well you answered it yourself,
industry leader is nothing more than legacy player, all the big names in computer world (Microsoft, AVID, Steinberg, Adobe etc..) are getting ass kicked by newcomers who can provide significantly better feature set and usability for the value,
it's by design of company once it grows it's more expensive to keep running even without any programmers to continue development,
it's a sad truth in nowadays world long-term companies are not able to treat their customers properly and remain leaders in the industry only by bribing (pushing their products for almost free) every store, school and reviewer worldwide

now about Cubase, all those cutoff versions are ridiculously limited, only the Pro version is worth installing, so I guess your post mentioning only word Cubase is very misleading, Reaper can basically beat anything but Cubase Pro (but for the price it's not a fair fight either)

 

What a funny thread. It's like you said his wife or husband is ugly or somthing worse. Its just a Daw! On a personal note I think Steinberg with their exclusive forum, dongles and poor update support are an example of everything that is wrong with the capitalist model. Reaper on the other hand..............

 

@Vaijj yeh Support sucks...

@tvandlover well there you go, straight to the "your wife’s ugly" without understanding the post. However, the capitalist model is worthy of debate, why do lots of "industry standards" if there is such a thing get a bashing? But let’s keep it factual and non-insulting please?

Can I throw another player in to the debate here and say Waves.... I have a number of owned Waves plugins, I have never paid full price, $24 is my limit and they are one of the few plugins I can guarantee that will work when I load up that 10 year old project. Yet they get a bashing as well, why is that?

I agree that shareholders can suck the life out of a company, Pinnacle did that when they owned Steinberg, but companies do not survive without producing products that work and the market requires.

As I demonstrated earlier a substantial number of people on this form have invested a rather large amount of cash on Cubase despite alternatives, why do you think that is?

This post was never about who’s DAW is best, it’s about debate, choice, social inclusion and respect. The truth is rather more mundane, I've been off work sick and am bored out of my mind and fancied a good rant.

BTW saying that the most successful audio copy protection in the business (the elicencer dongle) is a negative really depends on your viewpoint…..

 

because never selling for full price and throwing deals is amateurish non-professional behaviour, imagine big studios and institutions planning budget, contracts and financing plans and Waves costs fluctuate so heavily it's literally impossible to come up with business cases at all, it's very annoying,
plus the fact the default Waves prices are so off, based on 25-year hardware counterpart prices essentially they would be completely ridiculous and obsolete nowadays if they weren't selling their plugins at fraction of price, there aren't even updates on plugins really, something like dynamic UI scaling being THE industry standard is something Waves don't give a fck about (yet the Mercury bundle official price is 7599$ lol)

 

I'm afraid there is a high probability that this one end up this way ... I hope not though.

 

Olymoon, I'm afraid you may be right... Still it fun while it lasted. I'll give up if someone can come up with better names than, Cubarse, Ablebum and Sleeper

 

you dont have even made your homework . the guy behind reaper has made many many money on the day he sold Winamp .

exactly shows your attitude and that you are frustrated with yourselves .

 

I've won the euromillions, and once i get the money, i will buy the entire Steinberg company.

Please write down which new features you want, i will forward them to the dev department. Thanks

But first, i will ask the devs to implement these features that should have existed in sx1 already:
- make the 10-20 last used presets available with a right clic, no need the mediabay just to pick 1 preset i use all the time
- let me choose the size of the icons on the different windows. The previous/next preset are 2pixels large, at 1440p or 2180p, we need a microscope to aim it, and the Parkinson disease will make it worse
-don't want to color the faders ? Make a thin vertical bar, with the track color, it will be better than nothing
- if a user owns wavelab/wavelab pro,why not let cubase users use the spectrum/bargraph/spectrogram visualizers from wavelab as a cubase plugins
- put 2 damn buttons on the plug-in windows, that will simply read the actions history inside cubase, to simply undo/redo the last actions (put 2 buttons, 2 lines of code...30 seconds..and it's done !)
- display cpu/memory by project/by plugin instance, instrument...why hidding it from the users ? If a user dls a plugin demo, and cubase reports 24% cpu per instance, on a 8core machine, maybe buying it isn't a good idea...
- in the mediabay, scan files by, at least, its checksum. .. so all files are unique. Currently, if i scan a folder with 5 subfolders, and i add 10 or 20 tags to each file metadata, do it to 300'000 sounds, during 12 months, if i simply rename one subfolder, or move all the folders to a different partition/folder, all the metadata is lost, because to cubase, different path= different files !
-let users choose the language of the newsletter.if a japanese guy moves to france, why couldn't him be able to receive all the emails in Japanese or english instead of default french..?

-stop squandering 30% of the steinberg resources and staff, and make one single cubase/nuendo version/engine, with all the nuendo features available as different packages: the guy will buy cubase, if he needs advanced video tools,or other nuendo features and tools, just buy them, cubendo will now activate the special features/extensions. Everybody wins. Cubase users will be able to easily try some advanced nuendo features, nuendo users will benefit from many Cubase features, many more cubase users will spend money on some advanced features, instead of NOT buying nuendo AT ALL, the time and money saved will allow devs to release faster updates, and code MANY NEW features, that both cubase and nuendo users will be able to use, instead of coding feature A for cubase, feature B for nuendo, feature C for cubase... etc etc


Once my devs will finish implementing the de features, they will immediately start coding your requested features. Please wait 2 or 3 months.

 

it really was fun.
the op really stroke a chord with this post. it was hilarious right through the whole damn text, not "ridiculous" or silly, just lots of fun! you could feel the anguish and torment he felt but had still to express those feelings carried inside all the way from that other thread lol.

if dramatised and read out loud many phrases were just awesome.
i was actually watching a movie with my girl, we almost fell out of the sofa laughing while I was reading it to her, she was very sympathetic though I must add.

.

 

It appears that you didn't understand what i was saying. I wasn't saying anything disparaging about anyone or their wife, I was simply using a figure of speech called a 'simile' to make apparent the banality of the ' my DAW is bigger than yours' argument that crops up regularly here. Reaper 60dollars
Cubase10 579 dollars I rest my case

 

Its to tempting.. i cant stand it.. i ju..ju.. just have to,,

Well you could get a blowjob in a back alley for 20 bucks or i can a full night at Hilton for a 1000.. whatever makes you feel good is good..

ofc no comparison what so ever there.. no no

 

Erm...about that back alley. Where is that? Just so that I don't stumble there accidentally.

 

I was one of the guys "bashing" cubase in the thread you mentioned. dont take it too seriuos, im just a stupid human too :D :D Cubase is fine as it is, you using cubase is just fine , see ya at the finish line bro

 

Exactly, Steinborg is fine.

 

I've said it several times over the years the best DAW is the one that works best for you. after spending the weekend messing with Protools I've falling in love even more with what I been using for years. Yes I understand Protools Industry standard yada yada yada . but for me personally its too tweaky, others are thin sounding while others are just loop toys. what I use does everything I need and is intuitive and more flexible giving you several ways to achieve what you wanna get done. it is the best FOR ME!!! I also like crazy red heads you my not but it docent make what you like better then what I like . this I know will not stop the childish bickering and bS negativity of what your not using because you think Brand x is better then Brand Y. enjoy what you have and make music you love and stop trying to change peoples mind. im not saying Protools is crap it just docent work for me that's all. In the end all DAW are just tools its int gonna make your music better that is all knowing your craft.

Lights, Guitars Chaos

evol and out

 

I was always partial to Noobase, Abletomoan & Derperderp myself. Or Reaperderper colloquially.

 

Are you sure you're not dog whistling to the Cubase supremacists?

Same can be said for any poll... Unless they ask for your purchase receipt to vote. Personally, I'd say no DAW is my favorite. I like most for different things. Then there's a lot of stuff if you dig deeper, like ease of accessibility vs usability (if you need to pay less or nothing + if you actually like using the software for what you do/like, anyhow), brand loyalty + buyer justification/remorse (paid so you have to stick with it or maybe defend a part of you that was disappointed), separating personal uses/biases and possible uses for specific or optimised workflows, habit (we are animals of habit and get emotionally attached)...

Take FL Studio. It's one of the oldest, historically cracked without too much fuss... Have seen it being crowned first in quite a few polls. Yes, it's probably not your first choice for scoring movies but does it matter (and it still probably isn't whether it's pirated or not)? Getting it cracked is probably one reason, established user base is another, access to tutorials on youtube is another, it being optimised for more electronic or beat-based music which happens to be the most popular is another, they do offer free lifetime updates etc. Could they be making more money? Probably yes, but they're still around.

Or look at u-he, non-invasive but pretty robust protection (serial + checks or what have you), portable installations, good quality. Still seems to be generally respected/praised both by crackers and pirates.

Or take EastWest. PLAY was a disaster in the early days. You couldn't try it, you had to buy to use it due to ilok (apart from some free edition back in 2011 or so, which they stopped offering). Buggy mess, lacking features compared to say Kontakt. Still bugs in some libraries. They don't allow resales. They have no upgrade paths for products (if you have a single license for a Hollywood library for example, it's usually cheaper to just buy the full pack on sale than buy separate instruments, which is kinda stupid, so you end up having spare unused licenses, but that's how they roll). It still lacks many features. These days it's way better in terms of technical performance but personally I'm still not entirely happy with it, mostly usability-wise (note: purge sucks). It's usable but it's not really geared towards tweakers... Play Pro is pretty much a meme at this point. They do seem to replace licenses if you lose them. Compare that to VSL that will ask you to pay 50% to replace them (maybe not if you actually send them a broken key). You can justify it but it doesn't really feel good.

Intersecting with this, there's something to be said about being established and well protected and having relationships to manage. It may let you sit on your ass and be assured that you can go slower because you feel too safe where you are (like Logic, Cubase or ProTools which at some point you will probably HAVE to use if you're professionally engaged, whether you like them or not). Yes, piracy may be unfair competition but you also need to make your customers feel respected and there's only so much you can push before you see some cracks which may or may not contribute to a collapse considering all these parameters. At least they allow resales... That's to say there's nothing inherently wrong in complaining or having gripes about some stuff or requesting features (how else will they see issues and address them or improve?) but it's better if you try to do it constructively and respectfully. In general, I think it's better to demand more, keep them on their toes. Improvements, demos, trials, feature implementation etc. (Example: At least you can try some VSL stuff on try-sound and you can at least get a trial month on EW, even if paid) Others refuse DRM out of principle. Anyway, overall it's good to challenge businesses but also support if you extract value or are satisfied (resources can be limited). Should strive for balance; we want them to be around after all, don't we? They should also be allowed to fail (unlike, say, banks, but I digress).

Same goes on in games (Day 1 updates, monetisation, DLCs, Steam/DRM/store policies/piracy, review bombing/reviewing [developer shielding vs consumer satisfaction/backlash], politics and other issues), graphics, subscription services, ownership, property rights... Good and bad, hard to balance. Nobody said this was easy, there are many parameters.

Reaper is great, supports customisation, many open formats... You will probably need third party plugins though and major upgrades are paid, although technically you can use for free. S1 is also great, a breeze to use, straightforward, lacks advanced features, weak MIDI tools... Logic is good but does need a MAC... DP needs a microscope* for me and seems bloated as hell and frustrating to use but maybe if you do movies or need some feature... Cubase is full-featured but to me it still feels frustrating to use. They all have their quirks and frustrations.

And as annoying or imperfect as it may be, I still appreciate this forum for allowing a lot of stuff to be said no matter who says it. Whether they wanna troll or engage or have bought or haven't. It does allow for some leeway with honesty of opinion, if not of morality. It's good to discuss these things, even if they may get heated at times. Tolerance goes both ways. Also the way you deal with it.

Bias and misinformation will always exist, we should strive to make discussion easier and facts more discoverable. I do think the thread is framed quite well, it can be constructive. There should still be some room for banter, even some offense; no need to fight all the time. And sometimes our POV needs to be challenged.

Don't really feel like I have a horse in the race. I do appreciate issues being brought up and points being made. It expands my view. I can always challenge it, utilise/compare it in/tp my own research/experience, adopt/nitpick/question partly or fully or ignore it. Guess I'm not directly refuting the OP, more like embellishing it.

Use what works for you. And pick your battles I guess...

Phew, that was long, can we get back to memeing? Last but not least, subscribe to Pewdiepie.

Edit:

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Waves+WUP
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Waves+WUP+site:vi-control.net
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Waves+WUP+site:gearslutz.com
*Edit 2:
Case in point: ...the whole UI is now scalable.

 

Last edited: Feb 3, 2019

Cubase is king.

 

I think we need to start cussing on Cubase a lot moar in this topic! Main gripes are: they haven't fixed the global / local thing on (ie) input transformer. There should be a "per project" option, that acts a bit like "global". They still do that stupid thing where MIDI & audio are split into two things, instead of both being accessed easily nao - you have to go to mix to change stuff. Also lots of issues w/ audio and the way it's dealt w/ (too many to mention.) Also the way you can "lose" stuff you've "quantise learned" easily (doesn't even "add" to any list except super temporarily for a nanosecond.) Automation is still borked af frustate-a-thon, but that's every DAW evah. Most of what @wouala woualouf said, especially about pixel "art". It's a general rule (even if you use keys to death) that the smaller something is in Cubase, the moar important / moar used it is! Also: welcome to new bugs, same as the old bugs in every update. Kinda.

To be fair, I think Paris Hilton does it for free nowadays, it's moar like a hobby I think? (I guess having your genitals quarantined and burned and seperated from humanity, blown out of an airlock and nuked from orbit afterwards prolly costs moar than a grand tho? =)

 

Totally