I'm looking at new music computers - And I don't know lots of stuff

Discussion in 'Computer Hardware' started by Cav Emp, Jun 2, 2016.

  1. Cav Emp

    Cav Emp Audiosexual

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    UPDATE


    Hey guys.

    I'm reading up as much as I can but with anything as complex as computers I'm sure it's easy to get something that looks good but for some reason I could only have known if I were immersed in this stuff all the time, isn't.

    For instance - certain AMD processors claim to be comparable to i5s, i7s, etc. The specs claim speeds of 3.5-3.9 often, but if that's the case, why are they SO much cheaper? this computer claims to have 12 AMD cores at a clock speed of 3.9. Combine that with a 7200rpm 1TB HDD and a 120GB SSD, and how can it possibly be only $500?

    Secondly, my "understanding" of processor speeds/cores. What I've read seems to suggest that more cores = multiples of the clock speed. Correct? So by that logic would, say, a six core 2.9 GHz chip be faster than a quad core 3.4 GHz one? I'm just making up numbers here but you get the point.

    Assuming the above deal is too good to be true, if someone would be kind enough to give me thoughts on a few machines I bookmarked, I'm sure the feedback, and just seeing the observations and evaluations you make, would be invaluable to me.

    Pasting amazon links doesn't work. Lets try....

    door number 1

    door number 2

    door number 3

    :bow:
    Thanks
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2016
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  3. thantrax

    thantrax Audiosexual

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    IMO the 3rd door must stay closed. The 2nd door has too many "NEW" unknown pieces. The 1st one seems to be the best choise (My new pc: i7 6700, 32GB RAM, 240GB SSD, 2TB HDD, nVidia GTX750Ti, EVGA 850W modular). Try to know how many DDR slots (old DDR3 or new and better DDR4) you can use, if you think 16GB could be not enough.
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2016
  4. MNDSTRM

    MNDSTRM Platinum Record

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    First don't get anything in a small form factor, you'll just be restricting yourself in HDD bays and PCI slots, and not to mention noise and cooling issues. I recommend building your own computer (or for 50$ having NCIX build it for you), I built mine in a Fractal R5 case with Noctua fans, during sessions I cant even get a squeak of noise out of it.

    Clock speed and core count. It depends on the workload - whether its parallel processing or serial.

    Lets assume we're comparing a dual core to a single core
    Lets say A=2 B=3 C=4
    If a computer were to calculate D=A+B and E=B+C, this would be a parallel work load, meaning that both calculations could happen at the same time since they're independent, therefore a dual core would be better.

    If a computer were to calculate D=A+B E=D+C, this would be a serial workload because you cant calculate E until D has been calculated, so a single but faster core would be better.

    Audio kind of falls in the second example because the calculation done for the compressor plugin is dependent on the result of the calculation for the EQ before it so both plugins have to processed on the same core, however, each track is independent so your kick channel and snare can fall on different cores, but when you make a drum buss, they become dependent again.

    So my recommendation is a balance of core count and clock speed a good place is 4+ cores with clock speeds 3.5gHz or higher.
     
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  5. Aliens

    Aliens Guest

    I'd definitely pick the first choice.
    Good and solid performing i7 chip, nice ssd system and big content drives and enough ram to chug along nicely, but mainly because it's red and would look lovely next to my scarlett audio box lol

    I'd run, or get the shop to install and run latency mon on it if you can, for peace of mind you won't buy an issues machine.
     
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  6. Pereira

    Pereira Producer

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    Intel Xeon and quadro graphics are not a good solution for audio...as thantrax says let the doors 2 and 3 closed.
    About no. 1, remember that it's always a great thing to know who's single parts producer, expecially HDs and mainboards. If you wont a long life PC, ASUS for Mobo, Samsung for SSD, WD Kaviar Black for HD, are great options. Take care also of power supply, I don't see anything inside tech description about it; Seasonic and Corsair are great solutions, the first one can be only 550 W (they are really effective), if not nothing less than 600.
    HP rarely fits good parts.
    Suggestion...take a look into Dell internet shop, they have good and cheap solutions.
    Win10........? mmmmmmmmh
     
  7. E.C.R

    E.C.R Platinum Record

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    get someone to build it for you ,select your own specs....and it will probably end up either cheaper or better specs for same price...
     
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  8. NicoDPS

    NicoDPS Platinum Record

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    I think that you should build your own PC (or more likely have someone build it for you) so you'll be able to choose the components you want.
    I would say: a good core-I7, at least 16 GB RAM , a fast SSD (240 or more Gb) , and like MYCbeats wrote, a Fractal R5 case with Noctua fans, I've the same and silence is priceless in the studio...
    About the HDD and the graphic card it's up to you, if you plan to work with video, or playing recent games you'll need a good graphic card (I always buy nvidia for my part) and I wouldn't take less than a 2TB HDD (7200 rpm) except if you have some big storage external HDD, of course...
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2016
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  9. webhead

    webhead Audiosexual

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    It's cheap because it's not actually 12 cores. 4 CPU + 8 GPU, means 8 cores are for graphics. So there's no graphic card, you don't need it. You can play even GTA V without a graphic card. If you're looking for a cheap game computer, that's what you need. For music production, it's better to focus on CPU and RAM.

    If you choose the AMD side, I suggest at least FX 6300 as your cpu. 8300 and 8350 are other alternatives.
     
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  10. Cav Emp

    Cav Emp Audiosexual

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    Would be nice but I got my computer secondhand... for free (from a friend) and my thinking was, it's time to get a machine whose parts I know won't crap out on me any time soon. Current PC is starting to really slow down and really there's no good reason for it. I baby that thing, keep the smallest possible amount of stuff on it, only go online for plugin activations, etc.

    Plus I'll want to keep my current PC functional, at least for a while, out of fear of losing stuff. When it comes to projects I've dumped dozens, hundreds of hours into, I have kind of a pathological unwillingness to just believe that transferring it from one computer to the other will work the way it's supposed to.

    sneaky sneaky. Thank you sir

    agreed. I could probably get away with 1TB because I mostly use synths rather than sampler libs, but right now I use two 1TB external drives, but they're 5400rpm. So, will be looking to upgrade there.

    the suggestion of many... I guess I'll have a look at building, or paying someone to build it. But if it proves too much to-do I suppose I'll go with option number one.

    I really appreciate all the input, guys. I'm just so ignorant of this stuff. I only started taking an interest in having a powerful computer like a year ago and haven't bothered to do much research till now, so it's all new to me.
     
  11. Cav Emp

    Cav Emp Audiosexual

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    Would anyone be kind enough to opine on whether there's anything wrong with a computer like this? If I were to throw an SSD in with it? Really my only hangup about gaming computers is that I'd be spending some extra money on a GPU I don't necessarily need or want.

    So far I'm leaning toward the $800 CUK computer that everyone recommended but if AMD is truly comparable to Intel then it doesn't make much sense to not get more juice for less money.

    I did some looking into building a computer and, aside from the fact that there are so many parts that I'm just woefully uneducated about, I always end up going over my budget when I pick them out part-by-part. I suppose the parts I'm choosing must be nicer than what I'd be getting with a pre-assembled machine, but Just by selecting, say, a quad core i7, a small SSD and a 1 or 2 TB 7200 rpm HDD it's nearly impossible to fit the rest of a computer into my budget which is about $800-850 max
     
  12. Dread_J

    Dread_J Kapellmeister

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    NEVER buy a computer like those, build it yourself !!
     
  13. muciones

    muciones Kapellmeister

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    The most important thing is to be a quad core with at least 16 Gb ram and the second important thing is to be dead silent. Choose dead silent fans, video card that don't use fans so much, there are plenty. HDD's must have low db as well.
    You don't need any extra sounds in your room coming from case.
     
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  14. Cav Emp

    Cav Emp Audiosexual

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    Okay that's good to know. Can't thank you enough for all the help you've given here. I tried to pursue your suggestions about the Phenom but it doesn't look like there are any machines that come with it. Shame. Maybe I could get a cheaper computer and put it in.
    Edit - as an addendum. Questions like: is AMD really as good as Intel, is the kind of thing where having peers like you and the others in here is a hell of a resource. If I googled that topic I could read bullshit after bullshit article for a week before I found any kind of consensus of opinions among knowledgeable people

    @Dread_J Building from scratch or replacing parts seems like a great idea, but you have to consider that there are people like me that know very little about computer hardware. At this point, with my current machine declining noticeably, the 100-200 dollars, or whatever that I would save by building a computer is simply not worth the time investment for learning yet another new skill and going down another rabbit hole when I'm already spending so much time learning things that are more important to me
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2016
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  15. NicoDPS

    NicoDPS Platinum Record

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    For my part I've some bad memories about AMD, now I only buy intel.

    About the cyberpower bla bla, those flashy blue lights creeps me badly. ^^
    If I read well there's no USB 3.0, so I guess that the motherboard is pretty old...

    With 800$ I'm not sure that you can have the Core-i7 with 16 GB ram, the SSD and the silent box. :/
     
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  16. Zenarcist

    Zenarcist Audiosexual

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    For the case you need something like a noise-dampened Fractal Design Define R4 and large slow-moving fans.

    http://www.fractal-design.com/home/product/cases/define-series/define-r4-black-pearl


    This company is a respected builder of music production PC's - have a look at what components they use to give you some idea, as they will have tested all of their systems for audio use. Then go and build your own :wink:

    https://www.scan.co.uk/3xs/configurator/3xs-tz170-computer-music-pc
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2016
  17. audioplg

    audioplg Ultrasonic

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    use this as a guide to cpu performance in a daw
    [​IMG]
     
  18. Zenarcist

    Zenarcist Audiosexual

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    BTW there are new Broadwell-E CPU's on the market.
     
  19. junh1024

    junh1024 Rock Star

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    More cores != more faster. Use http://cpuboss.com/ to compare.
     
  20. nastybobby

    nastybobby Kapellmeister

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    @Cav Emp

    You can save yourself quite a lot of cash by building your own. Plus you can specify just what components you use, you aren't reliant on another company's components and them possibly cutting corners. I've just completed an i7 build and I couldn't be happier with it. I reckon I've probably saved around a third of the cost of a similar machine bought already built.

    It's really very straightforward to put together a PC and if you can use a screwdriver and know how to install Windows then there really isn't anything stopping you. Once I'd bought all the parts and organised myself I had it built and up and running in a couple of hours. You also have the satisfaction of knowing you've built it and through the choice of components and some tweaking you can ensure it's optimised for audio production.

    I found this site to be really useful, both in terms of pricing and ensuring you haven't made a mistake and chosen something that is incompatible. You could also look at the completed builds by users of the site as a basis for your own:

    https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/

    [I'm in the UK, so the site obviously defaults to that territory for the online suppliers it uses.]

    Feel free to ask me any questions you may have if you decide to build your own. There'll be lots of contributors with a huge wealth of experience in building PC's on this site. I think this is the fourth or fifth PC I've built since the late 90's and I've put together a couple of desktop machines for friends/colleagues and family members as well. Actually, If I were you and you do build your own, I'd keep the fact that you can build/repair PC's to yourself. I seem to have become both my place of work and my extended family's PC help desk over the last few years.
     
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  21. One Reason

    One Reason Audiosexual

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    Id save a bit longer.. and open up ur choices so much more.. So glad I did..

    I ended up saving for a while and throwing down about 2200 but my GOD how much happier I am than my previous 800 dollar turdbag.
     
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