Hello!
Maybe It's stupid question, but I'm new at audio processing I have an orchestral composition with very loud and very quiet passages. I want them to sound more close to thmeselves. That means the quiet passages should be louder and the loud passages should be more quiet. With which plugin can I achieve this?
Thanks a lot!

 

Thank you :D I was thinking of it, but I didn't know how to use it. Now I'm going to find some more information...

 

I think the guy is right, orchestra and compressor are not good friends! I suggest Waves Vocal Rider with sidechain, or you use automation.

 

I depends, lukerus.

In which format(s) is this composition ? Rendered audio ( wav, typical ) or MIDI + some VSTi librairies ?

What DAW are you using ?

 

Thanks for all the answers

I'm using Sibelius 7.5 with Kontakt VST and old EWQLSO Gold + Vir2 Orchestral percussion. Somewhere I found iZotope Ozone mastering tools, when I use some of the presets it sounds pretty good, but the loudness problem remains... Sibelius is quite problematic in cause of MIDI CCs so I don't try to use EWQLSO's CC11 to control volume.

 

Xsze


lukerus
Stop what you're doing and take a quick trip to AudioSex Academy. You're going to specifically want AudioSex Academy (Part 1), be patient it takes a little time to load because of all the awesome. You'll thank me later.

 

Before using a compressor, you may want to try to adjust for your natural dynamics in the mix itself. In other words, you go, as I'm sure you'e already doing, to the loudest part of the mix and establish all the instruments' volumes in that section. Now you can go to the softer or solo parts and bump up that volume by a couple of dBs for just that part, then bring them back down during the louder parts of the piece. This way, you can get by with a lot less compression and limiting on the output chain once the song is mixed. However, like compression itself, you don't want to change the volume of the solo'd parts too drastically, just enough that it sounds a bit more even between the softer and louder parts.

Ozone has a really nice orchestral preset that I wind up using on my film stuff.

 

As I don't know Sibelius, I'm trapped here .

But let's see ... Could/can you do this :

- As it's an orchestral composition and it looks you have direct access to the MIDI, it is possible for you to ' re-draw ' the MIDI volumes in your tracks ? (I'm using Samplitude; inside it, ' we're ' doing that with the mouth, as in Photoshop ).

- Could you insert a MIDI compressor/expander on a/each/some track/s ? This will lead to much more natural results as a ' traditional ' audio compressor in such a case. ( Sorry but I was trained to use the minimal number of p-i/gear/artifacts on a track/mix as possible. None is the goal.)

' Here ', it looks like this, per track :



- If not included in Sibelius, you'll find some such ' MIDI level shapers ' out there ( is my English ok ? ).
For example :

Code:

http://www.platinumears.com/velocitycurvesm.html

- Then, when this is done, adjusted, and as Teletoby wrote, we'll go for drawing automation curves, per track. If possible, also in MIDI.

Remember : less is more ( quality ) *yes* . This includes having absolutely no VST on the master stereo bus. If the above tracks are tweaked properly, nothing is needing there. 2 tracks or 74 (current one, 'let's push at the maximum possible test project'). What you/we are looking for here is transparency.

All this will take some time, concentration and efforts, of course.

For online demos, maybe you could have a look at this :

and any Daniel James video will be a great help :

etc.

 

Summary+:

• You can use Dynamics compressors (see above)
• Or do it the MIDI way and use a MIDI plugin to compress the velocities/expressions (see above)
• Or volume automation (see above)
• Or use a rider like MAutovolume, Hornet AUtogain (pro) Waves Bass/Vocal rider, etc

 

Yeah, for an orchestral piece it's always preferable to use a rider plugin or automation because it sounds more natural. Besides, EW samples sound quite compressed already. Lots can be done just by adjusting the MIDI velocities and then automation or using a plugin like HoRNet Autogain/Autogain Pro. There's no real need to use a compressor, really. You could very possibly end up with it sounding rather bad, especially if you don't know how to use compressors. There is also lots of misinformation about compressors on the net.

Also, for some *real* knowledge and no shit try visiting http://www.audiomasterclass.com/blog , subscribe to receive their news-letter and you'll receive really informative news-letters from time to time. Like once or twice a week. Along with the "enroll" calls, but I don't find them annoying.

Graham Cochrane @ http://therecordingrevolution.com is also great source of all kinds of info on music production. he's a great guy, too.

Cheers!

 

I'd suggest a subtle limiter after the compressor to tame any peaks.

Careful use of the Ozone maximiser could work but for orchestral music less = more.

As others say, learn how to use these tools first.

 

When it comes to orchestral I would avoid compressors and limiters.
HOWEVER, when you're going for that big epic sound with lots of synths and such mixed with the instruments, then some exagerated limiting can be nice. I personally like to have massive limiter on my master channel for big hybrid orchestral pieces but it's not to everyone's taste.
If you're going for a subtle more lyrical orchestral piece then don't use any compression and maybe a very subtle limiter at best.

 

Thanks for all answers They very helped me. I think that I must export midi from Sibelius and import it into Reaper, because with Sibelius it's difficult to do some track editing... I think the midi velocity compressor will do that job quite well. My goal is to have orchestral track and I will play my violin along the track. So not modifying the final EW's audio (with compressor, limiter and all that stuff) is better?

 

Absolutely *yes* .