Jaycen Joshua showed his strategy of using Waves TrueVerb as a sort of front-to-back panner on MWTM, interesting stuff. I tried it and quite liked it, it surprised me a bit. What plugins/methods do you guys use for this?

 

I'm using the same method from time to time , but you can use any ir loader ,it's only for the early reflections.
The effect is subtle but make a difference

 

Yeah i use early reflection reverbs etc for similar effect, but it's cool to have a tool that tells you a theoretical distance in the process. About to check out TDR Proximity, old plug but looks promising. Looking for some more like this

 

a reverb which lets you pan the source to the sides will usually also let you control the distance.

howeverm the distance itself (apart from possible additional reflections) can be modelled relatively easy: it is a delay and a certain format of lowpass filter, which is close to how air absorbtion effects waves in reality.

i´ve made myself a little plug-in for "distance" in 2001 and still use this filter in various other modelling situations in more complex algos (such as reverbs)

 

Would you happen to know any plugin we can get that does this really well? That'd be neat, thanks! Edit: especially the low pass filter, I'm curious to know how it'd compare to standard 12 or 24db LP filters

 

Plugins for Distance and Reverb Manipulation

TDR Proximity (Free):
Developed by Tokyo Dawn Labs and Vladg Sound, this plugin uses psychoacoustic models to simulate distance. It includes features like signal delay, gain loss, air absorption, stereo width manipulation, and early reflections. It's straightforward to use and highly effective for creating convincing distance effects.

Audio Ease 360pan Suite:
This suite allows for precise spatial control, including distance manipulation in ambisonics. It integrates seamlessly with the 360reverb for adjusting reverb width and distance per source, making it ideal for immersive audio projects.

FabFilter Pro-R:
While primarily a reverb plugin, it offers controls that can help shape the perception of space and distance effectively. Adjusting early reflections and decay can emulate depth and positioning.

Soundtoys Little Plate or Valhalla Room:
These reverbs are excellent for creating lush spaces, but by tweaking pre-delay and high-frequency damping, you can simulate distance more convincingly.

Shaper Box or PanMan by Soundtoys:
These tools allow for creative auto-panning and frequency-dependent panning, which can complement reverb to enhance the sense of movement and spatial depth.

Techniques to Create Distance
Use a combination of low-pass filtering (to mimic air absorption) and subtle delays to simulate sound traveling over a distance.
Automate volume reductions to make sounds feel farther away.

Manipulate early reflections in reverb settings to position sounds closer or farther from the listener.
Layer subtle delays with multi-tap configurations to emulate realistic early reflections without relying heavily on reverb.
For a free starting point, TDR Proximity is highly recommended due to its ease of use and versatility. If you're looking for more advanced features, Audio Ease 360pan Suite is an excellent choice for ambisonic workflows.

Source: AI

 

For depth-placement I use pre-fader parallel send to HPF+LPF (naturall roll-off), room reverb (with suiting predelay) and M/S mixer (narrower or wider, to imitate distance).

 

Last edited: Apr 6, 2025 at 8:57 PM

I also use trueVerb but TC 6000 early reflections are amazing too.

 

In the mix I was doing I shot quite a few out bc the track in the mix was quite important; U-he Uhbik Ambience, Dear Reality Exoverb, Exponential Symphony, and TC 8210 were the top contenders vs like maybe 3-4 more.

But in the end, TrueVerb delivered what the track needed the most

 

Doesn't TrueVerb make stuff more mono even with early and late reflections off? Or maybe there's a setting for this I haven't seen.

 

Last edited: Apr 6, 2025 at 10:59 PM

I'm using the early reflections in TrueVerb, definitely not more mono.

Used on some tracks of live drums where the recording engineer used basically spot mics for the cymbals instead of other overheads, probably didn't think the cymbals would be bashed as hard as they were by the drummer. TrueVerb as insert on each, Room Size 3000~, Distance 20~, Direct On, Early Reflections -15, Reverb off.

 

I use the Jaycen Joshua trick with Waves TrueVerb early reflections. I choose the size of the room, turn of the reverb and tweak the distance and the amount of reflections. Works like a charm. I don't think you need something more than that. I don't know

 

Haha, yep, this was pretty much my conclusion in doing some shoot outs. Others sounded more natural or 'real', I think if I was doing some softer, chamber, etc type music with not a lot of compression it could be advisable to use the others, but the TrueVerb earlies just sound right and fit right with very minimal tweaking. The high end feels a bit unnatural, but actually I found that to be very beneficial in my use cases.

 

I notice this high end thing and sometimes smearing of the transients. But i kinda can avoid that with the dry/wet knob and built in eq. Sometimes it's just for the feel, so those other qualities doesn't matter that much IMO. I'm not putting it on my kick drum lol

 

There are several ways to do this even with stock plugins and automation.

Sends :


1. Post-Fader (Post pan)
2. Pre-Fader ( Post FX)
3. Pre-Fader ( Pre FX)

Vocal Example with a Reverb send using #2 Pre-Fader Post FX ( must use this send type)

1.Automate the volume fader on the vocal track( which is the dry portion keeping it up front) and your vocal will slip in and out of the Reverb space. In order to deal with the Reverb tails Automate the tails section with the same automation you did for the volume on the vocal track. This combined automation will allow for the Vocal to slip in and out of the Reverb without having to worry about the tails of the reverb since both volume and tails are being automated at the same time.

You can also automate the panning of the Vocal inside the Reverb to go left and right ( use a panning fx on the vocal track itself). Everything in a daw these days can be automated so your ideas can be limitless.

All this can be done with stock plugins like in Reaper or other Daw's but you must use the right Send ( or Aux) type in order to do this. Using Post-Fader ( Post Pan) which is modern standard will not work with slipping the vocal in and out of the reverb properly.

For quick stuff I just automate the wet control of Reaverb placed within the vocal track itself at the end of the fx chain. This has a similar effect but has less control over what is happening with the soundscape since it has a more drastic change.

 

Last edited: Apr 7, 2025 at 1:47 AM

Another one:

HMD Black Vortex– Ultimate Depth Control for Your Mix

HMD Black Vortex is a powerful time-based effect plugin that lets you control the spatial positioning of sounds, pushing elements back or bringing them forward with precision. Using early reflection processing and mid-side balance adjustment, it creates depth and clarity in any mix.