I need help analyzing this short piece of music...

Discussion in 'Education' started by Rudy Manterie, Jul 4, 2019.

  1. Rudy Manterie

    Rudy Manterie Producer

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    What key is this? What chords are used? Any other info would be great as well. I only know basic music theory (well, judging by this topic, not even that). I'll be back online tomorrow. Thanks in advance

    https://imgur.com/a/zWRlXZk

    notes.png
     
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  3. Rudy Manterie

    Rudy Manterie Producer

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    Mixed In Key 2.5 says it's Bmaj. Is that correct?
     
  4. Kwissbeats

    Kwissbeats Rock Star

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    I don't know music theory at all. Having said that,
    but as far as I can tell, B major does not contain A, F & G.

    more likely, it's a B Minor or a D Major. because these notes fit that key
    the second gues I'm gona take it is in fact a B minor because it contains No D at all.
     
  5. fiction

    fiction Rock Star

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    I'd say: F minor (7) and A minor alternating.
    May I ask why you want to know?
     
  6. Ak3mi91

    Ak3mi91 Kapellmeister

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    It's not correct. It's not in one key. The key changes every measure.

    To keep it simple, let's say that it goes back and forth between F# Minor and A Minor. In other words, it doesn't make much sense, sorry.
     
  7. Rudy Manterie

    Rudy Manterie Producer

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    @fiction: just curious, and also to help me find notes for a bassline or a lead, etc.
     
  8. TaxiDriver

    TaxiDriver Kapellmeister

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    No. Not by far.. Briefly, you can not determine a "key" by these 2 chords. And that is a good thing (Debussy, Williams..).

    The first chord can be an A6/9 (or AMaj6(add9), or.. same difference), where the sixth (F#) is played in the bass and the ninth (B) is played as second (but you can't call it sus2, cause some jazzers would argue that than you have to omit the third - C#)

    It can also be a F# minor chord, with added 4th and 7th. Especially when F# is played in the bass reg.

    And yes, where I live, this it's called "alternation". Composers esp. from Beethoven on use it in a way that the listener never really knows in which key the composition really is.. thus creating interest

    The second is a boring ;) Amin7/9 (ACEGB), played GBCE with A as a bass note.

    Disclaimer: I'm not good at a "jazz" way of spelling..
     
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  9. Daz

    Daz Producer

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    @TaxiDriver has it spot on.
    But to keep it simple, if you remove those short B notes from the chords, the chords are simply F#min7 and Amin7.
     
  10. Futurewine

    Futurewine Rock Star

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    maybe Scaler can further tell.. it has that detect function.. including chords..
     
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  11. Daz

    Daz Producer

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    No app can tell because there is no one key, better to use TaxiDriver's detect function. :)
    EDIT: In this case I mean, but for songs in general they often work well.
    If the chords were D and C for example, then the app would say the key of G (or Emin) if it worked correctly, but with these 2 chords from Rudy, the app will probably freak, as Mixed In Key did when it said Bmajor.
    This is correct because the way it stands with the current chord structure there are 2 keys, A and C, (or A and G), (E and C), (E and G), (D and G),(F#m and Amin) blah blah.

    I think this is what you want to know Rudy...
    The root bass notes are obviously F# and A.

    The main notes you can play over F#min7 (F# A C# E) are...
    F#, (G) G#, A, B, C#, D, E.
    Depends on what you want to do here regarding melody but you can use G instead of G# due to the following Amin7 chord.

    Amin7 (A G C E)...
    A, B, C, D, E, F (F#), G.
    Same here, due to the previous F# minor chord you can use F# instead of F here in the Amin7 chord.
    So now if we are using the note G instead of G# in our melody runs in the chord F#min7, and F# instead of F in Amin7, the 2 keys of the song are now D and G, isn't this fun :)
    You could also use the note Eb in runs leading in and out of the chords if used in the right context.
    Would be interested to hear what you come up with Rudy. :wink:
     
    Last edited: Jul 5, 2019
  12. markywilba

    markywilba Newbie

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    The 2 chords used are A/F# and C(maj7)/A
     
  13. Born

    Born Newbie

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    F# minor 11 and A minor 9
     
  14. Futurewine

    Futurewine Rock Star

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    how tha did u guyss can read thattt :rofl:
     
  15. Rudy Manterie

    Rudy Manterie Producer

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    Great, thanks a lot everyone! IF i ever finish this track (deep house thingie) i'll post it here.
     
  16. Ad Heesive

    Ad Heesive Producer

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    As many people have already demonstrated, there are lots of alternative chord spellings available to name the same sets of notes.

    Stepping back slightly to think about 'what tonality am I in' instead of worrying about chord names.

    It could be...

    I'm in (street key of) 'A' the whole time but I'm toggling between two modes A Ionian, A Aeolian, A Ionian, A Aeolian,
    So basically just toggling between A Major and A Minor.

    And if you think the F# in the bass really matters, you might prefer to think of F# Aeolian instead of A Ionian.

    The main reason I prefer to think of the toggling tonality instead of just naming chords is it means I'd be better oriented if I wanted to substitute other chords at any time.

    ---
    and so baffling why we didn't witness the messiah MMJ 2017 answering this with his alleged wisdom dripping out everywhere else on this forum - maybe it required a bit of actual thought?
    :dunno:
    ---

    Update:
    1st a disclaimer: All stuff described below is only like looking at a map of the musical landscape. None of it pretends to be a formula for how you should dance down the streets of that landscape. So, these are 'theory' suggestions that are no substitute for your improvisational composition.

    'If' you buy into my suggestion that the tonality can be thought of as toggling between (key) A major and (key) A minor (just one possibility) then here's a few follow up ideas...

    Just for convenience, I'm going to call the chords with the F# bass the 'odd' chords, (1st chord in progression, 3rd chord, 5th chord, etc) and the chords with the A bass the 'even' chords (2nd chord in progression, 4th chord, 6th chord, etc)

    The two chords provide a sense of shifting back and forth, odd-even-odd-even

    Do you want to...
    [1] add something that reinforces that shifting
    or do you want to...
    [2] add something that gives a sense of 'not changing' behind those chords.
    (I'd exploit both [1] and [2] as a song progresses)

    For [2] Maybe as some background stuff.
    Try some repetitive riffs or arpeggios that 'do not change' when the chords change. Try building them out of the notes that A major and A minor share.
    So, explore and find some interesting riffs, arpeggioss, using these notes A,B,D,E
    maybe sneak in G# for the odd chords and G for the even chords but otherwise keep the riffs, arpeggios the same.
    e.g., B,A,G#,A,B (for odd chords) B,A,G,A,B (for even chords)
    That's exploiting 9,Root,7,Root,9,Root,7 Root, etc
    and throw in some D or E wherever it helps.
    (but obviously that's not a magic formula, you still need to find your own 'interesting' expansions of the above)

    For [1] and [2] combined
    - pentatonic scale for A major is these notes (A,B,C#,E,F#)
    - pentatonic scale for F# minor is the same notes as A major (F#,A,B,C#,E)
    - pentatonic scale for A minor is these notes (A,C,D,E,G)

    Improvise using F# minor pentatonic (F#,A,B,C#,E) over the odd chords
    Improvise using A minor pentatonic (A,C,D,E,G) over the even chords

    Find a riff or phrase that you like over the odd chord (using F#m pentatonic) and then 'keep it exactly the same' but move it up 3 semitones and play it again over the even chords (that is now using A minor pentatonic). or vice versa find a phrase that you like over the even chords (using Am pentatonic) and 'keep it the same' but shift it down 3 semitones for the odd chords.

    Now you have something 'the same - unchanging' i.e., the shape of the phrase stays the same, but also 'changing' because it's transposing up and down 3 semitones for each chord change.

    For lead parts - voice or whatever.
    Given that the chords are toggling back and forth, and old "question and answer' idea is begging to be explored. I would start by exploring the odd chords as the questions and the even chords as the answers. Again improvising with the pentatonic scales above is a good place to start.

    Something I would definitely be drawn to is a bluesy idea (even if the genre has absolutely nothing to do with blues) and that idea is...
    See the C# in the odd chords and the C in the even chords. They are begging to be bent.
    So, get your mod wheel greased up and do this...
    Play a C# towards the end of an odd chord and bend it down to C over the change to an even chord. Do the opposite... play a C at the end of an even chord and bend it up to a C# over the change to an odd chord.
    Let those bends be the openings to improvised question and answer phrases.
    Same story exactly for bending the F# (odd chord) <-> F (even chord)

    and to repeat a million times... none of the above is any more than a quick theory peek at a map of the musical landscape that your 'two chords' sequence has provided.
    How to dance around that musical landscape is your own personal funtime, and infinitely more important than all that theory.

    Cheers
    (p.s. I hope there are no typos in my notes above - a rushed job) :wink:
     
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2019 at 3:59 AM
  17. Rudy Manterie

    Rudy Manterie Producer

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    Thank you very much for that very detailed response! I have a nasty flu at the moment so haven't had the time nor energy yet to work on that track. I'll try to post some results sometime later.
     
  18. Lou Ulfark

    Lou Ulfark Member

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    For me it's just F#m7 and Am9 ...
    "...
    But now I might be mistaken
    Hmm, hmm, hmm
    Have mercy ..." :winker:
     
  19. Ad Heesive

    Ad Heesive Producer

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    I don't think mercy is usually on offer.
    So calling it F#m7 and Am9 - that's spot on, no-one will disagree with that (witness many others above saying same)
    But that word 'just' that you sneakily slipped in... "For me it's just F#m7 and Am9 ..."
    Sorry, but that's a hangable offence.
    :winker:
     
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