I've used these Bass VST sounds:

Native Instruments Scarbee MM Amped, Jay bass, Pre Bass
Ilya Modern bass
Cherry E bass
Instant Bass

and combined them with Amplitube and Guitar rig for my Pop, Rock, Funk, R&B songs.

I could never reach the Natural sound I would really enjoy.

The Play technique is a very important part of getting a good sounding Bass Track, but that is not the Problem by me.

I'm curious How You achieve an acceptable sound. What Vst Instruments do You use and how is Your effect Processing on them?

Thanks in advance
Aminomo (Nima)

 

if you want a natural sound have a play with a physical modelling synth.
logic's sculpture is a great example and i've had many good realistic bass sounds from it.

 

My korg Z1 have a good physical modeling, but I think that major problem with most keybord player is HOW to play/write.
Studing loops libs or the great midi demos give a lot to think about...
The use of Key swith is obrigatory these days..
Ampeg for ik is very good indeed, but you forgot the fav of many: Spectrasonics Trilian, some things only can be do with...
Another problem, and we cannot forget when we talk about bass, is the bass drum
Fav of manuy is moog sources, I heard a lot of good bass done by moog, but this is another story...

 

I used to use Scarbee Pre-Bass (DI version) and I've used Jay-Bass DI (which is set up really weird, by the way; I've also had to combine the "fingered" with "slapped" instruments to keep it sounding consistent during slaps) and, aside from the appalling lack of articulations on both, they don't sit too well in the mix. I think they were recorded with the wrong bass frequencies, or through a too-tubby pre-amp, but they're too bass-heavy to be amped properly (I combine DI and amp signal blended together, then phase align them during mixing) and none of the EQs or stuff like Waves' all-in-one plugs (CLA, Eddie Kramer, Maserati, etc.) can get rid of the unnatural sound, or it makes things worse. I suspect both libraries were intended to be used as funk basses, which isn't my normal style of music, and lack a decent "hard rock" sound. Maybe they work better on pop or jazz music? Now, I use Ilya Efimov Classic Bass, which is an older P-Bass, and it sounds exactly like a real DI'd bass. It even has a built-in amp sim, and I believe it's a mix of direct and amped signal -- not that I'd use Kontakt's onboard effects! Plus, it has mondo articulations that Pre-Bass and Jay-Bass lack. You can even pull off decent slaps and FX. I'd get the Modern Bass, also, which I'm sure works equally as well ... but I also have Prominy's Yamaha SR5 Rock Bass, which is a fairly big library, but worth it. It's probably the best picked bass library on the market. Since they were both recorded properly, you can run them through an amp sim and get a lot more realistic sound that sits in the mix better.

 

Spectrasonics Trillian sounds very convincing in a mix: You might want to listen to their demos.
This is actually the only plugin I ever use when I need a bass sound, no matter which kind.

 

I,m PC user. I worked with Logic for Years up to Version 5.0 until they changed to MAC.

This is exactly what I noticed. some physical modelling synth's Bass did sound better in my mix than a 13 gb Kontakt sound!! Just the Articulations and playing with different strings is what lacks by synths. For some fully Acoustic songs this is my problem.

By jay bass and pre bass when you play them solo, fine but in the mix as You say They sound muddy.
Ilya Classic bass is good for Rock. Modern bass has the same features and Generally all ilya VST instruments are great in Articulations, features and easy play scripting. Just the sound of ilya Modern bass has not the power and as You mentioned, using the right Plugins to adjust the sound could make correct it but I have just tried Amplitube on it and could not get it sound perfect in my mix.

Your comment was very helpful. thanks

Trillian is the one I never tested. I Bought Trilogy Years ago as it was the only good sounding sampled Bass Library. I will check it. Thanks

As You mentioned, Midi play technique like a bass player, using Articulations, composing the Bass Track as a Combination with Bass Drum to make no conflicts between them are the Key to Achieve that good sound.

Thanks

 

EQ and compression. Sometimes octave pedal (subtle blend, less is more), sometimes overdrive/distortion.
No VSTi though (Precision bass through an Ampeg tube head + cabinet).

 

i always wonder this...

with the amount of effort some people go to with synths and vsti's it would be quicker just to learn the instrument...

seriously, bass isn't that hard to pick up and learn, unless your looking at some real jazzy advanced playing most bass lines are quite easy to play...

give it a go...

 

Look, I'm a composer. I use between 1 to 30 Instruments depending on my song. I Play Piano, Drum and Percussion.

I have really no more time and no more Joy to learn another Instruments. By a serious end Record I ask a bass Player to do the job but using all VST instruments is fundamental for composing and arranging. All top composers do the same to sketch their songs. Some VST instruments can even replace the acoustic sound. All you hear in TV and Radio is not Acoustic.

what we are speaking here is not playing a monotone Techno bass line. Creating a Bass track in a Pop, Funk, Rock, R&B or Jazz Song that can't be recognized as not Real Played.

 

no offence but i bet none of the basslines in your music are to hard to play with a live bass...

unless your music is some avante garde free form expression jazz piece most bass is just a repetitive groove...

you say you have no time to learn a new instrument...

yet youve been on this website all day?

ok

 

Remix this is not a competition!
Do not judge the words of our mates so hardly.
The roll here is to help, and yes you are very offensive (not the first rime)
I have a Hi degree as a composer (Yeah I study full serial music) and pianist but everyone has it special skills and respect is priceless right?
You must start to see everyone like mates that need help intead fighting against!

 

I don't know if it's that they sound "muddy" so much as they might have too much of the wrong bass frequency in them, in A/B comparisons I've done between a commercial bass track and the way they sound in a mix. The DI version on its own doesn't seem to hold the mix together on its own (running a compressor, EQ or bass-enhancement plug seems to bring out the wrong bass frequencies that have a reverse effect on the mix -- the bass stands out way too far unless you push it too far back in the mix), and blending it with an amped version and phase corrected, it accentuates the wrong frequencies. It might work for a funk, pop or even a jazz tune, but for rock, it just doesn't sit too well. Whatever the intent was, the Efimov library is a lot closer in tone to an actual DI'd bass, so you can mix it better with an amped signal.

Definitely try blending DI and amp signals (on each of their own mono audio tracks). You also need something like Melda Productions' Auto-Align to get the two signals in proper phase before trying to mix them.

 

Before I write anything I must declare that I am not a bassist.
That being said the basses I use the most are mainly Scarbee MM Bass (DI), PreBass (Di), OTS Iconic Bass Jaco for jazz-funk-fusion stuff (the stuff that I usually do), and the Scarbee Rickenbacker for more aggressive rock-progressive-metal stuff (don't laugh at me ).
The FX used are different ones and usually relate to the track and the role the bass is going to play in them. On the MMBass I often use the DI (reducing the volume) with a convolution reverb (picking an IR of a room with a wooden floor), the onboard EQ of the bass, some panning and a soft knee compressor where I can control the release trail. I don't have much problem placing the bass in the mix between drums, brass, organs or any other keyboards. Sometimes I may need not such a fat sound and as for now the tool I use the most to morph the bass sound is Overloud Mark Studio 2. When I insert this amp I rarely use any other effects outside the compressor.
Hope it helps!

P.S.: On a side note I must reveal that I've never used Trillian because it was not possible to control the hand position on the fretboard (or at least I didn't find any way to) which to me is "critical" in a bass sound.

 

Learning to play bass AND make it sound great is no easier than any other instrument.

However, if you're after that 'real, natural' bass sound- there's really no other way to get it. Sample libraries will work great for songs that don't need the bass to be so realistic, but good luck with anything expressive or funky!

My favorite bass sample library was Yellow Tools Majestic. I don't even know if you can get it or run it on modern systems anymore, but it sounded better than Trilogy/Trillian to me (which I do own as well).

 

I know a complete idiot, he learned to play simple bass-lines in about three to six months.
using Youtube tutorials and a cheap bass.
So it is possible....... believe me, if he can we all can.

The best bass for me comes from Scarbee and Trillian.
Over the last couple of years i've managed to impress some "real " musicians with both of them.
But i have to say, sometimes it takes a lot of work to get those complicated parts to sound good.

But for the main part they get the job done.
Trillian sounds deeper, lower.
Scarbee has nice articulations, sliding\ bending from one note to another etc. etc.

 

remix
There is nothing wrong with not wanting to learn every instrument that you're trying to emulate, that is what sampling is for. It's also still a valuable skill to be able to pull off believable performances with a sample library.

 

Well when someones bet that somones instrument is easy to play I think that its a childish music, especially when the judgement comes without listening the mates music right?
I already record some good bass players, but none could play my music easealy(especially the serial).
In a reduced way yesthey play (when they onderstand the chord and do wathever they want) , but just remenber that Frank Zappa always said that his mucisians suffer to play his music.
But the really important thing is that we must not judge the quality or the playability of someones music.
Advice, help, sugest, impire, criticize with fundament YES, judge NO.
Also good guitarrists and bass players are becoming rare because buttoms and playbacks are instant gratification.

 

Exact. Arranging and Playing with VST instruments so that it sounds Truly Acoustic is an ART.
All I try for Years has been this when I use Sampled Instruments.
I've studied the Theory and Play technique of Many instruments to be able to Play them natural with midi Keys.

Remix does not understand what we talk about here I think.

First thanks for words.

I really try in forums not to answer such comments. I answered his first comment politely, Then REMIX came with that statement (no offence but i bet none of the basslines in your music are to hard to play with a live bass...)

What should I answer to?!!!
Better nothing.
In my songs Bass track Plays a main Role. I write more complex bass scores and my Bass Player can not easily play them as I play them on my Keyboard.
I created this Post because I know many other serious Music Producers who compose and arrange complexer music (using Jazz Harmonies) have the same experience and I want to see how they make their Fav. Bass Sounds.

This is exact what I expected Users to Answer. Thanks.
The Scarbee MM bass is the main Bass I use because of all Functions to imitate a Real Player but I could not tweak the sound as I like.
I will give your configs a try.

Remix I Just wanted to Thank You for really helpful comments!!

 

The great differecial of this forum are the helpfull mates that are always ansious to help
These priceless humans here must be preserved with vigilance and tolerance because, after all, they are mates too (but some repeat the error again and again...)
Everyone one have problems, some sacrifice a lot for music, but its important not enter in this kind of game.
Everyone can make mistakes? Sure, but reapeating is boring and can be an ancestral problem that we can healp just as an example.
Many complex questions are answered poorly, but great answers too.
I done many records with wanabees saying that the could play better, record better... they live in a western world that must have duel (and someone killed) each 12 oclock...probably to make them more secure
Seriously, Audiosex must be called University of Love because not everyone knows the ansers but everybody tries

About the basses:
No vst or synth do better basses then my Korg Z1, probably because its very clean harmonics, every time it sounds better and I still try to find a substitute. Its a shame that it do no have keysiwitches...
One of the best player I record had a borrowed 2 string bass and he only play with 2 fingers, was insane because q never ha a bass
The main problem with keyboard playes and bassists are loooog notes, a good players shortens everything and do longer full volume in special parts. Molstly vsts do not do really puntch staccatos like my Z1 do (its almost a slap similiar like Jco Pastorius play). Probably too, because of the quality of the filter...