Leaving Logic Pro today. Another straw has broken the camel's back. The camel is pissed and auditioning new software tonight.

I'm leaning toward Reaper. It feels at first like this is going to be a tougher transition than Studio One would be, but I'm leaving Logic Pro because ultimately I don't give a shit for cute cartoon characters that can do my drumming for me (on a nice birch kit that sits atop lush Indian rug), if the DAW itself isn't rock fucking solid when it comes to the basics. I want efficient CPU performance. I want solid timing. I want a dev that listens to bug reports and fixes what needs fixin' ahead of dreaming up what the next release's gimmick will be. As far as I can tell the only downside for me and Reaper is the initial learning curve and the minor superficial matter of how freakin' ugly it is.

Studio One feels more like what I'm used to. Beyond that I'm not sure what else it's going to offer me that Reaper won't once I get to know its interface.

Going to miss a few of my fallback EXS-24 instruments . . . but beyond that, sayonara baby!

 

I have learned both Studio One and Reaper over the years and written, recorded (vox, bg vox, gtrs/bass) and finished tracks in both. They are both fully competent DAWS.
The only thing that I can see that would really set them apart is performance. Reaper is so lean and mean and can handle more work load and plugins than any DAW I have ever seen. It loads in seconds.
I do feel you on the visual aspects of them though. Studio one looks cleaner and is easier to look at for hours on end. Reaper does have some really nice skins though I like to use the default dark one found on the reaper stash site. And having all the different mixer views and track views as recallable Screen sets is really cool.
If you do decide to go the reaper route be sure to check out Kenny Gioia's ReaperMania channel on YouTube it's the same tutorials on the reaper site just in a playlist, or his site here http://www.kennymania.com/reaper-videos/
Same guy who did the official Reaper tutorials with ask video for the previous versions but now he does them for free or maybe Reaper pays him now.
Best of luck and happy learning!

 

Camel audio is back? O_o

 

I can't deny that what you wrote is 100% what I was hoping to hear. Thanks for your insights. I'm gonna be on those tuts all night!

 

@returnal
I will mention this. I gave up on reaper twice before I finally understood it. But this was back in version 2 before the great tutorials they have now.
You don't learn REAPER, it learns you....meaning, you customize it to your workflow as you go. Making your own KB shortcuts, saving your own macros and screensets. But once you spend some time getting it right it truly becomes "your" DAW.
Also when starting out the ? key is your best friend. It brings up the actions window.
If you ever get really stuck theres a few of us here that are really knowledgeable with REAPER. Start a thread...

 

Last edited: Feb 20, 2017

@returnal I think you will find yourself a new Reaper fan... sure everything has a learning curve.. but many times..
I have found myself doing something from an intuitive impulse or even searching for something I want to do, and it's already there, just have to find out where it lives in the menus ... very few pieces of software have impressed me with how they just seem to have covered so many of the things you might want to do

To be sure.. there are people on Reaper's forum complaining, mainly about midi handling, but then users can script their own
solutions, which they do, and some of them are quite ingenious. There are other solutions, some free, some not, that are made
to specially mesh with Reaper to increase functionality.

As you have probably have seen also, @mild pump milk 's thread with the Reaper
updates, that are frequent, and often substantial..

Have thoroughly enjoyed my experience with this DAW for many years, and it remains my default, and my go to,
and the best at doing what I want a DAW to do. The only thing I feel a little bad about, is that
at it's price point, and how useful it's been for me, I should have gone legit with it sooner than I did.

 

Last edited by a moderator: Feb 20, 2017

Studio one is logic's clone with proper browser. What makes you switch logic?

 

I'm a studio one user and love it (also use logic from time to time). But if you're on MAC and looking for "rock solid" performance, studio one isn't the way to go imo. I personally am willing to sacrifice this as my computer is powerful enough to handle it and for the wonderful workflow/visual aesthetics the daw brings.. but overall it can be quite hard on cpu. Just something to consider and only my experience.

 

Like most breakups it's more an accumulation of issues, rather than just one thing, but yesterday's straw was discovering that on many systems (including mine) Logic X's MIDI timing is broken in projects where there are graduated tempo changes (i.e. all of my projects). I fought with it for 10 hours trying to get it to work (like it used to) while recording a sequenced bass part. I have multiple MIDI interfaces (all tried) and after a decade I know Logic's preferences and MIDI settings very well. Nothing I tried helped. Then I had it confirmed that it's a known "bug" and has been for awhile.

So I downloaded and installed Reaper this afternoon and within 5 minutes I had my SY2 bass part recorded with less latency and tighter overall timing than I've ever had with Logic (even before it was totally broken).

This isn't the first problem I've had with Logic functions that I consider fundamental to how a DAW needs to perform. I've long felt that Logic is like buying a beautiful car with a luscious interior and kickin' stereo system, but a subpar engine under the hood and horrible surprises every other day like "oh, today it won't turn while in reverse ... how am I going to get out of this parking space?" Perhaps I've just been unusually unlucky, but I've been unusually unlucky one too many times now.

 

Very interesting. I'll be sure to look into this once I have the fundamentals covered.

Actually I've not noticed them, probably because they weren't relevant to my workflow. I'll keep an eye out for them now though!

 

I dont know if you know about this yet but...

SWS Extensions
This gives REAPER extended functionality.
http://www.sws-extension.org/

REAMENUS
And here is a custom menuset for REAPER that categorizes the context menus better so there isnt so much clutter. This needs SWS Extensions installed to work properly. Theres an entry at the bottom of the context menu that shows the original context menu until you get used to navigating the reorganized menuset.
http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=58672

I dont know if youre a fan of the darker themes or not. Here is the theme Im using. Its the default theme but darker with better visibility and brighter colorsets for the midi notes in the piano roll.
http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=172024

Heres a tool that you may find useful too
Instant Arpeggios and Chords
http://reaperblog.net/2016/04/instant-arpeggios-chords/
An example of the REAPER community custom scripts

 

Are you referring to the LP 10.3 update?

I concur with your dismay over the Drummer feature, which is better off as part of Garageband, since anyone meriting the designation "Logic Pro" is writing their own drum parts. Besides, the names of the styles and the styles themselves are destined for outdatednes within a few years. The default setting of track icons is annoying, because one has to remove them from each project. The non-customizable drab-gray theme of the GUI is so fugly that it's uninviting and difficult to use (unless one is taking advantage of this man's GUI themes, which render LPX so much easier and enjoyable to use). Reaper has themes out the wazoo; Stuido One's GUI colors are user-choosable. The addition of Alchemy was cool, but it's not that special, considering what third-party softsynths are available, and it's taxing on resources. The plug-in suite is good, but the Channel EQ slurps RAM, so I use a lightweight third-party one. Most of them haven't been substantially updated, apart from their GUIs, since the first LPX version. Then, the samples and loops: hardly updated in a decade, apart from additions of sounds which were trendy a few years ago (anyone remember "dubstep?"), and a few minor "ethnic" instruments (appealing to the Chinese for that huge market, I suppose).

I really hope that someone influential at Apple is reading this. I know that that Adele album was recorded entirely on LPX 'n' all, but a DAW is really better off as foremost an application which runs other software, not comprises it; if it does, it should be re-written and bug-tested with each update. People disparage Bitwig for frequent bug-fixer and improvement updates, but they shows that its developers are concerned with Bitwig's usability. (I recommend giving that one a try, while you're at it – it's actually fun to use.)

 

You ever have one of those days that starts out feeling like one of the worst days ever but then later starts to feel like one of the best days ever? That's how this is starting to feel.

 

Sadly no. I'm still running 10.2.4 - but for those with this MIDI issue it hasn't been fixed in 10.3 either - or so I've been told.

Agreed. I've been using an API theme for a couple of years now.

 

I use both Reaper and Logic 10.3. I have zero issues with tempo automation. I do orchestral works and change tempo all the time. I think you will like Reaper, but it is light years behind Logic with midi.

 

reaper ugly ????



http://stash.reaper.fm/theme/1932/CLogic.zip

 

If you don't like Reaper's default look, there's all kinds of themes on Reaper stash, including Logic-alike ones. I Logic for example. look after the themes made by this guy Blankfiles http://forum.cockos.com/search.php?searchid=12791659

also check this thread, you might find something pleasant for yer eye https://audiosex.pro/threads/your-reaper-theme.19296/

I have Reaper, yet there's one thing I like and miss greatly about Logic X and it's Hammond B3. really, if I had that much money to spare, I would buy a Mac Mini just to play that Hammond alone. just for that. it's that awesome.

 

Last edited: Feb 21, 2017

and you call Reaper "freaking ugly"? nah, man, Reaper has themes that crap all over that.

 

Yeah, until yesterday I had zero issues with tempo automation as well and then, poof!

I've had a number of experiences like this. There was a time about a year ago when the settings buttons on all of my channel strips didn't work… They just did nothing, so I could not pull up the menu that would allow me to save a channel strip, reset one, or load one that I had already saved. I've also had recurring issues where a project that would play back just fine one day would snag and distort and become unplayable the next. Usually I would find some weird work-around that would bring the project back to usability, like changing a send from #4 to number #5 and then changing the aux channel it was sending you also from #4 to #5 (to preserve the exact same functionality), and voilà, everything would work again. But each time stuff like this happens I waste a day or more trying to hunt down the bug or the weird work-around or, in the best case scenario, the solution. At this point I'm more than willing to give up some frilly options and/or functionality to work in an environment that is reliable, predictable, and dependable for me. I work with a lot of software in my profession, (most of it "pro" photo and video editing and effects), and don't have anywhere near these kinds of hiccups with those other pieces of software.

I do a lot of MIDI in Logic but I can't imagine that the things I do with midi in Logic can't be done in Reaper. Perhaps I am taking for granted this functionality in Logic. Or I'm just a very basic, straightforward, MIDI user. Either way, I'm about to find out!

 

That

That looks fab ... much better than the default theme I'm looking at tonight. :P