I live in a studio apartment, and recently installed an ikea loft bed. I turned under the bed into a little reading area / ableton push creation / vinyl listening lab. I realized very quickly that when under the bed, the noise from my upstairs neighbors is greatly reduced. Id say its cut by like 20db or something. The low drone of their AC, the chatter from their tv, even footsteps all greatly reduced.

Im now thinking i could build something similar to frame out my studio desk. Im thinking 2x4's as a frame, plywood on top, with rockwool panels on top of that. Maybe side panels as well, or at least thick curtains. What are your guys thoughts on this? Has anyone built something like this? I cant do any serious building, as its an apartment, but i think a simple frame should be fine, and even if it reduces the noise by a little bit, id be happy. Materials are not that expensive, and my father is a great carpenter.

Yah, any thoughts, suggestions, "dont be an idiot, do this instead", are very welcome!

 

You should actually force your neighbor to install impact sound insulation. However, you usually have to sue for this (with the tenants' association). The tenants' association would hire an expert (€100-150), which you would have to pay yourself. The expert would measure the noise in your apartment, and the expert would then write a report. Typically, your neighbor's landlord would then have to correct the deficiencies --> impact sound insulation.

Insulate the entire ceiling facing your neighbor. An example: 12-centimeter square timbers that you install staggered 1 meter on the ceiling, rubber underneath, then 12 cm of rock wool (Rockwool) in between, and finally 1-2 layers of plasterboard, then paint or wallpaper.
You must first ask your landlord for permission, as this is a structural change.

Note: Bass tones are the hardest to dampen and can only be successfully dampened with insulation thicknesses of 12 to 20 centimeters. The plasterboard will vibrate and therefore provide additional insulation.

 

this is great info, thanks, but im in a pretty old building, i dont think management would agree to any structural changes. The noise isnt terrible. I just want to reduce it a bit, and in the process maybe create a little more control for my monitoring environment. Im imagining a box within a room. Heres something i had chatgpt mock up. I feel like this is easy, affordable, and is non permanent. I can even remove it if im having an inspection from management or something. I see rockwool panels on top of the plywood, as well as a couple of clouds hanging from the bottom. Side panels as well. Front would remain open, and there would be no 2x4 on the front bottom. just the sides and back.

 

You should position your monitors a little further from the wall and, if possible, avoid placing them in corners.
Can you please describe in centimeters how far your monitors are from the wall and in the corner?

Think carefully about what you're doing, because it could make your listening environment worse than before.

Studio Speaker Placement: How to Position Your Monitors Properly

How To Set Up Your Studio Monitors

 

Sounds like a good plan. You probably don't want to make a barrier too strong anyway, or else you'll turn this "box" into a room of it's own and that will create more problems.

The only problem i see here is possible flutter echoes, i've been working on a really small room for a friend, very similar concept (tiny box within a room) except he went for a gypsum + rockwool sandwitch. It does the trick, but there were some pretty noticeable flutter echoes. In your case you'll probably have a similar problem with plywood + rockwool, so yeah whatever you do you should definetively consider some room for abpsorption within the box wherever there's parallel hard surfaces.

I don't know if by "side panels" you ment acoustic panels somehow hanging there or plywood panels as walls. I would start by building the box's frame and the topside and see if i needed more isolation. If it's okay with the plywood on top then for the sides i'd just go for some lighter material like filling the space with rockwool as some sort of wall (might need extra timber for that) or that curtain you mentioned, same for the backside. Like i said, you can run on quite a bit of issues the strongest the barriers are, and in such a small space it's gonna be pretty difficult to deal with, so try not to overdo it.

edit: I would also leave the front bottom 2x4 where it is, or at least replace it with a 2x2, just for stability, because if you kick that corner strong enough by accident you may damage some of the joints.

 

Last edited: Apr 19, 2025

you seem halfway to a floating room already

 

It should work. It will work better if you can find the way to construct the ceiling without plywood or any rigid plate. If you can mount at least 6" of rockwool on some kind of grid and leave some air (ideally as much as the thickness of rockwool, but not more) between the rockwool and the ceiling of the room, you would get a nice amount of wideband absorption, reaching low enough to make a noticeable difference.

Of course, it could make the whole thing structurally weak. If that's the case, I would cut out the middle of the plywood plate as much as possible, basically turning it into a frame, say 4" wide. It would still be strong enough to hold the construction while letting the rockwool absorb enough of the sound in both directions.

 

Last edited: Apr 20, 2025 at 1:04 AM

Definitely. Im currently 15cm or so from the back wall. I have a little room to spare, can pull it forward another 10-15. Theres currently nothing on the sides, as i have yet to build this. I was already thinking of leaving the sides mostly open, or at least leaving them open in the rear corners. Good call!

Agreed. Im also thinking this is a less is more thing, and to start slow, and add as needed. Ive been in similar rooms, where it was "treated" but was so small it was just a terrible room. Im thinking narrow strips of custom panels for the sides, or maybe just thick absorbent fabric like the fabric offered by audimute. My father is an awesome carpenter and craftsman, so custom fabrication will be easy. Instead of creating plywood walls that cover the entire area, i would rather do a couple of double sided panels, wrapped in fabric, maybe even on rollers, a sort of modular, small gobo that i can roll in and out and adjust as needed. Easy to open or close the "walls" and adjust for either isolation or "room" treatment. I should also mention, i have a secondary studio. Well, actually, this is my secondary studio, but i find myself doing more and more work at home these days, and may as well get it as good as i can. But i do have another room available that i do final mixes in.

Hmm, good point. Maybe a sort of cross frame using additional 1x4's, to support the rockwool, but not have a complete plywood ceiling.

Thanks all for the feedback and insight. Exactly the responses i was hoping i would get. A lot of great ideas here, truly appreciate it.

 

1x4"s would work. A simpler and cheaper solution would be to strap several strings of rope or wire accross the opening in the middle of the plywood plate, on the top side, facing rockwool. Then you can attach a piece of nice textile (I prefer cotton - natural, no static electricity buildup) to the bottom side, painter canvas style.

6" is minimum thickness of rockwool for a meaningful absorption of low frequencies. If you have enough space, go for 8", just don't leave more air space than that between the rockwool and the room ceiling.

 

Last edited: Apr 20, 2025 at 1:39 AM

An alternative to Rockwool mineral wool is Steico wood fiber insulation, which is also available in various thicknesses.

Wood Fiber
Wood is a naturally occurring plant-based raw material that has been used for thousands of years for house construction and as a heat source. Wood fiber insulation is considered harmless to health. However, when sawing wood fiber insulation, fine dust can be generated and inhaled. This problem can easily be avoided by wearing appropriate protective clothing, especially a respirator. In summary, however, it can be said that wood fiber insulation is a safe and environmentally friendly insulation option.

Rock Wool
One reason why many people decide against insulating with rock wool is the fear of health risks. It is true that the coarse fibers of mineral wool can irritate the skin. This can cause itching, severe redness, or swelling. Therefore, you should never work with rock wool without appropriate protective clothing (gloves, protective suit). However, it is clearly false that rock wool insulation can cause cancer. The rock wool fibers available today are completely free of any suspected carcinogenicity. In 1999, the new RAL quality mark "Mineral Wool Products" (RAL-GZ 388) was introduced. This quality mark guarantees that mineral wool is harmless to health.

High density = excellent sound insulation

In general, the heavier a component, the less noise can penetrate it. Therefore, among other aspects, the weight (mass) of the component – i.e., the density of the building material – is important for sound insulation. Component thickness is not necessarily decisive. STEICO wood fiber insulation materials are characterized by their particularly high density, thus supporting effective noise protection structures. STEICO products uniquely combine high density with low thermal conductivity, thus supporting both energy efficiency and noise protection.

There are ticking fabrics and molleton sold by the meter, it's very inexpensive to cut yourself, and you can choose the colors to staple or glue! There are also inexpensive Molton stage curtains at thomann that dampen frequencies excellently.

Stage felt is sound-absorbing.

The roughened surface and heavy weight of stage felt dampens ambient noise in the room, such as reverberation, and "swallows" much smaller background sounds. This absorption capacity of the fabric is often used as sound-absorbing wall coverings, suspended ceilings, or as a curtain for acoustic improvement.
www.thomann.de/de/buehnenvorhaenge_molton.html & www.thomann.de/de/molton_konfektioniert.html

 

Last edited: Apr 20, 2025 at 11:26 AM

Creepy. just got this AD on insta

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/musicus/silence-meets-creativity-the-b-free-20-soundproof-booth

 

They're only shipping to the USA now.

It's creepy that everything that you have written, spoken and posted has been filed away in your own personal dossier to be sold to anyone who wants a targeted audience with potential buyers...and to governments looking for "troublemakers" and to be dispatched with at the appropriate time.

 

it really depends what's the size of your room, how much do you want to sacrifice,
dense heavier material (like rockwool or pressed foam) with air gap towards wall/ceiling is usually most effective, but you gotta do some proper carpentry to hold entire ceiling framing without coupling it with the ceiling itself,

a full "room within a room" setup is rather expensive and in that case you should look for some local acoustician to avoid common costly mistakes

 

"dont be an idiot, do this instead" :love:

I felt blissed when I installed a double ceiling (~6" of rockwool and thick plasterboard). That's at least 1.66 times better.

Oh and my neighbours liked it too. Good people I like, actually, (they bring cake and food sometimes), but noise is noise, eh? And I like making noise. So it's better for both and I like peace in the house. Just realised that's about 15y of peace now. No wonder they bring cake.

and my wife left me 2y ago.

 

Last edited: Apr 23, 2025 at 12:03 AM

Its actually crazy. I once was putting together a new tent. Doing a test run in the back yard before i went out camping a few weeks after that. Mind you, i had bought the tent something like 6 months prior, just had not set it up yet. I didnt tell a soul that i would be doing a test run. Didnt text my GF saying "hey, going to test the tent out", nothing like that. I also did not have my phone with me, it was charging in a room inside.

So, i am setting up the tent, and its a pain in the ass, took me 30 minutes, and the whole time im grumbling to myself, "damnnit, screw this tent, i hate this thing, i wish i had got an easier tent, etc etc". i finish setting it up, and head inside for some lunch. Sit down with my lunch, and open instagram. First thing that pops up?? An ad, "Are you tired of tents that are impossible to set-up?!? Check out this super easy tent that pops up with two steps" or something like that. It was deeply unsettling. I mean, this was immediate, and again, i hadnt spoken about a tent, searched for one, nothing in months. just too spot on for my sanity.

Totally. Im not trying to do a full room within a room, just some minor reduction of overhead noise, and some side panels to help bring the room in, as the room is very wide. Luckily my pops is an excellent carpenter, and i have quite a bit of experience in building studios as well. Ive already started on some side panels, that we are going to turn into gobos. Four of them, on wheels so i can open and close, box myself in and adjust as needed, depending on how it all sounds when ive got everything up.

awesome. did you permanently install the ceiling? or did you build a room within a room type situation? Congrats on the cake, sorry about the wife!

 

Oh yeah, permanently. This is a very old building (19th cent.) and the ceiling was really high anyway. I didn't even notice it's lower for I don't even know how much. I told the workers to leave some space between the ceiling and the rockwool, about 2". So that's about 8"+ lower. I made sure the rockwool is completely isolated, of course, with it not being exactly healthy to inhale its particles.

The change in the room acoustics was veeery noticeable for the better. It should act as a bass absorber, too.