Okay, so this is something I've been struggling to understand for a while, basically I want to know what a full song contains in terms of instruments and how it should flow.

I already know the whole verse-chorus-bridge (or whatever order you're choosing for your song) but I've had trouble actually sitting down and writing them down, or figuring out how they should sound. I've gotten vocals down, it's just instrumentals I need a better understanding of.

As for Genre, I'm focusing on Rock, Pop, or just good ol Dubstep/EDM (no real specifications within the last two)

So if anyone has a good explanation or knows of any good sources online, please link them or explain!

Thanks a lot~

I have years of using actual music theory under my belt, but it's understanding the composition process that's challenging me...

 

It's easy. You have to listen to music, carefully, genre by genre... 1 time, 10 times, again and again... I don't know a better way.

 

You mean Intro, verse, pre-chorus, chorus, verse, pre-chorus, chorus, bridge/middle8, chorus, chorus?

It's all down to you. There are really no fixed rules what instruments to choose, or how to arrange your track. Even though there are "templates" (as mentioned, VCVCBCC) you are able to break these rules. I have have my way of doing things and the guy next door has his way. So has Max Martin.

Find songs that you like and analyze them, composition- and arrangement wise.

 

Good ideas! Maybe I'll for a few producers who have released a few of their project files and analyze them. Thank you!

 

Here's another one of these types of questions...
I'll answer you though.

Can you play an instrument? If yes, solving your current dilemma is easy. if no, well then not so much.

Basically, Music theory/and Rhythm is to music; as grammar is to languages. Whereas, learning songs is to music; as vocabulary is to languages.

In other words, you've read a bunch of grammar books before you have learned any vocabulary so can you can't speak or think in musical terms. Let alone on multiple instruments. So to solve the problem, if you can already play an instrument you need to just learn a bunch of songs. Like a lot of songs. Plus, after you have learned a song on your chosen instrument, on future hearings of the songs listen to and tune out the instruments you can't play. For example, I've transcribed vocal and horn parts on my guitar or string parts on the keyboard. There's no limit, get creative.

I find it ironic when i see similar posts about people in this predicament. Because for myself, life caused me to learn these skills the other way around. So writing music is an organic process that will remain so no matter how much "theory," I learn. Because the process was similar to a child learning their first language. But if you just read music theory by itself it one misses out on that.

Also, don't you know it's art. Meaning, a basic song can contain only a piano, or guitar, or violin, or whatever, you the author so desires. In fact most composers and songwriters start/ and or finish their songs on one instrument. I do. Another thing I've noticed, if you have a hard time finishing a song on one instrument, it gets exponentially harder per each new instrument you add. Especially, if you can't play those instruments.

Cheers

 

At least for EDM there are tons of tutorials on how to build songs of different house and EDM genres. There are many differences between them there is no one fits all explanation. Maybe check out the other website and look there for some video tutorials. Or visit some of the schools like sonic academy or else.

 

Faoki, is that you?

Anyway I suspect its the musical form you're trying to figure out and its part of music theory

 

Last edited: Apr 19, 2016

I really don't know why people here do not share their projects if they don't make money from them. One of them is better than a million lines of suggestions.

Most of us usually work with illegal contents so I think it's time to be a bit generous. Charity will make us more safe.

This topic is the problem of most of us. We should accept that we are not good story tellers like pop/rock artists do on TV.

Who is able to understand what "4 minutes" means better than a musician/composer?

 

Last edited by a moderator: Apr 19, 2016

I read this twice and I still don't know what you are trying to say.

 

Or you can just listen (mp3s, youtube, radio, whatever) and analyze them.

 

He means we should share projects in this kind of topics instead of trying to explain in words.

 

But why? One can just drag in an mp3 or whatever into the DAW and analyze it. Then you can pick a track which you like the arrangement of, and study/understand why that arrangement is good. Lightweight and quick.
It's not rocket science.

 

Last edited: Apr 19, 2016

Most of the video tutorials contain project files. I personally doubt that OP will have much to learn from a project without a explanation on what is going on in it. Because you will miss much of it just by looking at someones project, at least I would. I still would check out Audioz and look through the Education section.
I also think that this can be more beneficial than just listening to music. Especially when you want to learn technical things, like sidechaining right etc. You wont learn that from listening.
At least as I understand the first post it's not about arranging a track, it's more about how to build it and make it sound right. That cant be learned just by listening to other songs imo.

 

Last edited: Apr 19, 2016

It's even harder than that if you want to yield a new work.

Intricacy is what we can not learn more by listening. We need to have each others' works telling step by step what we need to do.

3rd world countries have Europe and North America in front of their eyes and want and try to be like them but why they are not able to do that?

 

There is a great tutorial on our sister site: Sonic Academy - Mixing an EDM Wall of Sound with Soundprank. I found it real interesting even though I don`t like the genre.

Basically it`s about mixing but check his arrangement. Also you can download/buy templates for your daw which also give you an insight.

Check the music theory tutorials as well and as you do listen to music you like, try listening in an 8 bar mode (I can`t express myself better, sorry).

 

Last edited: Apr 19, 2016

This is another reason, prohibiting our sharings. Why do we escape from sharing?

It seems that we love our projects more than each other even more than our family.

 

Last edited by a moderator: Apr 19, 2016

The main problems are: 1 you need to be using the same DAW. 2 You need to be using the same edition of that DAW. 3 You need to have all the same vst's. 4 You would need copies of any samples that may have been used, and that's before you can even start.

You might want to check out splice music.

 

So, which is it – you want help with arrangement, or with composition?

 

as i see it, there are 2 ways to approatch this

the technical way
the thinking/mental GAME

the creative way
the emotion/feeling GAME

they go hand in hand. or not at all

I know personaly people who approatch music as a mental game. To those i sudgest they should try viewing it as "problem solving" rathern than a "understanding".

dunno if this helps

 

I'm sorry, but you make no sense at all.

Listening and understanding has everything to do with music theory, composition and arranging (and learning those qualities).