Hello,

I produce on a PC and generally produce music that by the end has around 50-80 separate tracks (mixture of midi and audio but mainly midi). Because of this i can be using 100's of vst's in one project which often kills my CPU (i run a laptop and desktop, both with high end intel i7 processors and experience the problem on both).

I know about freezing and other basic methods of reducing CPU, but what i'm looking for is some kind of external processing unit that would handle the processing power of a lot of my vst's freeing up space on my computer and avoiding the horrible cracking noise i get when my computer prangs out.

I've done a reasonable amount of research and come across the old powercore units made by TC but as they're now discontinued this isn't really an option. Also its not too apparent as to weather this unit works with all vst files (both instruments and effects) or just specific plugins that have their own 'powercore version' of the software. I've also seen the UAD 2 satellite units http://www.uaudio.com/uad-plug-ins/uad-2-satellite.html - but these are only compatible with macs, and i believe only run UAD powered plugins.

Does anyone know of any hardware in existence that could do the job, or has anyone else come across this problem and found their own solution?

Any help and advice is hugely appreciated.

Cheers

 

Use ableton to freeze tracks

 

for external processing, theres no better way: UAD2 that also have 8core in Apollo (my dream). You have to pay, but a very good bundle comes with. They are compatible with most pcs too. Many people say that the uad is the best thing that them buy in their life.
Another way its to slave another computer to work with. With Logic is very easy (via logic node) and you can always build a hackintosh (recomended). If you work a lot with midi logic is the best and the tracks do not strain d cpus like steiberg line (for exemple).
Always Freeze the tracks.
There are options like Muse Research, than you can also use the plugin, but omly a few are cracked for that linux system.
Separing the libraries with raid hds and some sdds can help a lot.
Dependeds of your i7 generation, you can by on the ebay an used extreme 6 core version very cheap.
Hugs from Brazil

 

Don't know of any external gear, except another computer synced with the main computer.

But render/freeze/bounce/export/mixdown...and you will be fine.

 

Most of this DSP devices effects are really oriented to classic mixing work (ie. not VSTi).
Passed the >50 tracks, you have no other choice than bouncing, layering, ...
There's no UAD-style stuff to do what you seem to want, well, there IS, but they are very limited (not many compatible plugins).
A solution could be to have one or two computer "dedicated" to some instrument, a friend of mine is doing it, I don't know how it works, it's some kind music over lan, and works pretty well (despite being a pain to implement).

Do the layering. I have a Core 2 Duo , my projects would take >100 tracks, and I still don't have too many problem.
There's a cool feature in Ableton Live allowing to save/load "only one track" to/from a separate project. It allows me to work pretty well this way. (You will have to name your tracks carefully and reliably).

 

I'm not talking about "freeze tracks"! (It doesn't work so well, if you route your signal*)
+Freezing is not specific to Ableton.
Just basic resampling (every DAW can do it), or even export just a bunch of solo'd track, and put them 'outside' of the project (but you're still able to get back to it and correct some stuffs real fast)

(*side comp, gating, external effects, ...)

 

ether bounce the tracks converting the Midi to Audio use-is way less CPU or sell your PC's and get a Mac book pro and a Mac pro desk top i have had 12 Midi tracks AND 50 audio tracks going while i was Tracking and recording vocals and that was on a old g4 power pc mac now with my Mac pro i have not been limited at all they cost more but in the long run worth it

 

@ Party Enema,

Neither comments of my part, nor 'magic' formulas... just suggestions :


'MUSE RECEPTOR 2+ PRO'



This is a high-end product, thus the price is accordingly...

It exists another (more or less similar) product, smaller in size and in price !... but unfortunately I don't remember its name right now !
I'll try to remember its name and indicate (write) you some info about it. *yes*


ADDED AFTERWARDS :

I found it !

Here you have this cheaper product :


'SM Pro Audio V-MACHINE'






'SM Pro Audio V-Machine' available connections

 

Yeah I was talking about this.

It sounds real shiny and cool. This SMAudio thing.
But if you dig a little bit : it's a stripped down PC, with no display/network capability, 1GHz celeron, 512Mo RAM, 1Go HDD.
and it's 200€.
It's not taking the load outside the way UAD stuffs work. it's a very crappy little PC doing line in/out through an HDA codec low-cost audio interface.
Software side : it's Linux, implementing wine (a free software based implementation of windows), implementing VST. Not the whole VST norm is implemented, and not a full windows is implement. This mean : some simple VST work, lots of them work (with bugs, ending in glitches, and plugins hanging up), majority of upper commercial plugins (with protections) won't load. Their compat-list is short, mostly made of lower quality very old freeware plugins

ANY PC (and most tablets) will do a better job at this (taking midi signal, spitting audio through a bulky interface) for same or lower price.
I have an eeepc 704 (very same specs, 4Go SSD, same audio card), I would feel guilty to sell it for more than 100€, and it has a screen.

 

You should look into FX Teleport - that is what is deigned to do... run synths and fx on another machine over a lan cable with another pc. I never used it myself, so I can't tell you if it works well or not. This way you could just use the stuff you have now.

http://www.fx-max.com/fxt/index.html

This came out a while ago and the AiR version is still around on some popular torrent sites. It doesn't look like it's been updated since then, so maybe you should search for that.

 

Thanks for all the responses, some awesome suggestions. I looked into receptor 2+ yesterday but wasn't sure if i'd be able to run this in parallel with my DAW or weather it was just another computer free solution to playing VST's.

Defo gonna look more into the V Machine that's something new to me. But for now i've just purchased a Hex core i7 from ebay and will do a ram upgrade too when it arrives.

I've done the freeze/bounce methods quite a lot in the past but just find it so time consuming when i want to go back and edit the part. Not so much with the freeze method, but i generally am left with no option other than to bounce/resample just because of the amount of processes running. Also if i bounce everything down i have the issue of my hard drive trying to keep up with the 50+ audio files being simultaneously streamed. I bought a SSD to counter this problem, and although it works better than a standard hard drive i still get the same issue.

Its amazing how much cash i end up spending all for the love of my hobby.

Thanks again for all the responses, got a lot of stuff the start researching *yes*

 

It's really hard to believe someone can choke an i7 like that. Or even AMD 4 core, for that matter. You must be doing something wrong. What you should reconsider, Mr. Enema, is your knowledge of synthesisers. I know it feels cool that you don't want to spare any time to cut on the CPU usage of some plugins, but when your DAW is choking, it turns out to be a good practice. I do it almost like an afterthought, automatically, and it's not very time consuming to put a synth into a legato/mono mode when it's appropriate [bass, lead]. Things like reducing the polyphony on bass sounds and single sounds in general. Do you know how greatly that could cut your CPU consumption? Not just that. It could even make your projects sound better. Too much polyphony, and therefore unnecessary tails on sounds, can muddy your mix. Less polyphony, less stereo, make your mixes sound nice and clear, and they take MUCH LESS CPU.

And to answer your question: there's no external processing unit that can do that. The only thing you can do is buy hardware synthesisers and use those for making music. Synth and sampler plugins in general take up most of the CPU processing anyway. So you will be left with the FX processing only if you use hardware synths.

And don't worry, I see this happening all the time with people. Sometimes they give me the mix they're working on and when I see the mix is using 90% of the CPU I start digging, cutting unnecessary polyphony, putting high pass filters on, and the mix clears up instantly, and many times uses at least 20-30% less CPU! ;) It happens when we're in the "creative mind" that we don't pay attention to details. That's good. But later on, we should rectify that and make it sound better, ey?

Receptor is not going to help you so much [it's based on older processors], and it's expensive. It's just a computer in a rack after all. You're better off buying a new computer, connecting it through Cockos ReaStream and offloading some of the CPU processing onto it. Much cheaper and it works better. You can do synthesisers on one computer, and FX on another. But I would suggest you to take a look at your working practices first. Too much polyphony where it's just not needed is no good, and if you have more than ~8 sounds at one time fighting for the audio space, that's also no good. Your mixes must sound terrible if you're doing that. Save different sounds for different parts of the arrangement.

hmmm stuff like that

Keep on grooving. Cheers!

 

Thank you for assuming my mixes must sound terrible. My question was more to understand how I can streamline the process rather than 'feel cool'. As I have a full time day job and a family the time I spend producing is sparce and important to me so I get frustrated when wasting time having to jump from project to project when dealing with bounced audio.

Thanks for the reply though, there's always more to learn and I enjoy doing it

 

IF the overall aim is to reduce CPU, various members above have offered suggestions above.

Here's mine: check your VSTs.

Cockos REAPER shows you how much CPU each VST uses, and may change if you are playing or paused. based on this, you can turn VSTS off, or switch to other VSTs. Some VSTs may have quality settings. After this, you can apply the knowledge you gained to whatever other DAW you use.

For example, BREVERB2 is one of the lowest CPU VST reverbs, and sounds great. The internal FX of your DAW may use less CPU than extarnal VSTs, etc.

 

I really don't see how the Receptor solve your problem better than bouncing/freezing tracks. (this is what it will basically do, it will only take care of ONE channel at a time)

The workflow is your problem. The only person I saw using >1 computer for their producing purpose were for classical music scoring. (we're talking about HUGE samples, and hundreds of them). For electro and EDM, just get better practice. I don't think setting down quality of plugins is good idea, freezing/bouncing is the way.

 

@ PMS,

Well, first some of the features of that 'MUSE Receptor Pro 2+' (could also be applied to a similar product) to understand its main concept and utility :


- 1 TB drive (HD storage capacity)
- 4 GB memory (RAM Memory like that found in a PC)
- 3.0 Ghz Dual-Core Intel processor (a CPU like found in a PC)

You must to see that 'Receptor' as a computer by itself, but of course, without some features that are unique to a regular PC.

The main goal of this kind of product is to handle, by installing some (or all !) of your VSTi/VST Plugins within its provided HD (capacity 1 TB - certainly upgradable, but a bit off topic here), therefore to discharge the burden that must handle the CPU of your own PC in a regular situation to handle all the various VSTi/VST Plugins installed and running (loaded) within it, and above all, all their respective consumption in case that you use a lot of them simultaneously.
This way, your regular PC, can be greatly free up from sudden or constant 'loss of power' due to eventual CPU overloads...
You have then your regular PC that can handle solely your DAWs processes (eventually with some Plugins not too greedy, or those included with your used DAWs), then use the 'Receptor' (seen as a second computer) to handle the 'heavy artillery' among your others Plugins too resource intensive !

I stipulated the 'Receptor' features for that reason. I mean, there's nowadays only a few Plugins that really need more than a '3.0 Ghz Dual-Core Intel processor' to run properly without audio glitches and/or similar disturbing noises (maybe some VSTi like 'u-he DIVA' or similar, but this one is really greedy as Hell in CPU !!!). And I can only suppose that as VSTi/VST developers will take advantage of the constant and future growth of always more powerful CPUs, therefore creating more CPU intensive Plugins, MUSE will also upgrade its models accordingly... (e.g. 'Receptor Pro 3+,... ).

For the 4 GB of RAM Memory, the fact to have like some users have, say, 16 GB, 32 GB,... is more related to the use of HUGE 'Sound Libraries' that mainly rely on the use of these large amounts of RAM Memory to handle, therefore load more samples, to get them available 'in a breeze'...
At my knowledge, only a few (if existing) VSTi/VST Plugins really need 4 GB of RAM Memory, maybe those that rely on specific (or included) Samples Libraries, but that's another story...

And lastly, for the 1 TB of storage capacity, well, it lets you a comfortable margin to certainly store most of the VSTi/VST Plugins that you own...

I think that this 'Receptor' was thought and made mainly for musicians that are 'on the road', making 'gigs' or 'live concerts' regularly. This way, they have all their needed stuff (VSTi/VST Plugins) right at their hands in a small and handy 2 units Rack 19". They simply plug their instruments (guitars, basses,... ) for using their (audio) VST Plugins; or their keyboard(s),... for using their (MIDI) VSTi Plugins. *yes*

Maybe one of its drawback (if you're not a 'real' professional, rather a hobbyist) could be its price... but as soon that you're a professional in the sense that you earn your 'bread & butter' with the (your) music, you must to take in account that 'high-end' audio material is not given for free, or for some nuts... *no* that's logical ! Quality must be paid... *yes*

 

I've been playing around with many different DAW/VST/VSTi and external hardware combinations, but I tend to come back to a software-only solution just and only because of simplicity and total recall capability.
Managing routings and settings of outboard equipment (be it an external VST/VSTi host or analog hardware) can be a lot of work, unless you always use the same configuration and settings anyway ;-)
Yes, I sometimes DO use analog hardware (enhancers, EQs, vocoder, Nord Modular) for processing my hardware synths' sounds, but only for recording short sound fragments into the DAW once.
Today, quad core Intel's are not that expensive anymore and they're just perfect for audio! Be careful however not to mix up "i3", "i5", "i7" with the number of cores and read the specs well.
With enough RAM on a 64bit system you'll also have enough space for multiple sample libraries.

V-Machine is too weak, and instead of buying a Receptor Pro I'd rather go with a quality i5 or i7 laptop.

SineWave has made a good point in decreasing VSTi polyphony.

 

An i3 is more than likely enough for anyone and you should actually read into the difference between i3, i5 and i7 (you could choose an i7 over an i3 but you may actually just be paying for features you get no benefit from like AES).

The best advice in this thread so far has been to freeze/bounce/render audio, period. Party Enema, if you want to get rid of audio drop-outs then start bouncing audio, otherwise if you want to waste your money on hardware that you really don't need go ahead but your money could be spent much more wisely.

 

i have uad 2 duo card with almost every plug in available till now and it does great job for me regarding the technical aspect,far away best sounding plugs available as emulation of hardware pieces.But i don`t think you`ll solve your problem with overloading your cpu if you use lot of processing at once.best option for you is simply to throw your track on stems and work it like that.