Kilohearts - Phase Plant Synthesizer

Discussion in 'Software' started by dirkdiddler, Jul 10, 2019.

?

Is the market saturated with wavetable synths?

  1. yes

    39.3%
  2. no

    39.3%
  3. might be soon...

    21.4%
  1. dirkdiddler

    dirkdiddler Noisemaker

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    ER...MAH...GIRD...must have...about to download the trial for this thing...looks frikkin sweet...
     
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  3. Cav Emp

    Cav Emp Audiosexual

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    Nothing wrong with more wavetable synths if they're good. What is fucked up is charging $200 for a hobbled synth, and forcing customers to basically buy your whole plugin catalog to get a fully function synth as a separate product. Here's a list of what you can't properly use if you buy the $200 version Phase Plant instead of the $350: Bitcrush, Comb Filter, Ensemble, Flanger, Formant Filter, Frequency Shifter, Gate, Haas, Ladder Filter, Phase Distortion, Pitch Shifter, Resonator, Reverser, Ring Mod, Tape Stop, Trance Gate, Transient Shaper.

    And the $170 version doesn't even have the COMPRESSOR, FILTER, REVERB or DISTORTION. Imagine a workhorse synth with no reverb filter or distortion. lmao fuck Kilohearts. The synth should come fully unlocked for $200-250 and you should only have to buy their plugins to use in your DAW.

    I know I sing this song all the time regarding VPS avenger, but they added hundreds of dollars of plugins from their own plugin suites to the FX section of avenger, PLUS third party reverbs and modulation effects from ArtsAcoustic, whom are also making a new analog modeled filter for Avenger. And at full price it's like $220, discounted to about $175 several times a year.
     
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  4. dirkdiddler

    dirkdiddler Noisemaker

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    Good point...i keep forgetting about avenger too shit...and i freaking love Vengeance...
     
  5. Cav Emp

    Cav Emp Audiosexual

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    lol yeah I let the saltiness get the better of me for a minute there. I'm a little bitter about Phase Plant. It looks awesome. I'd buy it if their pricing scheme wasn't so fucked up, but I won't even demo it because I don't want to want it.
     
  6. Lois Lane

    Lois Lane Rock Star

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    It's more a Faceplant at that price.:winker:
     
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  7. Olymoon

    Olymoon Impossible is not a fact. It is an opinion. Staff Member

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    This belongs to software, not to instruments section, as this last one is meant for real instruments.
     
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  8. WeRAllFosterChildren

    WeRAllFosterChildren Producer

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    It's not fucked up - they literally are separate products. Those are just the same snap-in effects that Kilohearts has had on offer for years. It seems like you are just expecting that because the synth can use their hundreds of dollars of existing effects, that they should give them to you with the synth. The synth doesn't become hobbled because they don't give you the rest of their catalog for the same price. They can be used without the synth, and they aren't needed to use the synth.

    If it wasn't fucked up a year ago that they offered like $500 of separate effects, then why is it when they also offer a $200 .synth? Seems pretty similar to how most audio software companies price things. I don't see many who give everything else away just because you bought their latest plug.

    If they advertised Phase Plant as including a frequency shifter, comb filter, etc as part of its capabilities, then I would agree that it was hobbled. But they never imply that the features of the snap-ins are part of the deal. They say that it is able to host them
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2019
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  9. Fudsey Plange

    Fudsey Plange Audiosexual

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    Don't know about this synth, but the kH plugs are absolutely mediocre.
     
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  10. Cav Emp

    Cav Emp Audiosexual

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    What they advertise is that it can do everything under the sun, which is only true if you agree to buy the whole catalog.

    Otherwise it's just a synth with an interesting modular structure and far, far, fewer effects and features than any respectable wavetable synth in its price range. That means it is hobbled. Find me a $170 wavetable synth that doesn't have a compressor, phaser, distortion module and filter, and I'll concede that you have a point. Oh, right, the filter is a separate product lmao. $20 more than that gets you Serum FFS. Or find me a $200 wavetable synth that has just the one basic multimode filter. I have more than a couple wavtable synths, all in the $200 range. Bitcrush, Comb Filter, Flanger, Formant Filter, Haas, Ring Mod... there isn't a single one of them that doesn't have these.

    The value they offer for everything but the all inclusive version is shitty. And frankly, so is the value of the all inclusive version, because the only thing that makes it worth $350 is the fact that the effects can be used outside the synth, which I for one have no interest in.
     
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  11. babuk

    babuk Ultrasonic

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    this synth is a fukin bomb, goodbye serum and other outdated plugins
     
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  12. 23322332

    23322332 Platinum Record

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    The base synth without any effects (like filters, distortion) by itself is one of the best synths on the market. Why - because of the modulation possibilities - 2 types of FM and PM! This is very big, I can't understand how you underestimate this shit - inspect the best Sytrus, FM8 or old workstation with PM synth preset. Phase Plant can do roughly 3 times more complex presets (because of the number of operators) without any need for filters or other types of effects (only Max, PD and Reaktor (maybe also the new Bitwig modular thing) can beat this and they will always use more CPU, if you want the same sound quality, plus will be more complex to learn and use). That's the power of FM/PM, but it's not for noobs - you can find some formulas in online acoustic journals for creating realistic acoustic sounds - way closer to the real thing than typical synth preset - only additive synthesis is more powerful, but it's even more pain in the ass to program. (There is a reason why I mentioned old hardware workstations - some of them had samples used as modulation sources or destination like Phase Plant and the type of sound you naturally would want to program with Phase plant will be somewhat similar - layered semi-organic keys/synth string, semi-real acoustic instruments; sound effects.
    Obliviously Falcon and Halion, and Mpowersynth are more featured as long as you don't need that many operators - I can't see anyone bothering with Phase Plant or any of these at all, if he is after simpler sounds; about wavetables - you can do any theoretical wavetable manipulation in it with modulation; see Phase Plant discord for some tips - yeah, it's easier to have pre-computed functions like in Serum, Massive, Icarus, but it's not something impossible to do.)
     
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  13. Moonlight

    Moonlight Rock Star

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    It doesn't support Multi-sample import as Avenger or Rapid does, no ?

    I would love to see more development in a sampler with a great GUI great Filters , Effects and destructive sample editing
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2019
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  14. Gyro Gearloose

    Gyro Gearloose Rock Star

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    thats a skateboard trick isnt it ?

    -----------------
    kilohearts are very innovative...topdog bundle
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2019
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  15. Kwissbeats

    Kwissbeats Rock Star

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    it is? I like their tapestop, and disperser.
     
  16. Gyro Gearloose

    Gyro Gearloose Rock Star

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    its not a meldabundle fo sho but great
    ----------
    trance gate is loved by many...
    i like the whole bundle...
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    bout price...the work which is in there is much more value as the value of price..we will see if plugin alliance will make it over time....vertigo is gone allready...
    looks a bit like snowball system...if they not aquire new customers en mass per week :dunno:
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    in the meantime i came to the point were i think all who only buy...and use less..not 874 vst
    are much more faster in developing their art...

    for engineers its good to have the warezflood tunnel but for 90% of the artists....nope

    i read it so often...ppl are glad if there are rls-breaks ,where they not every second day install new stuff

    sorry for getting öfftopic
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2019
  17. Firras Al-Zein

    Firras Al-Zein Newbie

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    I am of the opinion that it is only the beginning of the whole I think that there will be more and much better than serum and other wavetables :yes:
     
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  18. Cav Emp

    Cav Emp Audiosexual

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    Yeah, I'm sure the base synth is very very capable. Idk why you'd need 32 oscillators/operators or however many it is but i agree it's nice to not be limited. I dont think its worth 200 dollars though if i have to add my own effects in Live and use m4l to midi trigger the modulations and so on. Cumbersome workflow, completely beats the point of buying a synth whose selling point is its modulation capability.

    Khs snapins are just an expensive version of abletons native plugins. It should be sold as a complete synth - without the ability to use the fx in your daw - for 250 or something. Maybe some percentage of people will buy the whole bundle just to use the synth un-crippled, but i think they're just shooting themselves in the foot by making their first truly standout product unattractive to people who dont want to buy their other products
     
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  19. xbitz

    xbitz Rock Star

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    could somebody make quickly a supersaw pluck with it, would like to compare it with Harmor ...quickly created one, so like this


    please, please, please :)
     
  20. Gyro Gearloose

    Gyro Gearloose Rock Star

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    is cypher also wavetable ?
    could someone pls drop a short list of all worth to mention wavtable synth we have?
     
  21. Rudy Manterie

    Rudy Manterie Producer

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    Market is saturated with wavetable synths. Still a place for aifftable synths though!


    I'll get my coat.
     
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