Do you have experience with "Analog Summing" ?
Have you ever tried working with ?

Dangerous, SSL, Neve, Antelope, SPL....

Some people say it's useless and it's just a marketing product.
Others say it's essential when you mix all in the box, like me.

Do you recommend this kind of device ?
Which ones and why ?

Thank you for sharing your experience and your thoughts on the "Analog Summing"

 

I'm using a Soundtracs Topaz mixer for summing, processing VSTs, hardware samplers and synths, and even voices [nice sounding preamp IMO], with some outboard compressors and guitar pedals connected to it.

First thing you must understand about analog summing is that it sounds *very subtle* and a lot of people can't even hear it. It won't make your mixes immediately shine after putting it through it. It's like the old golden audio rule: garbage in=garbage out. However, in this case you get better quality garbage out.

What analog summing does is give each sound a little bit of randomness [phase, eq, volume], so you get a wider stereo image, plus summing happens in the analog realm, so the audio mixing resolution is infinite - no digital artefacts at all [not that anyone can hear those, at -144dB or more ]. My take on it is that I really like the wider image that you get on stereo channels from all that analog randomness. Processing multiple buses through it is definitely beneficial.

If that's your first outboard hardware you're considering to buy, I would rather suggest some compressor or a saturator device first. These things make more difference to the sound, and you don't have to worry about any badly sounding digital artefacts that usually creep in with ITB digital compressors, saturators, and distortion plugins [all that deal with dynamics and harmonics], so you will be able to deal with the "garbage in" part of the equation better.

Cheers!

 

Last edited: Mar 19, 2019

Analogue summing is all about adding distortion. Pleasant sounding distortion. If you’re sending your 2 buss out to a summing mixer and then straight back into your DAW for mastering, don’t expect more than a gnat fart of an audible difference. The real mojo comes from multiplying your passes through analogue transistors & circuit networks. For example with tape: when you do several bounces it doesn’t take a very critical ear to hear the difference especially if levels are hot. But if you were record say on a Studer A 827 that’s been well maintained & calibrated you wouldn’t hear much of a difference than if you were to record that same information ITB... Cheers!!

 

Yes, I forgot to mention that it's adding distortion and harmonics, thus making your tracks sound a bit more in your face and brighter. Exactly what the VST saturators do. Thanks @Moogerfooger!

 

I use the studer emulation by universal audio. But the real studer 800 is even better. I like this sound a lot! It all depends on what goal you want to achieve.

 

It's most definitely not useless, but the way a lot of plugin developers handle the issue of summing is pretty useless. So you'll get a load of marketing and then just some junky convolution response with a pretty GUI slapped on, so you listen to that and think to yourself "what was the fuss all about?".

Look up "Console" by AirWIndows. It's free, no restrictions. Stripped down to the max, no GUI at all just some sliders and it will get you 95% of the way to the "analog summing" sound while not using a lot of CPU and fully in the box. After listening to it on a couple of mixes, the difference in how it sums your channels is obvious.

Another route you can go would be Nebula. It's very flexible and the focus on exact emulation of specific famous consoles. Sounds really good. The downsides is that it's expensive and eats CPU like crazy.

 

I'm talking about true hardware analog summation and no plugins.
here are some examples:

 

It's not relevant if those are plugins or hardware. The principle is the same. Quality is different but thats all.

 

Thank you for sharing your experience and your thoughts on the "Analog Summing"

 

I really enjoy using Airwindows Console system. It takes a different approach to mixing as you can't move your DAW faders, unless the DAW lets you load the plugins post fader. It's great.

Would like to try analogue summing some day though.

 

Expensive thingies, for such little gain. Overrated IMHO.

But if you have a 1mil $ mastering studio, this would maybe be worth it. On the other hand a 1mil $ mastering studio has all the best outboard they would need, so no need for a measly OTB sub-summing mixer.

I think these boxes are a bit of a snake oil for those who like to see their pockets empty. Or maybe mid range studios who do have enough money, but still do most of the things ITB, and have some outboard equipment, too.

As I said, there's very little gain to be had with just a summing mixer as your outboard hardware. Not worth this kind of money. But if you shit money as a hobby, yes - give it a go.

 

Last edited: Mar 20, 2019

Thank you for your comment SineWave
It responds very well to my question.

There are many very different opinions about analog summing.
I never had the opportunity to try this hardware or compare with software versions.

It's nice to have yours comments if you have already tried this kind of devices, and have your opinion.
Thanks again

 

Usually, it is for cohesiveness, glueness, and as said, slight saturation/colour, mojo/vibe, hum and noise, stereo randomness and crosstalk stuff, 3Dness and depth, phase distortion. Subtle or very subtle, sometimes slightly noticeable.

Digital DAW summing is clean, linear, flat, neutral, ideal/perfect. Maths. 1+1+1...
Digital emulations of analog summing and mixers/desks give you results much closer to analog mixers and summing hardware.
True analog hardware summing is not simple maths, or even completely not... it is a whole world of architecture.

Usually people don't hear difference.
Performance, production/arrangement, recording, editing, restoration, processing/mixing (eqs, reverbs, saturation, compressors, etc), mastering are more important for you, and more obvious, than summing in analog or digital or thru emulations. Knowledge, skills, experience, work are important. Doesn't worth buying hardware mixers or summing stuff, better to buy a processing stuff, or mic or preamp or synths or any other instruments/tools, acoustic treatment, converters, plugins etc. Use console/desk/mixer emulations instead. Use by taste.

Music is important.
Quality too.

 

I think the best analogue summing you could buy would be a Revox B77.

 

Which hardware/stompboxes distortions do you use with your synths,please?
I'm actually thinking to buy some;I've read some artists process their synths with these ones.
Some stompboxes are affordable,it could be interesting to try that for me.

 

Please, no porn, I thought that this was a family site!

 

Part of the magic of listening to music of yesteryear (as well as a tiny bit today), especially on the original vinyl, was that every song on every single album, from the Beatles to the Beach Boys, from The Fugs to Frank Zappa was mixed and as well as recorded using some kind of desk as well as the warm characteristic of magnetic tape. Most rock music traveled through sometimes incredible lengths of wire, picked up vibe cursing through transformers and the tubes of some outboard compressor's circuit. Sound was captured with microphones (sometimes directly into the board, think Beatles) punching through air. The audio medium has greatly changed, first for the worst when the CD was first introduced, and now these days has upped its game and is coming closer to, but can never actually be the same as analogue. There is a difference between dreams of wire compared to dreaming in binary. Some time in the future people might not know the difference and maybe not care, but they won't know what they have lost as the new becomes the norm. Such is "progress", such is life.

 

https://mixanalog.com/

As far as experiencing analog summing yourself,mixanalog could be an interesting choice. Basically, it's an online service you connect to and book a studio session and connect through a tunnel to remote controlles actual hardware and cun run you tracks through it and monitor it with a little latency. Haven't tried it yet but I will at some point.

 

I think what you meant to say is not quality but different sounds.

A person can totally prefer songs summed by plugins and not hardware. Better stay with VSTs.

Plugin Alliance have their channel strips which have TMT , Waves NLS, or any plugin will do TBH. They all sounded good. No hardware processor is going to give you better mixes or masters.

Also if you want ANALOG, here is a cheap alternative and many of their stuff are free too and you even get free credits when signing up.

 

Yes, I thought about changing this. But then I thought that most people probably like the sound of the hardware more so I simply left it .