I liked that approach a lot too, and wouldn't have noticed it in the deluge of noise and info without your mention of it, grateful you wrote about it.

It's a bit like the old "mix into the bus compressor" trope, except what he's doing is taking a piece of gear he likes the specifc sound of for the low end, blasting the entire mix with that EQ to start the day, and then building it up using that blasted low end as the foundation "in context".

I can see how that's going to get you delicious results for a lot of music styles that need this, and that's an inspiring way to think about it because you can come up with your own infinite variations of the same method to build mixes around the sound of colorful gear or plugins that you need to lock in and then build up upon.

 

Last edited: Feb 27, 2024

Few things I noticed from the MDN Sidecar plugin :

1. BIAS is NOT "headroom" control like in most Brainworx plugins, it affects the saturation in a way but doesnt work as "Internal working gain" as it said on the manual. It's more like pre/de-emphasis EQ into the saturation circuit. It doesn't add more saturation, just changing the saturation pattern a little. The amount of saturation is controlled by INPUT knob that at the same time push more volume into the plugin.

2. The plugin has internal clipping mechanism and not operating on floating point resolution. I think it models the "desk clipping" but not entirely sure because it looks like your everyday digital clipping judging by the shape of the transfer curve, it has around 1-2db of knee range and flat out beyond that.
- the white needle on the meter is only showing Raw input and doesnt respond to added Input, so it's possible to clip internally even without the needle going to red if Input is pushed hard and Output is compensated.
- easiest way to be safe is only push the INPUT so the sums of the added input and raw input value not exceeding 0db. ie. if the Raw input value is -7db, you can push the INPUT up to 7db before clipping occurred. That however will clip the plugin on any added makeup gain on compressor or changes in converter emu section.
- the EQ section is pre INPUT section but post the Raw Input meter, so it will affect the overall internal working gain silently too. Needs a lot of math and estimation yeah ?



- the only way to have the plugin to react like a "pushed desk" is to play around that 0dbFS area or clip it a bit. If working signal level is low, the saturation generated also low. Kinda need to push the input until it get close to 0dbFS internally then compensate the output.
- a real headroom control on the Bias would've been lovely right ?
- if the clipping sounds good to you, just do it I guess ?

3. The saturation is probably modeled of MDN overall signal chain that has a Fairchild, Pultec plus that API sidecar, that clearly means the Fairchild and Pultec would dominate the overall color. It's actually more even-order tube flavored sounding than it is the "API sound" which is Opamp (solid-state) based. The pushed behavior is also more like tube circuit. The plugin only will generate more odd harmonic when goes into the clipping territory but can't say it's API-ish kinda sound as any clipping ever react that way.

4. The high end of EQ is good and didn't crap out early like most plugin. Still dont know what it is about, but it's sound really really good.

5. Really good sounding, way above the average good sounding plugin, wont regret it if just throw it on the stereo bus and pick random preset.

6. WIll add if I found anything worth mentioning, am lazy af today.


EDIT : I further test the "clipping" earlier and figured it's not really "hard clipping". More on this below : LINK

 

Last edited: Feb 27, 2024

Even on lazy days you make insightful posts Stevie. Thanks for sharing.
Interesting about the clipping. I guess this'll be one of those "ignore the meters and close your eyes" plugins

 

The white sea review lol

 

It is worth it !

maybe thats why he says to apply gain reduction around -0.3, like a little haircut haha

totally agree, im astonished... a lot of plugins exists made by "great devs", but this is like magic in that area... i never heard a real API, i know this is not purely an API but the high end its beatiful, and the low too! dont dig into the mids too much so far..

i just do it to some acoustic guitars on one song of mine and instantly place the guitars in a place that i wanted!!! and i have to say that i have hard times placing acoustic guitars... i am a bedroom producer.. so...u can imagine

dud if ur lazy as f and throw this info ( which makes me clear how to push it when u clarify into the point 1 and 2), i better wait to read you and throw away the manual x_x thanks a lot , i love reading your thoughs but more your comments like this!!!

 

I went on and further test the thing that I mentioned as clipping earlier and found out that it's more like a limiting than it is a clipping. I completely missed it the first time.

From what I can gather, the way I understand it :

a) Hard Clipping = 0ms attack, 0ms release, hard knee
b) Soft Clipping = 0ms attack, 0ms release, >0db knee range, softer with additional asymmetrical or symmetrical curves.
c) Limiting (High-ratio compression) = 0ms attack, >0ms release, hard knee with close to 0db knee or softer but harder than the Soft clipping knee.

The Behavior

This is the attack/release curve when the MDN Sidecar pushed beyond 0dbFS :


From the graphic we can see that it actually has some release on it, so the behavior is more like limiting than it is clipping.

Transfer curve :


Hard knee with just 1-2db of bend (soft knee) range.

So, I can conclude that what's actually happening isn't really full blown internal digital hard clipping, but some sort of limiting that presumably modeled from the hardware unit. Still smashing the peaks hard but it's not as severe as hard knee clipping would, and theoretically could give softer, better sounding result than actually chopping off the peaks instantly as the release time will reduce a lot of unwanted distortion artifacts.

The Harmonics Generation Pattern

before approaching the ceiling (-2dbFS) :


It's nice 2nd order tube-like saturation. 100% sounds pleasant to the ears, and has some "warming" quality to it.

pushed the INPUT 1db above the 0dbFS :



Limiting produces a lot more 3rd order harmonic which blends with the earlier harmonics. More aggressive, but it doesn't look that bad.

So, I think it is not a bad idea to push the plugin with the input, while pushing the signal into limiting has its consequences, it can sometimes give good results if done moderately. It's always good to be aware of what's happening and let your ear decides which one you think is best for the track. Still a dedicated Headroom knob would've been lovely.

I'm not sure if this is added after the v1.0.0. All the result above is from the v1.0.2. All of these only apply to the INPUT section only, I havent fully dig deeper into the Compressor, ADC, Line Amp and MOD option just yet.

Apologies if previous post is somehow misguiding, I completely missed it, it's my lazy day. LOL.

 

Last edited: Feb 27, 2024

I know that Pulsar's previously most recent plugin - the Magnum one - has an internal soft clipper. I remember the dev gushing over it in his thread over at Gearspace, so it's entirely possible he's implemented the same thing here..?

 

the Magnum has some odd clipping section that he claimed more advanced than any other clipping algo out there. cant really tell because I dont use it that much, Climax is good enough for my needs. So, Magnum has another internal clipping prior to the one at the end of the processing chain ? well that's weird. Do you have link to that discussion ? wonder what it is about

 

EQ before the Input seems like an odd choice to me

 

i cant understand why its usefull... its for when u push the gain, then give it some headroom" to no get a squashed signal u say?

 

Ok I finally got a chance to test this out, and holy shit, it might be my favourite plugin of all time. It's early, and I don't want to go overboard, but I've been looking for this gooey-but-snappy analog sound in plugin world for almost 10 years. And it's finally here.

The Antelope Fairchild plugin was also satisfying in that gooey but snappy way, but this sounds better, and using Antelope's DSP plugins through their hardware is a pain in the nuts.

I honestly love this sidecart thing. I took it for a test drive for about an hour. I feel like I've finally found the sound I've been searching for. Look at my post history, literally a month ago I was asking about Fairchild emulations, I wasn't satisfied with the 10-15 or so I've tried to date. THIS is what I was looking for.

Listen to the way the transformers push up to unity along with the movement, it's like it kisses the groove as it compresses. Tune the attack so that it's letting some punch through but it's also clamping a little bit and shaping the envelope in a nice way, listen to how it breathes and moves with the groove. It's gooey and squishy but also has the transient pop out amongst the goop. It's like it rolls along. Being able to have a transient with great SOLIDITY within the rolling goo is really rare in digital realm. It's suuuuper analogy. This thing's a gem.

Do other people feel the same way universally? Or does this thing just apply to a certain taste? Curious what the consensus is

It's easy to get a good sound quickly. And there's a ton of combos at hand, even though the plugin seems simple at first.

Play with the bias knob, it changes the character a lot. It's almost like it changes the force of the "wind" or something.

 

Last edited: Feb 27, 2024

i dont use it too much so far, but as i commented in this post, i just placed it for test and pickign a random(but for master) preset and instantly got a beatiful space and... sound lets say... then i went to the acoustic guitars and maaan, i tweaks some knobs and my guitars now have a decent place ! my gosh, really its a very good plugin.. i cant believe i have to say... if i have the money, one day i will buy it... its kind of pricey... but so far with those clicks.. its instant buy. of course i have a long way to study and use it wisely.

 

As for now the optimal playing range of the plugin is up there near the 0dbFS internally, since it's not a full brickwall limiting, when limiting is happening, surely there will be overs (signal that get pass) that could get beyond that range and went into digital clipping as the plugin doesnt operate in floating point. You can see if you don't compensate the Output, the meters on the DAW already going red beyond 0db meaning there are overs. Even when you compensate it with Output control, it's already internally hard clipped considering the Output control as at the very end of the chain (after compressor, ADC, filter). That's just 1st stage of processing, the signal with some hard clipped artifact then sent to compressor, ADC etc. I'm not very good at explaining this, but surely you can imagine what I'm saying.



Having a headroom control should give the plugin a starting point of the limiting the threshold at say -6db or so and the user have the control to bring it down even more or up according to the input level, it sets the optimal and limiting zone far away from the digital clipping considering the INPUT limiting is the first stage of processing in the plugin. I don't think it's a good idea for the signal to already have digital clipping artifact at the very beginning then fed into tone shaping process like compressor and ADC after which has the tendency to add more of it.

I think someone at Gearspace or something will bring up this matter soon, and like usual, they'll update the plugin.

 

Last edited: Feb 27, 2024

I think its a great plugin. I personally think some of Acustica's newer offerings handle transients better, but still enjoy this one very much. very gluey and vibey. So far my testings have proven it effective in both modern, loud electronic genres and more refined, organic sounds.

 

i think somebody did and i think dev pushed back for some reason. i could be mis remembering

 

Oh that's good to know

wait, wdym pushed back ?

 

thanks! kind of get it now! but iam the one who have to study this, thanks again!

 

No hype for the 450 EQ? Damn, the sidecar is amazing, loved all the processing happening under the hood, but the eq is... unbelievable. I'm figuring out how or if i'm going to use the sidecar, but the eq is going to be my go-to API sound in the box. With this Pulsar Modular set and AlexB's MBC and A16 consoles, i have zero, nothing, nada to complain regarding tone ITB. Just make the remaining tasks with pure digital colorless tools.

 

ill try to go back through later, but it was something like he had a reason for not including it.

 

the eq is very nice. agree it should pair nicely with the Alex B stuff. His latest update to the console is excellent.