Same line I’ve seen in all my years of doing music.

“the best use of DRUM MACHINES is non use”
“the best use of SAMPLERS is non use”
“the best use of a DAW is non use”
“the best use of DJ SOFTWARE is non use”
“the best use of AUTOTUNE is non use”

These all created new genres, new ways of performing, expanded creativity, lowered the barrier of entry to participation in music creation.

the old guard is upset at the new participants creating music in a way that threatens their identity. While the new players use a combination tools at their disposal on point of entry

 

Progress cannot be stopped. The best and cheapest will prevail. Legislators should set the rules.
The question is how much money consumers still have in their pockets.

I think China, with its 1.6 billion inhabitants, will win the race.
And we will continue to have to measure ourselves against China.

Even old musicians with old opinions die eventually. The younger generation has everything in its hands.
India and China educate their young people well, so the implementation of AI will not be a matter of skilled workers.

 

i used AI very effectively recently, i made a DnB track but needed some vocals, this is what i came up with.



i used GrokAI to generate the rap lyrics, didn't even bother to look at them, then i pasted them in to https://www.riffusion.com/
i made about 20 drum and bass tracks at 170bpm with various data, upbeat, jump up.etc, with male London rap vocals. .NY rap version..
some were not too bad, but i was only wanting the raps. i also did other female vocal versions. also with words from Grok.
i downloaded about 7 files that i picked that i though could be used, in wav, then i used "stem separation" to get rid of the generic AI music and placed the remaining vocals on my own track,. I had to change my arrangement a bit to suit the lyric. then mixed, added echo and edited parts, to make work , i did the double track of two vocals to get them to sound like two guys taking turns. incredible what you can do now.


ME: Grok can you make rap that is about Macro Data Refinement from the TV show severance

Here's a rap about Macro Data Refinement (MDR) from the TV show Severance. I’ve kept it spoiler-light and focused on the vibes of the mysterious, mind-bending work the characters do at Lumon Industries. Let’s get it:

Verse 1
Yo, clockin’ in at Lumon, suit pressed, mind split,
Severance in my head, reality’s a glitch,
Macro Data Refinement, what’s the gig about?
Numbers on the screen, but the truth’s blacked out.
Fingers on the keys, tappin’ through the haze,
Files feel alive, like they’re watchin’ my ways,
Wellness check’s a trap, keep my feelings tight,
Innie on the grind, outtie’s outta sight.
Chorus
MDR, MDR, what’s the code we chase?
Digits in the dark, lost in inner space,
Refine the macro, but the meaning’s thin,
Lumon’s got my soul, where do I begin?
MDR, MDR, trapped in the grind,
Severed from the world, severin’ my mind.

Verse 2
Helly’s got the sass, Mark’s got the stare,
Dylan’s spittin’ facts, Irving’s sayin’ prayers,
Team in the cube, fluorescent glow,
What’s the data do? Man, we’ll never know.
Kier’s on the wall, preachin’ from the past,
Every keystroke echoes, shadows that we cast,
Feel the numbers hum, eerie in the flow,
Refinement’s got a pulse, but it’s movin’ slow.

Chorus
MDR, MDR, what’s the code we chase?
Digits in the dark, lost in inner space,
Refine the macro, but the meaning’s thin,
Lumon’s got my soul, where do I begin?
MDR, MDR, trapped in the grind,
Severed from the world, severin’ my mind.

Bridge
Break room’s a cage, coffee’s cold as ice,
Wellness lady’s words cut like a knife,
“Feel the data sing,” that’s the company line,
But these numbers haunt me, messin’ with my spine.
What’s the endgame here? What’s the bigger play?
Refinin’ all this macro, but it’s slippin’ away,
Severance is freedom, or so they claim,
But MDR’s a puzzle in a corporate game.

Outro
Yo, punch out, punch in, cycle never ends,
Innie’s got no fam, outtie’s got no friends,
Macro Data Refinement, it’s the life I lead,
Lumon’s in my brain, plantin’ every seed.
MDR forever, that’s the rap I spit,
Severed from myself, tryna make it fit.

How’s that? I leaned into the eerie, surreal vibe of Severance and the mysterious nature of MDR. Let me know if you want any tweaks!

ME: that will do Grok, thanks

 

I’m confused at your question. There are payment tiers on Suno, with millions of current users. Like most software and services there are layers of payment for extra features. Better models, stems, DAW style editing. These are all being developed currently. Where they are today is just a tease at where they will be tomorrow. Ableton 1 vs Ableton 12 is a giant leap over decades. This will be the same for Suno. Adding features for the pro music maker and the novice.


There is also a new paradigm we’re not taking into account that’s emerging. There is a new way of experiencing music happening in this era. Sunos community of creators are a whole new breed of music maker that is not existing in the old paradigm of DSP. They are music creators in the non Conventional sense that their music only lives on that platform. It’s a new DSP. Just like a Spotify, SoundCloud, this platform could possibly be a new form of distro. I can see it being like twitch. They built a new place for their creators to become the new television. Where their creators can make a new style of show that might not conform to the old paradigm while getting compensated in this new paradigm.


What all of this looks like is to be determined. Suno could be the MySpace for the next Facebook.

 

I agree with a lot of this. Idk if there will a finish line.

china is definitely leading in innovation with their limited access to hardware and chips. So if they get a head in the race other countries can just apply that to their tech and step ahead.

what countries will support the emerging industries from this? Teach and support the next generation using these tools.

FWIW I saw a headline where the US just signed a deal with the UAE for AI innovation. I didn’t read the article so I don’t know details. But this means money & power. Also a signal that this is being looked at as the new resource.

 

Love it! This is one of the many ways people
Have been using these tools for a while now.

I think most people think AI is input output and write off the power of the tools. It’s easy to get mad at something without understanding.

in early sampler days you could only sample limited amount of seconds. So people used tricks of sampling at fast speeds and slowing the sample down in the sampler to could get more time.

We can all use any tool as it’s not presented to build our art.

Spoiler

Some unsolicited riffusion tips.

Their lyric model is pretty impressive. Try writing in there.

If you are paying for it. Try their vibes feature. You can upload a snippet of your original track and it will perform well the prompted lyrics to your song and have better key and time adherence.

 

Hey does anyone have any experience in generating AI music videos with Plazmapunk (one famous example)?

Clichéd example, but let's say I wanted generate something like this (as a video/animation), or anything else really:

 

Firstly, it's about market share. China is pushing ahead, and America is following behind, trying to reach their quality level to gain market share and buyers for their products.

AI is the business of the future, one that can still make money. The full potential of AI is far from being realized. However, China will not be allowed to become a monopoly and dominate the business; instead, America is doing everything it can to catch up with China.

Furthermore, AI is being used by the military to gain an advantage over its opponents. That's why there's so much espionage and idea theft. Suno, etc., only make up a small part of AI. The financially strongest buys the workforce on the global market. As you can see, everyone wants to be ahead and win the race; ultimately, we'll see what will last.

 

Oh man, I'm laughing my head off, the AI is doing what it was programmed to do, it's hallucinating and in the end some of the crazy things come out, it does feel quite strange when you read it, but that fits in with the crazy times we live in, it only gets difficult when you believe what is, thank God we still have a filter in our heads that then says it's nonsense and rubbish.

Some of the things the AI does, like pictures for example, there was a picture here of a man with three arms, I find really intense and it gives you a taste of what we'll be confronted with then, at least I have a mouse and can click it away.

 

Not advocating the non-use of any of those above. When you assume things like that you just make yourself look bad... I just advocate the non-use of the so-called "AI" because it's a sham - noise creation for the brain-dead...

"Duhhh, I pressed a button and made a song!! Aren't I talented??"

This is what you're defending? Good luck with that...

That is about the biggest line of b.s. I have seen in a while.

 

Last edited: May 14, 2025 at 10:21 AM

Of course, there are always people who presume to say, "You should do this or that." But ultimately, it's up to them to decide what they install and use on their PCs at home. Most musicians decide based on usefulness and price, as well as the quality and capabilities of the product; there's no pressure to buy.

 

I didn’t assume that. I’m expressing my personal experience. Not attacking you.

You are isolating a single use of a tool and blanket classifying it. yes some people press a button on any of the tools I listed ai included.

anyone can press a single key on a keyboard, play on a dj player, generate button on a ai prompt.

or The exact opposite spend 10000 hours on any of those tools.

there still is objectively bad music and performances coming out of every aspect.

tool use, taste, curation will always help the cream rise to the top.

As for the line of bs you say. From my
Perspective I’ve seen the old guard say that for every new tool I listed.

“vinyl is better than dj software, samples are cheating, drum machines don’t sound like real drums”

one person might think that but new genres have been invented by the new lane these tools have paved the way for

 

Last edited: May 14, 2025 at 12:22 PM

An example of the grey area.

A-trak and Paris Hilton both use Serato to dj with. Both use the technology in a way that reflects their performance. One presses a button and reflects your “talented” thoughts.

one can manipulate, reproduce, ai separate stems, and fully take a song and make a 1 of 1 version of a song like a jam band would using the exact same tool.

 

yep! Use my website http://weights.com you could upload that image into our video model. Or even train a reference of the art style you want and animate it after image generation.

 

yep thats capitalism baby! That machine has been going well before AI. It’s deeper rooted problem than tech.

Same goes for idea theft. Countless numbers of songs with the same chords.

Most genres have been created on a base idea.

Elvis, Beatles…… current pop…... All have taken from the ideas of others.

it’s arguably like their dataset was trained on other peoples work and they generated their algorithmic interpretation

 

Last edited: May 14, 2025 at 11:42 AM

Having an idea is the beginning, then comes the implementation of the idea, and then you need investors or cash to bring your product to market. Then you have to be successful and sell a lot of products so you can pay your employees and everything else.

Then you also have to fight off global competition and fend off many attacks from hackers and fraudsters. As you can see, running a company and manufacturing products isn't as easy as it looks.

It's always been easier to let someone smart break into a bank and then take the loot, but that's highly criminal. As you aptly pointed out, @curtified, other hard-working people often have their work and ideas stolen. Or, as a competitor, their raw materials are bought away, and in the worst case, they simply burn down their production facility.

That's why you should team up with professionals who already have security and other things in place. Together, not against each other.

 

Everything on this youtube channel is made with AI – music and videos

 

I know all of this well. We built http://tryreplay.io that evolved into http://weights.com then we got funding from kleiner perkins that evolved into our new app voyages https://www.reddit.com/r/weights/comments/1kdyivd/voyages_its_here_our_new_ai_image_generation_app/

This brought me on as an advisor for Suno as well as work with Riffuison. I truly have first hand experience in the tech/business space as well as emerging tech. I also am at 20 year music professional.

 

Last edited: May 14, 2025 at 12:59 PM

Congratulations @curtified and thanks for the links. Good luck, and hopefully AI won't put too many musicians out of work.

 

No, it's not arguable in the least as human minds are not simple binary code and do not ever spit out algorithmic interpretation of the information that we have absorbed through our individual human filter of emotion, learned language and cultural relevance. Your's seems as a tilt towards gaslighting those that disagree with you that creativity has anything whatsoever of letting, in this case, something do the actual creating for you. Your's is rationalizing at best for curating as is someone choosing the artwork for a gallery or a Spotify playlist that could consider themselves the actual artist. Your mentioning previously "the old guard is upset at the new participants creating music in a way that threatens their identity is just another bad excuse and not in the least accurate for like 99% of the people of previous generations as we couldn't run towards digital recording fast enough to distance ourselves from tape's inherent limitations, associated costs and the constant need of maintaining those machines. Plugins are amazing, cost effective and a wonderful gift. And your statement that instead of cultivating style through actual creation of ideas and instead "While the new players use a combination tools at their disposal on point of entry"" bypass actual learning in how to create for themselves is a dangerous and destructive idea for art and artists in the current and future generations that will be as cripples without their artificial assistants doing the hard work for them. If that kind of commercial sludge becomes normalized and accepted as actual art there will be a dark cloud over humanity and a shame to have let our humanity slip away from us.

As the volume of "AI" generated music and art grows ever larger AI will be feeding on its own self generated output like some kind of grand snake eating it's own tail until there's nothing left but a nib that is useless to itself and laying inert on the cold ground unable to feed itself, heal or fend for itself as a mirror of what we are doing to ourselves for even thinking that this is all a good idea.