Hi guys, my usual problem. Import of midi. All the daws automatically assign channels to 128 General Midi instruments and I can hear the midi as it was created. Ableton Live doesn't, the midi is mute. I would like a simple 128 sound general midi library to make ableton behave like all other daw's. A library that if it is not assigned automatically (and it seems strange to me that ableton does not contemplate it) that at least can be found in the instruments voice ... without the need to use additional vst or plugins. What a beard I just have to open and hear a midi I can't waste hours looking for instruments that simply play. ..

 

Try Edirol Hyper Canvas. It's a simple (very tiny) GM2 compatible VSTi (or even DXi)
Very basic sounds - quite reasonable - uses Roland's old soundfonts.
It's still on sister site and astonishingly (given the age) the links are alive.
Also, I'm assuming you're talking about MIDI files that DO have the control codes in them to set up the instruments as intended.

p.s.
If you add Hyper Canvas to the very tiny SaviHost you get a usable stand alone instrument.
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UPDATE-EDIT: VERY SORRY. Looks like my suggestion was a waste of time.
Although just as a fast midi audition device (outside of LIVE) it might still be handy.

I had not previously bothered to read about Live and MIDI, (never been a great fan of Ableton Live)
So, I just read about it and it's dreadful. I don't know if the article below is out of date
but if it's not then that makes LIVE the worst DAW I've ever seen for handling MIDI.
One crucial line from that article says "MIDI clips in Live can only play on a single MIDI channel"
Is that still true in 2021?
If that's still true then that is pathetic and a real bummer for working with MIDI.
It means my suggestion of using a simple GM compatible VST would not be viable.
and yet that would be so trivially easy in almost every other DAW (old or new)

http://blog.ultimateoutsider.com/2015/08/playing-general-midi-files-on-ableton.html

Spoiler: An extract from that article

Live has some unique ways of handling MIDI that present challenges when it comes to working with GM files. Here's a quick rundown of Live's MIDI capabilities and limitations.

• Live can import Type 0 and Type 1 MIDI files, but it can only export Type 0 files (via the Export MIDI Clip feature).
• If you import a Type 0 file into Live, it will only appear as a single MIDI clip on a single Live track, even if the original file contained multiple musical parts intended for different MIDI channels. MIDI clips in Live can only play on a single MIDI channel, meaning that Type 0 files almost never play properly when loaded into Live.
• If you import a Type 1 file, though, Live creates separate MIDI clips on separate tracks for each virtual track in the imported file.

 

Last edited: Feb 6, 2021

https://support.spectrasonics.net/manual/OmnisphereHW/2.5/en/topic/using-sysex-on-windows

 

I'm sorry I don't understand what omnisphere has to do with it?

 

Search for 'Edirol Hyper Canvas' on sister site (sorry can't provide links here)

SaviHost is possibly the tiniest VST host available anywhere
I CAN provide a link to that because it's legitimately free https://www.hermannseib.com/english/savihost.htm

How to use it...
You take a copy of your VSTi's dll file, place it it any directory you want, place a copy of SaviHost (tiny) executable in the same directory, rename it to match the VST dll - and that's it. Launch the renamed SaviHost executable and it will be a standalone wrapper around your VST instrument. Has worked reliably for me with hundreds of VSTi dlls.
Hyper Canvas only renders the midi into audio. To use it to hear midi files you would still need a separate midi file player e.g., see the free VanBasco player at http://www.vanbasco.com
And then you would need to use a virtual midi cable to connect VanBasco player to the Savi-hosted-HyperCanvas renderer.
Sorry, my notes above make it sound more fiddly than it actually is. It's actually simple - and once it's setup it's a very fast midi file auditioning device

If you regard all that as a hassle then you may prefer to explore a free midi player that already includes a soundfont-based midi rendering capability, This one's quite neat...
Find the Soundfont Midi Player on this page http://falcosoft.hu/softwares.html

HyperCanvas would of course work well in LIVE as a GM capable VST instrument, the hassle is how to perusade LIVE to manage MIDI files in a civilised way.

 

Last edited: Feb 6, 2021

HyperCanvas would of course work well in LIVE as a GM capable VST instrument, the hassle is how to perusade LIVE to manage MIDI files in a civilised way.[/QUOTE]

I would just like to figure out once I have Hypercanvas how to set it as default in Ableton every time I import a midi file .... it is really frustrating to see every track of that imported midi but not hear them play

 

if you just want to play and hear the gm midi files quickly then use a gm midi player app or even vlc
https://ourcodeworld.com/articles/read/1170/how-to-play-midi-files-on-the-vlc-media-player-3-0-8

your main problem with ableton is that it filers out some midi data ie #Program changes, sysex .....

even other daws you have to have the midi track go to a gm compatible device or vst,
for example ms gs wavetable synth on windows or Apple General MIDI DLS Sound Bank Synthesizer on mac

as for edirol hyper canvas its been discontinued for years dont think its even 64bit so look for roland sound canvas va

 

they officially warn that some DAW ( Ableton Live, FL Studio ) do not fully support SYSEX ... ( the problem is in the DAW )

 

@omar, I totally agree importing+playing midi in Ableton is a hassle (I mean, it really doesn't work out of the box), but I also think

is an overstatement. I use Ableton and Reaper these days (because they cover different areas..) and none of them works like this. IIRC Studio one asks if you want to assign MIDI to its sampler. So yeah, there has to be a soundsource of some kind..

From your answer I guess that you understand how to assign the imported MIDI data to a GM/GS/XG standard VSTi. And I agree that doing that manually is tedious af. Like stated above SoundCanvas VA or similar should be used.

I don't think Ableton will include any such functionality any time soon and I (usually) don't use it for GM.
I use Resonic player to check MIDI files outside the DAW..

 

That's nice - hadn't seen that before. Price I pay for not having upgraded my old version of VLC for ages

The article I posted in my first reply discusses the issues quite well.
There are several snags in the very limited way that Ableton imports MIDI.
and also that line "MIDI clips in Live can only play on a single MIDI channel"
It seems like the ability to have just one midi clip, containing multi channel midi, routed through just one instance of a GM compatible multi-instrument and using that to hear multiple instruments, is beyond Ableton LIVE.
Would be great if someone contradicted that. Anyone?
And can't immediately see any simple workarounds that would compensate for those flaws.

Agreed on all points - and I wasn't paying attention to the 32-bit incompatibility. Modern Sound Canvas would be better.

 

Last edited: Feb 6, 2021

The best solution I know for Windows Vista and up is loopMIDI to create a virtual MIDI device + Falcosoft's Midi Player (can autostart in background) to receive MIDI data and route it to a VSTi of choice (as Yamaha's S-YXG50).
It is described here: https://veg.by/en/projects/syxg50/comment-page-3/#comment-948

This way you don't have to load anything inside your DAW and can use the synth as a system device from anywhere.
If Ableton Live cannot even use system MIDI devices with GM mapping (?), then I guess it's simply the wrong DAW to do anything with GM.

 

Hyper Canvas also runs on 64x ... you just need JBridge. And at the moment it seems to me the best solution ... set it track by track using MidiYodi first. Thank you Ad Heesive

 

WHAT?!
Cheeky enough to use the MIDI protocol in their product...but not "support" Sysex?
That is so ridiculous and yet another reason why I was always correct in saying that these can't be used by a professional who has been using MIDI since its birth.
Unbelievable.
That's daw 101. Since the beginning of daws.
There is even full support, not that there is any other type!, in grooveboxes from the 90s and keyboard sequencer/samplers.

Needs a daw that works properly, imo.

 

Last edited: Feb 6, 2021

Not an overstatement. Those two are not "all the daws", and in my opinion now don't even factor in the game. The fact that you are agreeing with the op about Live, it's strange to attempt to argue this!
Please read my above post.
Imo this is like selling a burger...although Ableton's burger is only the bap. Is it a burger then?
The thing about being older is one has more experience and knows some things.

 

This is true about Live though, it doesn't do SysEx nor it does do MIDI clock properly, tricky as shit to get external machines going. I've not used MMC/MTC but I'd assume it does not do those neither. For those tricks Cakewalk can, and presumably others. But not Live, no.

 

Hi omar,

Just summarising and throwing a few questions back for you to answer please.

You've adopted the solution of setting up a separate track and clip for each MIDI channel,
which is usually desirable anyway (eventually), it's just a shame that LIVE makes it such a hassle to get there.

After that, I assume (but this is a question) LIVE would be able to set up just a single instance of the GM compatible multi-instrument and route all the separate tracks through that one instance. If it can't do that (i.e., if it requires a separate instrument for each track) then I'm speechless.

Also, I don't know, but I think Ableton's sampler can load soundfonts. True?
Does that mean it 'might be' also able to respond to MIDI control codes to choose instruments from a GM compatible multi-instrument soundfont?
IF that's true could that replace Hyper Canvas?

If true then explore free soundfonts
e,g.,
https://musescore.org/en/handbook/3/soundfonts-and-sfz-files
http://www.schristiancollins.com/generaluser.php

Let us know what you find out
Cheers


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UPDATE-EDIT: brief (tentative) answers to those questions

[1] I found there was a part 2 (and 3,4) to that article I originally posted and, in that article, it suggests that routing all the separate midi tracks to the same multi-instrument instance is OK in LIVE. (would have been crap if it wasn't true)
http://blog.ultimateoutsider.com/2015/08/playing-general-midi-files-on-ableton_23.html

[2] I also very briefly checked out LIVE's Simpler/Sampler
Yes it loads soundfonts
but NO - probably no chance of it behaving like a GM compatible multi instrument

 

Last edited: Feb 7, 2021

Nope, just drop the MIDI file into Logic and it will do the rest for you.
Mulitple tracks all laid out with instruments. Instantly.