of an American Icon? https://a.co/d/dLT4XZp
IBM: The Rise and Fall and Reinvention of a Global Icon (History of Computing) https://a.co/d/a7fXw6d

 

Last edited: Aug 2, 2024

Thanks!
My case has excellent air flow.. I have Lian Li Lancool III case with 3x 140 mm fans as front intake, 1x 140 mm fan as back exhaust and 3x 120 mm fans of my AIO's radiator sitting at the top as exhaust. Maybe it has something to do with the room temp. VRMs and motherboard seem to be at good temp as well as my SSDs, RAM sticks and HDDs (40-44 °C) I'll try to check the pump speed and fan curves as you told me and see what I can do with it.