I am helping a guy who is a famous guitarist from Africa with a career of 30 years in the business. I know his past repertoire, they did wonderful things back in the days. He lives in the UK now and he is recording on his own, but I am not satisfied with his recent sound. His guitars have no character. It was not like that back in the days. So I decided I try to improve things. Let me describe what the problem is:

1. This recording is one of his concerts from the 90's, he played the solo, I think it sounds great, it could be okay for me as a target sound:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1VnlXwx ... sp=sharing

His guitar was a Vantage VP795 on that concert.

Now compare this to what he recorded recently. It was played by a PRS Custom, a Zoom G2 with delay ON, feeded into Logic directly through the line-in. In this style the soloists mostly play with clean sound with some delay added or not.

This is the input in Logic, untouched:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1NpW6lR ... sp=sharing

This is how it was added to the song with some EQ:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1VQ1gUZ ... sp=sharing

It sounds very bad to me, something like a chirping. As if it was a mixed acoustic/electric.

I asked him how they did things in the past, but I was surprised to learn that in spite of that he is a very good player, he had never been a "tech" guy, and there was another band mate who was the so called "expert" in the band, and he set up things for everyone. Everyone else could play but depended on that guy for the setup of sound. Moreover it is now untraceable how they did recordings in the studios back then. Most of those places have vanished, the engineers unknown or died. So I have no source to ask that info.

Do you have any suggestion how to get that sound that you can hear in the video I linked? Can you do that with the PRS? By the way, I had a PRS, I play this music, but I found that the most unsuitable for this sound. It exactly sounded like Santana, but that was not what I needed it for.

He had a Vintage V100 in the past, did't make too much difference, maybe was a bit better for this purpose. One day while I was sitting in his room, he played something, I just recorded it with my phone. Interestingly this recording sounds much better than those things that we record through the line-in in Logic. Has much more character, even if it is a bad recording by a phone, the guitar sound is much more pleasant:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1uuFa9m ... sp=sharing

I have been asking this on other forums as well, but here I decided to post this here, too, because I know there are lots of members here who are experienced about plugins, I wonder if what I ask could be solved on the computer only?

2. I would like to show a working example but I don't know the trick here either. This is a song that was played by his bandmate in the 80's:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1GMOkOi ... sp=sharing

The exact same guy can be seen here with the exact same guitar that has been his guitar since then, and the exact same sound can be heard:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1cOg6NT ... sp=sharing

When I heard this I got shocked: how can it sound that good? It is okay that this is an expensive Steinberger, but I heard this guitar in other bands as well and I can tell it can sound bad, too. He is doing here something else as well that creates this great sound. But even regarding the chorus: I had several chorus pedals, had tried a lot in Logic as well, none sounded this professional, and there is that strong, concrete like sustain and presence. How can you get a sound like this, because this type of sound would be okay for me too. Unfortunately I can't ask this guy because he doesn't tell it.

 

If you record the guitar directly to the interface, it will sound dull and artificial. You want the ambience (room sound) and the amplifier sound.
The first option would be to record it through an amplifier. Put a microphone in front of the speaker and you will get the full body clean sound.
An alternative would be to just run your recording through an impulse response software....load a cabinet and mix it with the clean signal....or send the audio you have to a guitar amplifier....then mic the amp and re-record it. You will get the desired ambience/amp sound.

Oh, if you have a effects unit like Kemper, AxeFX, Helix or anything (units or pedals) that can load IR's (impulse responses), you can route the audio through it. Look for "reamping" and you will find many examples

 

As a starting point, 1300 - 1500Hz LP, 12 or 18dB slope.

 

In order, i'd try:

-A guitar with humbucker pickups in series, tone control rolled off to taste
-EQ and compression.
-Different combinations of virtual amps and speakers.
-Different picks (ideally something thicker that what you normally use)
-Different string sets (at least .10 guage), also every manufacturer has a darker or brighter sounding varieties, you can probably find demos on YT to hear what fits you best.
-A higher string action so you can really hit them without worrying too much about fret buzz.

All that might have been oddly specific, but it seems you're looking for a darker yet kinda percussive sound (taking the 90s vid as reference), and that's the way i'd go about it.

If you have any more videos, see how and where exactly he's striking the strings, closer to the bridge or the neck, that's also going to make a difference.

 

An amplifier cranked up to high volume produces a sound that no software can replicate completely accurately. There is a natural compression in that sound that does not really distort but provides some extra fatness and sustain. If you want to go the direct route, I suggest some compression and maybe a light overdrive or booster. A guitar with humbuckers like a Gibson ES335 might also help, but I'd look at the signal path first. You might even want to try something like this with an IR-loader:

https://audioz.download/samples/pre...guitar-amp-irs-impulse-responses-irs-wav.html

 

mic up a fender deluxe reverb and you are done..
His old tone is very rounded.. Booster sometimes achieves this but dont push too hard.
takes experimenting

 

Last edited: Nov 16, 2024 at 1:48 AM

I've been reading the post 3 to 4 times, but I don't understand the question. At least not accurately, I guess. So you want to improve the clean guitar sound alright but from where ? the next recording session or the recorded guitar track you already have (example 2, the untouched track to Logic) ? Not sure if you're asking recording, editing/production or mixing tips here. Each needed different approach IMO.

I see people been giving mixed response here and I think they all understand it differently.

 

When playing your main genre you usually have a favorite setting and tone that you always use, and remains constant. Since he's using the same guitar maybe its the amp, then try turning off or using less reverb.

 

Use new strings!

 

Use old strings!

 

I fully agree. First intuition was to see how far I can get with the untouched recording example. Then I compared it to the processed version you attached ... holy, mine seems bright af in comparison to what was already seen as way too sizzling Then I read the rest of your post and wasn't even sure what your intention is.

Just guessing about the issue, I think the main topic is recording situation here. The easiest way to get these classical kind of bluesy guitar tones is to get it the classical way: push a tube amp into the edge-of-breakup sweet spot and let your fingers suck the tone out of it. It is probably more than just a tonal thing ... you showed the original guitar player in two really different scenarios. One time enjoying the heat of the moment in a live situation. The other time sitting at home (perhaps alone), recording some guitar tracks, not feeling really comfortable about this. It influences the way you are playing easily, unless you are really aware.

 

There's a myriad of factors, but I'd say..

Most of the Tone comes from that Zoom G2 and whatever Amp it is emulating.
It could even be an Acoustic amp simulation, hence the brightness.

Also the Cab sim that Zoom is using, or lack thereof..

PRS has Humbuckers, so it should give a Full rounded sound,
they're pretty balanced and with maybe a Vintage touch..
(definitely not bright like using lipstick pickups on a roland jazz)


1.- Make sure you're using the right Amplifier sim on the Zoom G2,
it should have a couple of Clean E.Guitar amps, probably a Fender/Vox Clean... and the Acoustic Amp

Use the Fender or Vox Clean.
Don't use any Roland Jazz or Acoustic Guitar amp.

2.- Double check that the Cab simulation is ON when recording.
Or turn it off, and use an IR Cab of your own..


-Alternatively just de-digitalize his rig, at least for recording..
That's going old-school, with Real Amp, real Mic.. or a D.I alla RedBox Classic etc..

 

Last edited: Nov 16, 2024 at 9:22 AM