Of course, listening fatigue/volume creep/hearing damage. On the final mix, you have 2 choices: do it at the same volume/system similar to your target system, or guess.

Are typically the tools used for mixing, but with different presets and/or UI. Sell the same plug twice

P.S. The whole "Mastering Engineer" thing is a pretty recent development, mixing (& mastering) was typically done by the same guy, called the sound tech or producer.

"Mastering engineer" was the guy who ran the cutting lathe.

 

Last edited: Mar 31, 2018

If you mix at high volume when you turn down the song elements start to disappear or would sound different then intended. Mixing at low volume and then adjusting at higher volume is a much safer more time efficient way.

Please tell me you don't use "presets" when mixing? It seems the tools used for mastering are as vague as the concept of mastering here. I'm having some difficulty connecting in this conversation because unless you understand some basics about mix and master then the terms and tools will not make sense it seems.

 

???

When you're done, you don't turn down. You shut off the lights & go home.

Why would I lie to you? Like most people, I start with a preset & take it from there.

Ditto. Either define what "tools more focused for mastering" are & explain how they differ from "tools [less?] focused for mastering," or we're not gonna go places :|

 

Why confused? If you mixed at high volume and lower the volume knob, the mix usually sounds different? Try it maybe?

Apparently you don't check your mixes at different volumes?

A bit presumptuous since I've never met a mix engineer who used a preset.

I can't shoot off the specific EQ's I've seen in Bernie Grundman's mastering facility but I know they cost about 500,000 and can make more precise fine tuned adjustments then standard EQ's. For my rough mixes which have sufficed for broadcast quality I use plugins, but even the

I'm trying to think of ways to explain better, I wish I could help more friend.. All I know is that I shat all over my own mixes for years until one day everything just started to make sense.

 

What lead you to that conclusion? Hopefully not the fact that I listen to my final mix at the volume I expect it to be played, while you don't ("I wouldn't mix at high volumes because loudness can deceive")?

You should get out more? The initial state of any VST, opened for the first time, is a preset. Typically called the default preset. But you probably code up a fresh bespoke plug for every ditty you master, because presets are for plebes.

Half a million ...dollars? You know the word gullible can't be found in any dictionary, right?

But only when patched with $500,000 cables, cryogenically treated by Himalayan monks. Only then can they make those much-needed .0003dB cuts

Sure. As you mentioned, "mastering" isn't just about EQ & compression. Any other mastering-specific tools I should lrn about?

 

Last edited: Mar 31, 2018

What led me was that you said you do a quick mix and then turn shit off and go home no? I hope your other conversations go smoother then this because you might need to focus less on mixing and more on communication.

Wow did you really just call Bernie Grundman "gullible"? I only know the prices because I tried to look them up once thinking I could plop down and buy one.

If your EQ or compressor opens with a preset you should throw it in the garbage.. so your friends all use presets when mixing, who is everyone? Well keep believing, all I know what has been reinforced by the industry I've worked in for the past 10 years so what do I know...

 

So what? So can a mix engineer.

And isn't it interesting how everyone in this thread has wildly differing opinions on what mastering is and what it's for? we can all define mixing, we can all define recording or a guitar setup and agree on it, but the fact that no one seems to agree on what mastering is for, or what it does... tells you a lot about the nature of this process.

 

No.
To communicate, we must not isolate a random phrase & extrapolate, but rely on the wonderful thing called context. That being

No, don't know Bernie. I called you gullible, because the alternative would have been... let's just say I chose to err on the side of politeness. Now I'm not saying that Bernie didn't pay half a million dollars for an EQ -- people do weird shit/cheat on their taxes (it's a business expense, much like my mixology consultant, Mr. Cat Puss-Meowington), but how about you tell me the make & mdel of that EQ, for starters?

While clearly subpar to Bernie's half-million dollar EQ, it'll do for the time being. But first $500,000 I get & don't know what to do with? I'll buy me a proper EQ. Like Bernie

 

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What gave you this idea mate?
There's those who dabble between speculation and assumption and those who do this thing for a living.
This is the internet, everybody can be prime minister in their own parliament, hence everyone gets to speak their mind. If you read this (or other threads about the same subject) and cannot decide who's "in" and who's "out" there are too many official both introductory and advanced guides to consult upon.
Cheers

 

I'm gullible for thinking a real mastering equipment costs a lot of money? Do you even hardware bro?? I make a living from what I'm talking about, and am getting paid as I write this so please tell me more about how ridiculous my ideas are?

 

That documentation of how a recorded was created way back in the day was fascinating to me. So many hands touched it on its way during the process, so much care taken that it be a quality product when it reached its final destination. Thanks, it quite a trip.

 

Then naming the make & model of Bernie's half-million-dollar EQ shouldn't be a problem. I'll be here.

Who's paying you, and to what end?

 

Awesome, I guess you just proved that I don't know what I'm talking about? Are we still talking about mastering concepts or did I get sucked into your toxic need to prove you're right? Sorry dood, was just trying to help

 

@superliquidsunshine, my pleasure. If you like that sort stuff, search YT for other mastering vids -- there's a bunch, from 20s to the present (still operating). There's even people cutting (well, ̶g̶r̶a̶v̶i̶n̶g̶ embossing mostly) records as a hobby -- in polycarbonate/CD blanks -- for fun & profit

How could you not love the guy? He's into restoring/collecting vintage styluses, as specialized as an aardvark.

Not with mathematical rigor but pretty much, yeah.
Now, who's paying you to post, and why?

 

Last edited: Mar 31, 2018

Ok then.... fair enough.. ?

Not paying me to post, I'm actually mixing down a music project using all of the insight I don't have.

All the best!

 

thats what i love about what we do in this Biz >>> constant learning curve... \m/

 

This thread has been taken over by the amateurs and want to be's. Keep in mind. almost all music that is mass produced has been mastered. All the music you hear on mainstream radio is mastered.

If you want to make money with your music and you hit it big your music will be mastered. All music released on major labels is mastered.

Why would anybody spend all the hard work of writing songs, recording and producing then not do the final step?

If you have never seen a project through completion your comments here have no importance. Everything I have had mastered came back better.

KEEP THE PRO IN PRO AUDIO!

 

Problem is that even professional mastering engineers can't seem to agree on a definition for the process, and why us peasants can't do it. They're always saying different things. Maybe they're afraid that giving mastering an actual objective definition would take all the mystique out of it, and cause mixing engineers to do the "mastering" themselves rather than pay someone else.

Oh, of course we'll do the final step. We'll just do it ourselves, while being in full control of the sound we want and not paying unnecessary money for some guy who has exactly the same tools as we do to do it.

 

Last edited: Mar 31, 2018

Hello good friend

Imho everyones comments are important, we are a community of music lovers here.

Sure it did since you paid good money for it.

Because some people do music for a hobby, some doing it so called professional.

yes to this ^ but music is not about money, music is for music herself imho, if the result is success in the industry & money comes from it, all is good

i agree

Perception is everything imho ,don't assume you know the people here & their past/path & relation to this beautiful thing we call music

hmm...


from your signature : Good Luck and Keep Creating.

 

Sure they do. Do you have a definition for what sounds good and what not ? Do many others find your taste appealling ? Simple as that.

I hate to spoil it but you do not have the same tools. An experienced M.E. has done hundreds of albums/singles etc., or even thousands. Their knowledge, approach and in depth critical listening capability by far superseeds any musician's on this specific task. This goes to say, as mentioned before, their strongest piece of gear and quite priceless so, is their ears. That is THEIR ears not yours. All the Maseleks, Manleys, Dangerous, CraneSongs etc in the world will not help you one bit. Actually, with such highly potent gear, the chances for a musician to fuck up completely in the finalizing stage, grow exponentially.
Here's a lil story.
I am the happy owner of a Manley Massive Passive EQ and sometime in the past i had a guitarist friend in the studio who's also a composer/arranger. He asked me if he can try the EQ, i said sure, so he put in a mix of his and started messing with the EQ and was blown away. He went, "fuck man, anything i dial sounds damn excellent, you can't wrong with this thing even if you try ". And of course this EQ is superb, but... was he wrong or was he right ? Finding the correct answer to this, may set you on the right path.
To conclude, for musicians on a budget it's understandable to try and master/finalize their tracks. If however, you are ambitious, believe in your music and want the absolute best sonically for it, you will go the extra mile and hire an ME.
Mastering your own music is about as "inappropriate" as defending yourself in court. Statistically, from a hundred who try mastering their stuff, maybe one will come slightly close to producing a finished product that can compete with everything else in the market on a professional level.
In this age of ever diminishing values anyone may think they are what they declare they are, until "judgement" comes knocking in the front door in the form of your last album's sales report, and assessment is eminent. I wouldn't be surprised if they start to serve soup in shallow dishes, or chicken flew cross Atlantic, i would be surprised if any of the hipstery loudmouths ME wannabes have the balls, skills and talent to produce even a minor hit from A to Z. But i always hope to be proved wrong in this (hasn't happened yet but i never say never), so best of luck with your endeavors.
Cheers

 

Last edited: Apr 1, 2018