The regrets of going legit

Discussion in 'Software' started by Adam Ford, Jun 18, 2024.

  1. ArticStorm

    ArticStorm Moderator Staff Member

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    its not a bargian if you factor in how expensive buying and upgrading an apple computer can be.

    you forgot Reaper in that list with 60 USD (i think!), wasnt Bitwig for that price one year sub included only and then you need to get into a sub model? (the bitwig model scares me, ofc you own the versions atleast, which is good, but new updates after that 12 months will lead you to a sub. now i did do the math, but it could be cheaper than Ableton major upgrade, which is only 20%off.)
     
  2. BaSsDuDe

    BaSsDuDe Guest

    This is similar to the musician who after decades could not remember why they were doing it.
    You have to remember the passion and everything associated with it.
    Legitimacy is a word that certainly has a definition. The only true usage considering what's happening this century, and perhaps for me only, is that if doing something might make me personally feel illegitimate in whatever I attempted.

    "The ends justify the means" - simply this means that whatever, tune, project, creation you output as a result of your investment does not get anymore legitimate than that. If the intent in buying something is to make money, then music is definitely the wrong place. That's the stock market. Don't beat yourself up about it. There are plenty of people who think they're legitimate that use nothing but hacked software. It is the perception of yourself that matters.
     
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  3. tnc

    tnc Producer

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    25+ years as a hobbyist (mostly). Only a few professional level recording/mixing projects, ie not my own music, but no income to live from.

    I did go legit for the tools I actually use just a few years ago. My real non-music job makes me the money.
    It's a great feeling and it got my productions better in the end.

    My thoughts:
    - I buy only to support the developers I like. It's a great feeling that you know they get paid for their hard work.
    - If cash is an issue, I only buy second hand or at really good sales.
    - I often use "try-before-buy" versions for some months and let the GAS go away, in 95% of the cases I end up uninstalling and not buying.
    - Don't get hundreds of "no-brainer-deals" of stupid little plugins you never use anyways.
    - Don't install plugins just because they are cheap or free. Clutter is bad.
    - Don't be in a hurry!! Don't get fooled by any hype. The latest plugins are definitely not the greatest plugins...
    - Ask yourself if you really *NEED* a plugin to work.
    - NEVER buy licenses from companies that won't allow you to sell the license second hand.
    - Less tools to choose from -> more productive.
    - I stay away from uncracked plugins (lesson learned after companies license servers disappeared...) and crashed computers that
    won't allow you to re-install plugins.

    Same goes for hardware: buy second hand at good prices and then sell if you don't use it. Don't be in a hurry to get the things you like.

    You don't need 10 synth plugins. You need 3 or 4 at most. Be selective.
    You don't need 10 EQ plugins. You need 2 at most. One of the best albums I've heard was using the same EQ plugin for all tracks...
    Compressors and saturators > buy only the things you end up using in all/most of your projects. Use try-before-buy versions for some months
    before deciding.
    Don't buy heaps of sample packs or libraries. Get only the basics that you NEED.
     
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  4. Garamondo Furbish

    Garamondo Furbish Audiosexual

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    lofi, jazz, some of this and that...
    they are voices for a vst3 instrument
    [​IMG]
     
  5. triggerflipper

    triggerflipper Audiosexual

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    I've spent hundreds of euros to support VCV Rack and third party devs during the early days. Turns out the head dev is a dick with a capital clit, and many third party plugins weren't ported to v1 or v2 because of his dickwellian nature.

    Taught me a lesson. Nowadays I download all the warez I can even if I know I'll never use it, just in case some asshole dev will lose sleep. You can't take any chances, this is war.
     
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  6. clone

    clone Audiosexual

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    This is nothing like it used to be, unless you want it to be. Used Macs are cheap. You can spend as much as you want at the top end, but Entry Level Macs are also cheap. It's hard to beat a $500 Mini in price vs capability, or an Air for a couple hundred more. It's not like even just-decent PC's are all that cheap.

    We've been using Logic Pro X (aka v10), for 11 years. I fully expected to have to pay for either a new copy of Logic 11, or at least some upgrade fee like every other developer. But we have 11 given to us again for free. Will we get another ten years of v11? No-one can say. They do not whip through new Major Version Numbers every time they do a nice update to Logic, so they can charge Logic users some more money. Most other developers charge for all major updates, and some like SB even charge for smaller ones, like Cubase 10.5.

    Sure, there are people who need the newest and shiniest models, with people who get update fever like every time they release a new iPhone.
    But it is also not entirely accurate to say you cannot run Logic on a Hackintosh if you really wanted to.

    I have gotten more use out of my $199 for Logic, than probably any other single "music-related software" money I have ever spent; Easily. It's not even close.
     
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  7. ArticStorm

    ArticStorm Moderator Staff Member

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    thats a very good and i share many of your views! Im also close to somewhat that time into music production.

    but i really have to say, i got hit by owning a few of these 90s VA synths, i really love playing with them, just tweaking knobs and im very selective in that aswell. Do i need them? Not really but i love playing with them, its such a huge inspiration to grab a tea, connect to one of these and then just play around - its so much more organic compared to any plugins i had before.
     
  8. ArticStorm

    ArticStorm Moderator Staff Member

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    Okay you might have a point about the entry level macs, but also apple releasing extreme low level entry models and i dont really want to know what happens, when you need to repair something, when everything is soldered to the board. for a windows small pc this isnt a problem you can easily swap RAM blocks. But apple making it so difficult

    Let me put the more offtopic stuff in a spoiler:
    hmm - can i say something about apple, which really bothers me? Like telling the user to not be able to upgrade, bcs the hardware doesnt make the cut.

    i cant wait for windows ARM to blow up and actual getting decent, but i really fear that by that time MS will have fucked up windows entirely, the whole recall feature, more and more ads and going in the direction of apple to parent guard the user, i see a dark future ahead of windows computing. Just hope by that time Linux on ARM will be a good alternative and other DAW have got a Linux version or something.

    about hackintosh, apple was clever to design their own chip, therefore hackintoshing is very hard - if not impossible, since you need to buy an apple pc for it, therefore $$$ for apple.
    now i am wondering if its possible to make macOS work on the newer ARM chips released, since they also have enough juice.
     
  9. ArticStorm

    ArticStorm Moderator Staff Member

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    fair enough - you never know. i read about the story of VCV rack - was very sad.
     
  10. triggerflipper

    triggerflipper Audiosexual

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    I don't actually download out of spite :rofl:

    I bought a few plugins in my life (other than VCV) and I don't regret them. When I bought them, there weren't released on sistersite, and a couple of them were only weeks/months after, but I was happy to support the devs.

    I keep telling myself "if I make money from music, I'll buy everything I use", but I've been a bedroom producer for 10 years and with AI at the door that'll probably never happen LOL
     
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  11. triggerflipper

    triggerflipper Audiosexual

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    And I almost pulled the plug on Bitwig during their 10th anniversary 50% sale, but it's subscription based, and that's my only problem with the software I love more than life itself.
     
  12. ArticStorm

    ArticStorm Moderator Staff Member

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    now i also noticed that bitwigs 8-track free version is sub based, it was so WTF as i noticed thaat.

    Live Lite, i simply upgraded through from version 4 till now 12 without any extra cost, which is crazy.

    rolling out sub based model by bitwig was unreal, you cant say - hey i want to pay for this major version, which will last me a few years, no the shit is yearly billed. (thats what i saw the last time as i checked it, if sometimes knows something else please add).

    i feel like most of the stuff is very frustrating sadly and for bitwig there arent also steady releases on the way, since its JVM based.

    we collected so many arguments against going legit ... its just crazy.
     
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  13. Amore_de_la_Vida

    Amore_de_la_Vida Rock Star

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    Legit owner of Bitwig here, no subscription, never. I paid only once, the license for the present version is permanent, so I know it will work forever, but I haven't any intention to pay more each year to have an update... No way!
     
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2024
  14. ELJUNTADERO2022

    ELJUNTADERO2022 Producer

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    that bitwig model its unfair as F***, nah ah... only 8 tracks? for real? nah ah
     
  15. ArticStorm

    ArticStorm Moderator Staff Member

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    yeah the last version you reach in the time of your sub-time is yours, till bitwig shutsdown the license server.

    its okay i think, so you own it atleast, not like Roland cloud, where you own nothing after paying.

    @ELJUNTADERO2022 yeah its their somewhat equivalent to Ableton Lite, which also has 8 tracks,
    but Ableton Lite is free forever, while you cant upgrade Bitwigs 8-track version, once the 12 months did run out, after activating your serial.
    thats just stupid. Not that anyone serious would use such a limited version anyway.

    Bitwigs system is okay, since you can upgrade to the last version in your 12months periode and thats also the version you own permantely. i argued above before already, it might be even cheaper than abletons idea, charging the full price again for every major versions, but keep updates in between completely free. But Bitwig has to have a complete continuous flow of new versions and features everytime or their subs will riot.
     
  16. triggerflipper

    triggerflipper Audiosexual

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    Bitwig's updates are almost always quantum leaps tho. I couldn't stand not updating it.
    Maybe I should've bought the license once, and used the cracked updates. Oh well, it's not on sale anymore. Tears.
     
  17. Melodic Reality

    Melodic Reality Rock Star

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    Go for Splice rent-to-own, after two years you will be on latest version with one extra year of updates, then just renew every second or third year, dunno, it's not that horrible deal, stuff they add in that one year isn't that shabby, DAW is amazing.
     
  18. slowpoke

    slowpoke Kapellmeister

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    Yes I loved VCV when it first came out, even let the dev use an image of VCV next to my Eurorack for his FB page. But you're right, he is a humourless dick who was overcharging for his modules. His deciples also relentlessly battered one dev who made a Maths clone when he dared to try and make a few bucks from it. Tossers.
     
  19. kingchubby

    kingchubby Rock Star

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    I bought some VCV modules, but mostly use free ones. No need to support a dick and there's Cardinal. Heehee!
    I try to support developers when I can, but the sister site helped/helps me in my lean years. Try before you buy.
     
  20. bluerover

    bluerover Audiosexual

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    I'll buy once and support developer, but still use the cracked version. I've never had a virtuous bone in my body - 45,47. (e.g. fk Arturia)
     
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