Let's find out: Neutron beats human?

Discussion in 'Mixing and Mastering' started by Francesco Cagnetta, Nov 11, 2017.

  1. Francesco Cagnetta

    Francesco Cagnetta Member

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    Hi twohearts,

    First of all thank you for posting, really. I think this generation is the center of a mass cultural change. Art seems to be reduced to a simple form of entertainment end to itself. Music and its contents are devalued to views on Youtube and number of listening on Spotify while artists are able to convey messages that doesn't go beyond their own promotional image. Furthermore I'd also not talk about industry anymore but service.

    I think that A.I. technologies will become a serious threat within ten years for audio professionals passing an additional threshold in this cultural change. That's why i'm interested in exploring the potential of automation processing like Neutron's one.
    Is it time to start worrying about?
     
  2. HoubaZhouby

    HoubaZhouby Noisemaker

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    When the time will come and we will have REAL AI (neutron is not AI per se), that truly can feel the aesthetics in the way humans do, we will have MUCH bigger issues than decline in need for mixing engineers. But I'm pretty sure this won't happen in the next ten years.
     
  3. twoheart

    twoheart Platinum Record

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    Hi
    @Francesco Cagnetta
    It is. Not only will AI change the way music is produced, it will change our life and even death.
    A minute ago I read about military machines with a kind of AI deciding if a person should be killed. The United Nations are discussing the use of "Lethal Autonomous Weapon Systems (LAWS)" atm.
    Even Stephen Hawking & Elon Musk, not the dumbest people on earth, are concerned about usage of AI (http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-30290540).

    But not everything that's called AI is real AI. AI must pass a kind of Turing Test. Even Deep Blue, that defeated the human world champion in the chess game (or Watson winning JJeopardy!) wasn't intelligent by this definition.

    I think there are no real intelligent computers existing atm. But we need to decide where we want to go and how to effectively protect mankind when AI will rise.

    "Be careful what you wish for, it may come true"
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2017 at 5:28 PM
  4. Francesco Cagnetta

    Francesco Cagnetta Member

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    @twoheart What you said about LAWS is very terrifying. Thank you for sharing, i agree with you.
     
  5. metaller

    metaller Kapellmeister

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    It goes without saying that the Neutron is the best mixing tool out there :grooves: Don't forget that you can choose 3*3 option for every instrument and lots of parameters that can be edited by the musician.
    I really love the idea to remove the need of musicians for mix engineers. It will definitely have a huge effect on the music industry because real musicians without that money or gear will be able to compete in the music market. :phunk: Imagine music consumers listen to great music that wasn't competing with the shit music just because of the mix and master.
     
  6. Francesco Cagnetta

    Francesco Cagnetta Member

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    @metaller i agree with you but at the same time i'm worried that real musicians music blends with garbage in an indistinct background noise. How such a situation could be prevented?
     
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  7. tooloud

    tooloud Platinum Record

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    Isn't that exactly what's happening now?
     
  8. Francesco Cagnetta

    Francesco Cagnetta Member

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    Yes, but it would be extremely emphasized.
     
  9. tooloud

    tooloud Platinum Record

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    Like lo-fi Indie duets that couldnt make a song with a hook if a fish was attached to it, compared to Taylor Swift who spends the entire GDP of Nigeria to create video monuments to her own sense of importance?
     
  10. No Avenger

    No Avenger Platinum Record

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    I beg your pardon? What's the sense of such procedure? That would not result in a mix any engineer would do - and explains the bad sounds.
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2017 at 11:13 PM
  11. Francesco Cagnetta

    Francesco Cagnetta Member

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    Hey @No Avenger, thanks for replying!

    For this research I had to put audio professionals and Neutron on the same footing, which means that only Neutron built-in processors and they should have been applied according to the same method. By excluding all variables, what is left is the different intellectual ability to handle audio material. Surely this has affected mix quality but as it was reported in the introduction of the survey quality mix is not the focus.

    Best,
     
  12. No Avenger

    No Avenger Platinum Record

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    ???
    You repeated the obvious and didn't answer my question.
    1.: this is not precise. What is left is the (intellectual?) ability to handle single audiotracks!
    2.: because it's only about the single tracks comparing the whole mix is not legitimate. You should (let us) compare only these single audio tracks then.
    3.: again, what's the purpose of such procedure? Taking off the work to premix every track by for instance automatically inserting a lowcut? But then I have to insert Neutron and configure it in many ways. And after that I have to fine tune every single parameter anyway. So, where's the benefit?
     
  13. dazz

    dazz Ultrasonic

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    i was pretty sceptical of neutron - that was until i grabbed a mix - stuck in my own reference files i use for mixing and that A/B the result with my mix of the song that i know was correct and neutron was so so close i was amazed by it ..
     
  14. freefeet12

    freefeet12 Member

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    Yes, some of it. There still is talent in it though. Even if I don't personally like almost all of it these days, there still are very good musicians, producers, mixing engineers, ect. Many behind the scenes, some in the light. I was speaking in broader terms and of a complete break down of every aspect of music creation as an art form in a brain to interface = music context.

    As a side note, some, not all, of my favorite singers are awful singers, imo, technically. Nivek Ogre from Skinny Puppy, or Chuck Mosley when he was in Faith No More, for example. Still, I'd take them over Houston, Franklin, Sinatra, Carey, Holiday, Wonder, Gaye, Joplin, to name some, any day. It's not like I'm a snob about music. ;)
     
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