Could you, please, provide audio?

 

The word you're looking for is better. Better ears. Children have much better high-end hearing than do adults. And once you hit middle age... I SAID ONCE YOU HIT MIDDLE AGE.

As long as when you do like it, you do turn it up, the point's valid. Of course, musical genres sound good at appropriate spl, Chopin piano sounds ridiculous played on the dime, as would thrash/metal bands played @ muzak levels.

That's the point. Human hearing is limited: some sounds are too quiet to be heard (e.g. a farting flea), and some sounds are too loud, causing hearing damage (e.g. a hand grenade going off 12" away from your ear). How does one manage to roll this wide dynamic range into the narrow spl band of human hearing (i.e. Wat do?)

Whelp, that's where compression comes in. We squish the dynamic range, amplify the farting flea to a point where we could hear it (let's say 100k times, while amplifying the hand grenade only 10 times, and then play everything back at a reasonable volume. Compression 101.
No info (detail, incert_audiophool_word_here) was lost, much was gained. we can finally listen to our farting flea AND the grenade, both at the same time

Above, if left uncompressed, would not allow the listener to hear the farting flea, no matter where he left the volume knob -- it would be drowned out by the explosion (or the explosion would burst eardrums).
Why is this so difficult to get across?

What an odd analogy, considering we're talking about music made by kids for kids :\

 

*expander


Edit:

Remember this thread? https://audiosex.pro/threads/how-does-lana-del-rey-achieve-her-vintage-cinematic-sound.32757/ ? I do.

Remember that 50s tune, used as teh pinnacle of vintage sound?


I do.

Why didn't someone tell OP: Compress compress compress! Why doesn't anyone complain about low dynamic range of 50s pop?

 

Last edited: Dec 9, 2017

One of the most famous preset settings in numerous Waves plugs like C1,L3, L3-16 etc is the "Uncompressor"

 

We are working on it. First tests werent promising using the Milton Krest technique, we`ve lost a famous producer. RIP Bruce Swedien.

 

Dynamic music does compete rather well with more compressed music when the objective is listening to music and the playback systems can actually move enough air to achieve equal volume.

In loud environments there are better isolated in ear molded monitors so that people can listen quietly and still enjoy their music without going deaf. The problem is as before - they are expensive, the guy that thinks fifteen dollars is already too much for headphones is not going to consider spending twelve hundred dollars to listen to his music on the subway.

Cheaper usually wins out with most people the most of the time and that's OK it is what it is.

In front of a large playback system when listening to most music the attenuator between the loud speakers and the output here is usually at -40dBVu for normal commercial music and most internet music, up to somewhere -20dBVu for streaming services that do -14LU - 16LU. Usually top out around -10dBVu for everything outside of calibration.

If you use the volume control in your playback software and keep your speakers hot you can actually figure out what loudness level is most comfortable for you as long as you have your speakers and amps set a known level. Orban makes a line level real time loudness meter that can give you relative levels to loudness and SPL. There is even a free version of it somewhere on their site.

I myself on a calibrated playback system tend to turn things down to -16LU - where pink noise at -0.5dBFS = 90SPL. This is just academic as I sometimes check for shits and giggles and to make sure my ears still work.

Also many times, even though I enjoy the song - I have turned it down, if you have a playback system capable of moving air and you are only 14 feet away from loudspeakers not turning down will start to hurt somewhere between 45 seconds to a minute and you can't actually tell the difference between 98dBSPL and 120dBSPL with your ears - resonant cavities in your head and chest have to provide feedback for you to know its louder, 120dBSPL is the pain threshold - 140dBSPL is instantly disorientating (sonic weapons work at between 135dBSPL-170dBSPL) once you get about above 140dBSPL you are talking about pressure waves that can not only hurt but cause temporary loss of hearing. Non-lethal stun grenades produce a concussive burst that is 170dBSPL.

As always, none of this matters, if you track/song is catchy doesn't matter if you distribute it at -21LUFS of -7LUFS it will work. If you make shit doesn't matter if you squash it to -4LUFS it still is going to be shit.

 

@Lambchop Really? How is your op music made by kids for kids. Better ears my ass lol... You can prove nothing because there is nothing to prove sad Googler. You cannot force someone to like something just because its louder, its their personal preference to play it or not. And certainly not fking compress the sht out of it because 99% don't know what the fk this is.
The whole debate is not about those who can actually use the fucking tools as they are meant to be used but about those who abuse them and made a trend out of this. The ghost note example is clear example of what's viable and what's not. If i put my pad channel at -40 db is because i want it there, it is because i want you to sit,listen and fucking search and find the sound and i will beat the sht out of anyone who dared raising my channel for all the wrong reasons. Get it ? And certainly i wasn't waiting for you to teach me what an expander is lol. You are barking at the wrong tree. But i will give you one shot. Try expanding Von_Steyr's waveform and good luck in the afterlife. Sheesh . Assh0le.

 

Solera has a de-compressor, FLUX have been putting decompression on stuff for a bit, it's just a more complicated transient shaper.

You can use a compressor with a variable attack and release to increase dynamic range as well.

 

We should take care of our hearing,although i don't like should or shouldn't
Most people know what an expander is,how many know when to use it,
IDK if i would ever enjoy a "SKRILLEX" or neurofunk type track if it wasn't loud,
and i would never enjoy a jazz,trip hop track,reggae track if it was very loud & squashed.
Grime music is well grime.

 

Not talking about Jo Safford, talking about today's pop, which is -- you got it -- made by kids for kids.

It's a fact. I can't prove it to you for the same reason I can't prove that A=A to a rusty bucket -- there are thing a rusty bucket is incapable of/unwilling to grasp

Not trying to force anyone to like anything -- you're talking about Warner Music producers, the topic of this thread. I'll hazard a guess they're qualified professionals and have a working understanding of compression. Not quite on ur level, but still...

Warner Music producers don't know what they're doing? This explains so much.

Stop, you're scaring the children. But I get it, you're a regular hit machine, churning out hits & raking in lettuce. Which is nice, albeit fails to address any of my points.

That rusty bucket I mentioned? Similarly ineducable. owell, can't win them all, nice chatting with you tho :\

 

Last edited: Dec 9, 2017

Agree. For some music loudness is the part of it's emotional context.

 

this is basically what i was saying when i said certain styles NEED to be limited and loud
no need to be an ass about this tbh? i hate when people start saying ZOMG THIS RUINED THE BUZINESS!!!1one!1 MUSIK IS SHIT TODAY!!1 etc yeah sure, maybe for you (and for me too to be honest, i don't like modern music), but guess what? the world goes on, the same way when cd surpassed vinyl and when digital formats and streaming surpassed cds. you wanna stick to vinyls because they have a higher quality? sure you can do that, but when you see 95% of the rest of the world listening to cds then don't go around screaming like an ape "omg these guys are such retards lol!! listening to cds!? vinyl is where its at" but im getting off track here. honestly its just us being grumpy and nostalgic, i feel like there's the need to be angry at something, so this loudness war buffoonery is a good place to start.

this is the point: PREFERENCES and different styles of music. besides there's a lot of miscommunication and misunderstandings. some people are talking about OVERLY SQUASHED tracks, which obviously sound like shit. there's a difference between that and actually squashing the RIGHT AMOUNT.

•edit
take a look at this: all tracks were made by me in different periods.
the fourth one is heavily squashed and is prolly considered shit by literally everybody who is gonna hear it or even just look at the waveforms. but hey, guess what? all the friends i showed the track to, liked it, none of them said anything at all about dynamic range gone missing? (oh btw it's not as bad as it looks lol) on another note: i would not imagine how horrible the first or the second track must sound if you squashed them like the third or fourth. again: different styles, different preferences. ps: all of this just from a newbie who enjoys making music every once in a while

closer res

 

Last edited: Dec 9, 2017

A bunch of [free] options, if you don't use a VPN:

TOR browser bundle: https://www.torproject.org/download/download-easy.html.en (slow but sure)
Web proxies: https://free-proxy-list.net/web-proxy.html
Web downloader: https://www.telechargerunevideo.com/en/finish?id=cD5FeMuzVg

Edit: Sometimes, sometimes being a lamb...

 

Last edited: Dec 9, 2017

And presets, we want your presets!!! lol

OMG lmao

I was just joking but I appreciate the informative answers. Indeed I know a compressor with a corresponding preset or enough editable curve feature can expand/decompress.

 

No you don't get it. Your semi-ironic minor-witted unsigned innuendos, don't mean much in my world brah.
I adressed everything that was to be adressed about compression when i spoke about how a ghost note should be treated. You obviously need to google this harder to understand it, look up you dictionary to find a couple of interesting words and then try harder to post some photos to make it an av experience. All show no tell baby.
How's a top10 album, a number1 remix single, 2 yrs of contracted constant weekly appearence in national tv, co-production with ex-Queen's producer, album with ex-Massive Attack remixer and quite famous dub producer, 5 years/6 days per week residency in the largest live venue in my country, 30 albums & numerous singles produced, rank up with your majesty ? I have done freelance work for Warner and Sony (before and after the merge with BMG here), EMI and Universal recs and released albums, singles, and remixes on all and more. And i know them all all so well (atm only Universal exists here, it has devoured every other major). I am co-founder of an indie label with 20 albums and many many singles released. And this ain't even the half of it. I don't need to disclose anything bro. My life's an open book. After all in relevance to where we are, i buy my softies thank you very much.
So yes, without any wailing trumpets, i think my experience qualifies me to speak about any Warner corporate moron or not who does obvious preset mastering with a one button push and everything on auto pilot.
The only reason i keep talking to you is a severe case of right arm tendonitis that keeps me for months from working in the studio.
So nuff said man. Show me yours and i will show you mine... And actually don't bother, i 'll start first.
Wanna judge my work ? i mean do you really feel you are THAT guy? Not that i could care less but here. Be my guest.
My latest work as a mastering engineer is a remaster job for a compilation which consists of 16 acts/bands and it's here:
https://www.discogs.com/Various-Music-From-The-Basement-Vol-2/release/10653595
My fav tracks from the compilation:

And no that is not my label but my ex-parner distributes this. And yes that is my dick you are steppin on, move over.

 

Last edited: Dec 9, 2017

Massive Attack's 100th window album is my all time favourite,so well produced

 

@Backtired Never meant to be disrespectful or offensive to you in anyway. It appears we agree on almost everything. But please, i never ever said music is shit today. I might reminisce as an older person, but i do not live by on nostalgia for the past. I try to live my life, like everyday is the last one i 'll be on this earth. What might not be apparent is that i LOVE electronic music. I just like to pick my poison if you know what i mean and will not settle for anything served just because it is signed by someone well known or not.
Where we disagree is that you claim there are certain styles that SHOULD be overcompressed, perhaps incinuating that brickwall limiting on every channel is somehow part of their style. Truth is, when every channel in your production has a comp and a brickwall raising every element to near 0db there is very few things you can do to keep someone interested : One is turn it louder lol, Two is keep fast switching timbres so you try to make an impression by creating a slight nausia effect to the listener. Both these are done to death. So, the question that occurs is pretty simple.
Would let's say, a typical Skrillex track benefit from less compression and more dynamics?

 

i don't know why,but i'm thinking of gain staging now.

 

The music is only as loud as my fingers allow it to be on the volume knob, but overcompressed music, shit, it makes me feel like my ears are bleeding so I just change the freeking channel, remember the moment and never listen to that shite again. @taskforce, nice work, I enjoyed the songs that you provided. Smooth, brother, a pleasant listen.

 

Who gives a sh*t? it's electronic music. What fan wants to hear a dubstep drop mixed at the same level as a Kenny G solo? Crank that shit up.