Hello guys!

I found a new hobby: Producing techno music, especially melodic techno.

The problem? I have troubles finding/creating a fitting bassline for my melodic techno tracks.

My usual "workflow" looks like this: I create a drum pattern. That's the easy part. Sometimes also already a melody. That's sometimes easy.

Where it gets hard the first time is finding the right bass. I always try A LOT of presets for Serum and in the end, I usually find some bassline, that fits (=sounds good).

But that can't be the solution. I mean, there must be a quicker and more precise way.

The same thing goes for the pads and sometimes also the melody. But to make it simple, let's focus on the bassline here.

Now, I sometimes hear about "music theory" and I guess that's the key to my question (?) The problem is, I watched a few beginner-videos on Youtube but still don't get how I make it usable for me and my problem.

So I thought about asking here in this forum.

1.) Is music theory really the answer to my question or something different?

2.) If so, could someone here explain to me how I'd find a fitting bassline for my tracks using music theory? But really in the most simple way. With simple words. Like you'd explain it to someone who knows NOTHING about music. Like you would talk to an idiot.

Best,
MusicTurtle

 

Study the basso continuo and basics of the counterpoint.

 

Thanks for your answer!

The thing is, this is exactly how I work. And it works. I'm able to put a track together, that sounds good.

My problem is, that this method is super time-consuming. I try 40, 50, 60 or more presets until I find a bass, that fits.

I can't imagine that's how professionals work...?

 

i hate presets..... but i understand what u're saying

however, do try make a bass from a simple waveform (i.e sound design it yourself). Maybe thats all u're looking for. No need to complicate things

 

Last edited by a moderator: Apr 11, 2024

A great question.

ArcticStorm's response is quite happy.

I'll just complement it: Listen to countless songs in the style you're producing. Our brain is a pattern detection machine. The more "entries" you make, the greater knowledge of stylistic patterns you will have and, over time, the easier it will be to obtain pairings. With constant training, you will know that certain timbres fit better with certain styles and that these, in turn, can work better with certain genres, and so on. Also note the relationship with the Envelope (ADSR): Remember that variations in envelope parameters create patterns of attack, decay, sustain and release that can become, along with timbre, important stylistic markers for the final result.

So, listen a lot, study presets that sound/are similar to what you want (also use tags), try to adjust them to your needs and you will see that as time goes on you will be creating your own patches.

 

Last edited: Apr 10, 2024

After some time you will probably know exactly how something name BS_Phat Bass sounds like and that goes for rest of the presets, so you may end up maybe shooting out fewer and fewer options, like for this track I'm going with BS_Runner layered with this one and stuff like that. Dunno, thing about relying entirely on presets is that you really need to learn what you got there, so you don't waste too much your time previewing sounds.

Personally I try to stick to few tools and few banks, so I can get the most out of them, but it takes time to learn those tools and options, at some point proficiency comes naturally, but you need to put the time into it.

 

I like Serum a lot, but I think it's maybe way too many possibilities for a true beginner. I would look for other commonly used bass synths. Techno has a lot of bass, but not always a lot of complex synth work used for the basslines. Many good tracks are just a sub, with a more complex musical synth just above it.

 

Imma be straight here, a lot of people have questions like "how do I make this type of music?" or "how should my piano sound in this genre?" And the answer is simple if you're willing to take some time to actually listen to music. Your understanding of a music genre and your compositional ideas won't appear outta nowhere, they can only be as vast as your music repertoire and experience as a listener goes. So go on, listen to some melodic techno or whatever you're into and analyze what's going on. Then copy, copy, copy the shit outta it until you become somewhat fluent in melodic techno.

 

^^^ spot on!

All you need for melodic techno is one PML Serum pack. It's the same saw bassline in an abnormally high number of songs, and the pattern is rolling 16ths. This genre is not bass-focused, so they don't really put any effort in it. And of course, a "machine gun" lead during and after breakdown.

 

Of course you need music theory. Nobody would have the idea to build a car by throwing some metal pieces on a pile, drill some hole anywhere in some pieces, put screws in some holes and then go on a forum and complain about that this can't be the way "professionals" build cars.

But in music ... nah, creativity is everything. Knowledge ... overrated. And the less someone knows the more opinion someone has. That's the rule that get things off the ground, for sure.

OK, be a victim of your own ignorance. Your choice. You do not need to learn. (I tell you a secret: the "professionals" learn as much as they can lay their hands on ... )

 

I will speak as a bass player/composer who also uses synthesised basses.

Every musician wants the perfect lines for their tunes. Sometimes this is possible and other times it is not a reality.
There are several considerations

• Often people want the bassline to sit with the kick. That's only fine if that is the intention. Sometimes the bassline works great in-between the kick as the kick in a tune can be the drive, as can the bass - deciding that relationship is important.
• Is the bassline a driving line or a melodic line/RIFF? Or both? This also determines the approach.
• Is it the bass that is making you feel it does not work or the tone of it? This is important to work out. It is actually possible to have a bass part that works but you feel it doesn't because it clashes with something else. Work that out if the bass is important.
• Know which parts are the instruments that must be heard above the others in your track because everything else is secondary or tertiary.
• LAST - If it is the line only, start with what you hear and if it does not work go back to the simplest possible bassline. Listen to it with the harmony and the drums and work back up from there in complexity.

There's more but the above will work in any genre or style.

P.S - I am qualified in music and that is irrelevant when it comes to making music. Musicologists are also qualified and some of them are horrible musicians. I wrote my first tune as mediocre as it was when I was ten years old and that was many decades ago and I could not read a single note of music then. Theory is only important if you wish to expand your performance skills, arranging/compositional skills and harmony/scale knowledge, or research skills if you wish to be a musicologist.

 

Last edited by a moderator: Apr 11, 2024

To concur with what Mr. BaSsDuDe mentioned regarding theory, Paul McCartney can't read music and has written some of the greatest basslines in modern music with the Beatles as well as his large catalog of work with Wings and whilst writing purely solo.

 

Basically you can divide the problem into different parts. Positions, note-length, pitch and finally the sound itself. Now you can tackle each of these separately. You can start of with a simple patch and start of with the positions on the base note. Then you can alter the length of the different notes and after that you can change the note pitches if necessary and create a melody. Then you can change the patch to something you like more. Alternatively you can start off with the patch. After you find a patch you like, do the other steps.

 

There is no easy answer to your problem. There are usually 2 methods. Analytical method and praying method.

In the first method, you have to get lots of information and sit down to analyze your music and make the necessary changes based on what you have learned.

In the second method, you don't need to do anything special, just open your hands and reach towards the sky, maybe God will send unseen help to you at that moment and you can create something random and be satisfied with your work.

The second method is quick, but there is no guarantee that God will help you next time.

In addition, God himself knows the first method and if he wants to help someone, he uses that. If you want to be a God in music for yourself and don't need supernatural help, you should sit down and look deeply at music.

I emphasize that you should sit down, which is usually not possible in dance music.

 

Last edited by a moderator: Apr 11, 2024

Tommy Emmanuel also does not read a note of music. I doubt anyone would call him a poor writer or performer either. The music world is full of great musicians who never studied theory. This takes nothing away from the logic and advantages of the theoretical principles, it just is a matter of fact.

 

nvmnd

 

Last edited: Apr 11, 2024

Probably God loved them very much. Maybe they had a kind heart or maybe they have done other good things in their life that have been rewarded like this.

 

@ all: There are so many replies, that I can't reply to everyone BUT I read every single answer and it was very helpful, so thank you all!

The general approach seems to be to just try things, so basically like I'm doing it now ;)

But still, allow me to ask a final question. I heard, that the...

• Vocals
• Kicks
• Bass
• Lead
• Pads

...should be "in key" to sound harmonic together.

In my understanding, if for example the vocals are in F#, then everything else should be in F# too.

Could this be the more technical approach I am looking for?

PS: Not that I REALLY know what F# is ;) But if the "in key"-thing is the way to go, I'd learn it.

 

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