Hi everyone,
Hope your all doing swell.

I have a couple questions to ask regarding darker styles of electronic music. Im speaking of electronic in the broad sense (all darker electronic genres).

Ok, so i've been self taught since I started electronic productions & I didn't grow up playing any instruments and no music theory, most of my tracks are made purely by ear etc.
However I feel im at the stage where having no music theory knowledge is starting to slow me down alot on starting new tracks. So i've been putting in some effort on self teaching music theory to myself from online resources , im still very noob to it but I know more then I did previously.
Also now that im older unfortunately I don't really have the time, money, or resources to start any kind of music theory training this late in my life.

So this brings me to my question which is:

Q) If I was looking at making darker styles of electronic music (basically any electronic genre) for eg's It could be dark techno , dark minimal , dark psytrance , dark progressive , dark chill out , etc etc , What would be the kind of recommended "go to" keys and scales for these darker styles ?

As I feel my current process of just using "my ears" is now becoming more time wasting then productive, im a bit of a calculated person so I think if I knew which kind of keys and scales I should be looking at for these darker styles I think would help me tremendously for continuing my passions for music production.


Thanks so much for any input
Take Care

 

basic rule

major keys = happy/bright

minor keys = sad/dark

you don't need to be a master at chords and scales, but try and learn how to recognise between majors and minors, minors I think are the ones you are wanting to explore with the darker side

don't go anywhere near an augmented 4th, its the devil's chord

 

such a huge help already ! , thanks

anyone else feel free to chime in

 

Well, phrygian mode had been quite popular.
In a lot of music theory tutorials I heard that locrian mode is only theorethical, no music ever written in it, but that is nonsense. So much techno used locrian that you might risk sounding a bit old fashioned if you use it in a tried way. It has that diminished fifth that is great for darker genres.
Also, whole tone scale can be quite cool, has ethereal feel to it because it has no tonal center. There are only two of them 1)CDEF#G#A# and 2)C#D#FGAB
But I would advise you not to exclude your ears that easily. You can make up your own scales, there is nothing wrong with that. Simply set the rules yourself and then follow them. Even if the spacing of tones seems crazy like, say Tonic,2 semi, 1semi, 5 semi, 1semi,1semi, 2 semi, just try it and see if you can come up with melodies.

And dont forget that noize is your friend too. Leave tonal crap all together
EDIT: As for Major happy, minor said, that is not true either. If you want to wright a said tune you can do it in major too! Like Imagine, C major, not exactly a happy song. Minor can be sad if thats what you want, but it can be serious, angry, delirious, whatever

 

Look Mark, I was at the same stadium years ago... so I feel your pain. I have the same questions !

For example, how to know what chords to use in a song... ok, I begin with Cm but what next, and how do I know ?

How to synthesis a certain sound etc... how to use FM8 per example ?!???? That kind of questions...

That's really frustrating...

After that, I realize that I must learn stuff, from begining... I'm father of two kids too, have job, have obligations, not have enough time etc... same as today...

First I start to watch video tutorials about synthesis, good starting poing is

* Ask Video - Foundation of synthesis
* Sonic Academy - Subtractive synthesis
* Sonic Academy - FM synthesis
* ... Rob Papen - 4 elements in synthesis (also good)

and a lot of experiments with synths, and I was glory I can make my own patch in any synth... I know the knowledge ...

Second thing is main music theory... chords, scales - harmony in common...

In this thread I put link to great youtube channel "Karen Cuneo Ramirez" who open my eyes... here is the link http://audiosex.pro/index.php?/topic/9253-music-theory-video-materials/

Go to Karen's channel and find earlier stuff about harmonization, you will be pleased The woman is genious.

Example:

Chord device part. 1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=96hgKvLytCk&list=PL45E2D66F380922D1&index=1


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bdkATK_vf_0

Building a harmony part. 1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_pdn5qlKGIY


How to harmonize part. 1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S6FovKmCL7s

How to make chords from scale

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rt6zDOFNAdY

Scales tutorial...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sj8O3p7lknY

etc...

At the end... as SirSilly said... you don't have to finish academy... but you must learn basics, without that you will be always lost.

On the wall infront of my desk I have "circle of 5th" Now I'm know how to use it !

 

For making music is really important to always listen music (from your favourites).

I like to try replicate some works (of my favourite musicians), and figure out how they do a hat, synth, bass or whatever. For me it's really important stage.

Now, you can find tons of video tutorials (masterclasses), where artists explain work process etc... and it's great too.

If you expect of us: ohhh, use Cm + Bb + G + Dm7, thats not work like that

LEARNING BASICS is the key.

 

thanks so much guys , really helpfull info

@nikon

lol yes im basically upto that stage where im comfortable with synthesis but my musical "Planning" is lacking. & I stare at the circle of 5ths confused , trying to make a change to that *yes*

 

Great thing is learning chord progression from other songs, play on piano, recognize the chords and use circle of 5ths.

I like these songs:

* phantom from the opera (in this song, there is a pattern if you look at the circle, but also there is a 4 changes of positions, really intresting)
* furneal of queen mary, theme from clockwork orange (you must just listen )

really dark chord progressions

I like chopin and rachmaninoff, really great progressions...

 

Believe me, just spend some time, watch Karen's video's ( it's a big list at the channel ), and your view to circle will be changed. After youtube videos, you can find other great materials... As I said, yesterday I make a new thread "Music theory videos", soo visit thread.

Just spend some time, no matter how long, and you will be surprised by the results.

 

I started watching the videos on your thread yesturday *yes*

thanks so much

 

Try this, play this chord progression (C major scale)

1) C major -> A minor -> F major -> G major

then try this chords progression (A major scale)

2) A major -> F# minor -> D major -> E major

and see the difference Then look at the circle and see whats going on on circle, then you will know how to use it

It's basic I - VI - IV - V chord progression, for almost every song.


Or this, VI - III - IV - V (of C major scale): A minor -> E minor - > F major -> G major, and then try to change position of root key and follow circle.

 

This is a great circle

 

In addition to all the good stuff Nikon suggested you could benefit from an app called mixed in key to analyze tracks which you like how they feel. In the recent version you can see the waveform of tracks you've analyzed and see that sometimes to set a different mood in a track for a break or something a different chord is used.

 

I have a new question which is pondering on my mind which is:

Q) So if its true that the basic major and minor keys can both have a "happier" or "darker" feel depending on how the melody is composed, what would be your personal opinions on all of the major and minor keys ? which ones do you perceive to be more happy or more dark ?

and is it safe to say that they can all have either happy or darker feel depending on composition ? or are there some specific keys that I should straight up avoid for these darker styles ?

Experimenting with creating my own scales as suggested by don_questio is also a very interesting concept, I just always lacked the "sticking to the rules that you create" part lol

 

pick the darkest music you like.

get parts.

listen listen listen.

try to mimic the style, the melodies and the sound.

most daw have the ability to convert a bit of audio to a score...


See what work

 

just learn the basics and try on your keyboard...

You can't jump to mountain from the ground! Hard steps leading to the top.

 

that chord raises my penis...

 

yea its just a case of all work and no play these days , trying to get motivated and inspired to get back into it.

all the help so far has been great , thanks

 

666! devil's chord!!

 

can't be darker progression

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QyF2LB2UzCU