I know almost nothing about the benefits of using a clipper when mastering. I followed a Udemy course on mastering a few years ago and I've been applying that stuff and getting better. Clipping was brought up in the series and what I took away from that is this: use it to saw off peaks, then limit with less distortion. That's worked for me several times, but on some occasions the clipping hit a drumless section with only pads and it was ugly distortion.

I'd really like to understand the use of clippers.

 

Have you ever used Sir Audio Standard Clip? Generally, I never add a Limiter after it, if I use it. You can use some very high oversampling settings in Standard Clip that can be way more than I need to. Standard Clip also has an "assistant" that listens to the audio you playback at it first, and then recommends some settings. You could use it to do some test renders and see what you are actually doing to your audio with the suggested settings and any changes you might make. You can learn all the theoretical parts whatever best way, but I think it is one of the easiest clippers to use and not screw anything up too badly.

NUMBER : R2R10453

 

Clippers seem to be the hot thing right now. I was just articulating this (to myself bc I don't have anyone IRL to talk to about mixing lol) recently how there's kind of two camps on either end of the spectrum:

One side is team anti-clipper, they're the ones who are sending their mixes off at the designated LUFS volume per streaming service (-14 LUFS, etc), who don't like clipping, brickwall waveforms, etc. Many of this aren't limiting their tracks much either.

Then there's the other side that is devoted to clipping, clipping everywhere, "clip to zero" (clip individual tracks, clip busses, clip the 2bus, clip the master before the limiter), etc. Basically trying to squeeze the most loudness possible.

(These are generalizations of course)

Do you. It's a matter of taste, really. In general a safe way to go about it is hard clip super transient material (snare, kick, etc), and soft clip on 'melodic' elements. Hard clipping melodic elements too much can easily lead to nasty results, like what you've described with the drumless/synth section..

 

depending on what sort of music you make, clipping along the way to the master can help achieve a loud mix, without sacrificing too much. Try clipping in stages. 1-3db on each drum track, then another 1-3 db on each drum group, then another on the drum buss. A few db on each instrument, instrument sub group etc etc etc, until you hit the master, and clip there again another few db. This makes the limiter work less, allowing for louder mixes without pumping or distortion from over compressing limiting.

Not all clippers are created equal. Some may suffice in a pinch or a quick fix, but when you start clipping important busses or the master its best to pull out the big boys, something like acustica's ash, or newfangled elevate, amongst others.

 

I'm heavy handed on a lot of stuff (such as compression), so I'd rather seek my loudness (or control) in other ways. That said, a lot of stuff in mixing is overly redundant, there are multiple roads to the same destination.

Clipping might be a solution for a problem you already know how to fix in other ways. In your example, I prefer to tame stuff with an 1178 with higher ratios and fast attack... I get the peaks lowered and then proceed with my usual compression. I have a nasty feeling that with clippers I will probably notice distortion late into the mix and then I'll have to find the cause and roll back until it's gone, and then balance is all over the place again. Learned that the hard way. lol

 

I dont care what someone's opinion is on loudness etc, if they are sending to spotify at -14, it WILL sound quieter and less than those sent at -7 .
spotify's guidelines are stupid. I work in sync, and have been in the room with music supervisors who pick the louder song over the quieter one countless times. They will pick the louder one even if a quieter one fits the brief better as far as tempo, mood, and lyrics.

Now should it sound like shit? Do you have to sacrifice dynamics and audio quality in order to achieve -7? No, you shouldnt, not if you know what you are doing and how to get there. You def should not just clip the hell out of everything to achieve loudness without a good understanding of what you are doing and how to do it transparently.

By all means, do whatever you want, -14 , -4 whatever. its your song, but dont fall into the hype that you have to hit -14 for streaming. Thats complete BS. Majority of pop stars, Selena gomez and all that stuff are hitting -8 easily. pretty much every dance and electronic song same. If you are doing americana folk or piano singer songwriter, sure, maybe -14 is good, but i would still shoot for -9/10.

 

It really is as simple as :

> Limiter (often called brickwall compression) : Distorts less but squashes the transients.
> Clipper : Preserves the transients as much as possible but distorts heavily

I really like AOM Invisible Limiter G3, as I can adjust the ratio of the "soft limiter" (which is a compressor) so that I can feed more or less to its clipper. I find that this is one of the most intuitive way to do great limiting. It's a single knob to adjust between less distortion/squashed transients and more distortion/cleaner transients

 

See what I mean? This person described the 'clip to zero' thing I was talking about then went on a rant about -14 XD

Just joshin', again it's all a matter of taste. -9~ LUFS feels good generally for what I do. I don't feel the need to go louder than that. As for clipping, I do it when I feel it is appropriate. I do in general have a clipper on the master before the limiter hitting the transients and not any of the sustaining elements (generally) in the mix

 

haha guilty as charged, im a -7 loud AF maximalist

 

Clip your transients. On a bus, on a track on a plane on a muffin with some puddin in the rain.

 

This stuff above is what I described as "theoretical". You will get so many different comments halfway through this thread you will forget what your original question was. Try Standard Clip for yourself. And if you really want to do some Loudness War stuff, don't forget your upwards compressors everywhere too. https://xferrecords.com/freeware. OTT

 

For anyone interested in clipping, especially re: mixing EDM/bass music.. I highly recommend watching the entire Clip to Zero series on YT by Baphometrix

 

Last edited: Dec 4, 2023

from chatgpt :

Using a clipper in mastering can be both beneficial and challenging. Here's a more nuanced view:

Benefits of Using a Clipper

1. **Peak Reduction**: Clippers are great for taming transient peaks. This allows you to push the overall loudness of a track without those peaks triggering excessive limiting or compression.

2. **Coloration and Harmonic Distortion**: Some clippers add a pleasing harmonic distortion, which can enhance the perceived warmth or presence of a track.

3. **Headroom Management**: By controlling peaks, clippers create more headroom for the rest of the mix, allowing for a more balanced and potentially louder master.

Challenges and Considerations

1. **Distortion on Sustained Sounds**: As you observed, clippers can introduce ugly distortion, especially on sustained, harmonically rich sounds like pads. Clipping works best on transient material (like drums) where the distortion is less noticeable.

2. **Genre-Specific Usage**: Clippers are more commonly used in genres that tolerate or even favor a certain level of distortion, such as rock, EDM, or hip-hop. In more dynamic genres like classical or jazz, clipping might be less appropriate.

3. **Subtlety is Key**: It's often about finding the sweet spot where the clipper controls peaks without overly coloring the sound in an undesirable way.

Best Practices

1. **Use Sparingly**: Start with a low amount of clipping and increase gradually, listening carefully for any signs of unwanted distortion.

2. **Context Matters**: Consider the content of the track. If there's a section with sustained sounds, you might need to automate the clipper's settings or bypass it altogether for that part.

3. **Combine with Other Tools**: Clipping can be a part of a chain that includes compression and limiting. This multi-stage approach can yield a more transparent and controlled result.

4. **Trust Your Ears**: Ultimately, your ears are the best judge. If the clipping sounds good and serves the track, it's a valid choice.
Remember, mastering is as much an art as it is a science. Experimentation and attentive listening are key to understanding how different tools affect your sound.

 

It's always a good idea to set the clipper or limiter at the loudest section of the track. Seems like the pad is the loudest section, should've set it there, whether the clipper will hit other part isn't the case, the main thing is it shouldn't destroy the loudest part first, that's where most of the peaks that going to give you some headroom are anyway. If you cant get good sound out of it, most of time you wont on a pad because of its sustained nature, it means clipper is useless for that particular track and you should consider skipping it or maybe subs it with hi-ratio leveling compressor, vari-mu, opto, to squeeze 1-2db if you must. Not all music will benefit from clipping at mastering stage.

 

Last edited: Dec 4, 2023

Here's an interesting one: use the delta of your clipped transients in parallel for a transient fader.

(Haven't tried it/not an endorsement)

 

a similar trick, is to use the delta transients to trigger SC input on something like soothe. Works great in some situations.

 

I agree with this, but if I wanted any compression I would be using a compressor and/or a limiter. If I am using a Clipper, It's usually because I want almost no additional compression on that audio. Maybe I already cooked it into that stem, or something. The same way you might want to sidechain a kick/bass for ducking, but when you apply that tactic you find out you already have enough compression already and to get enough ducking you will over-compress the material. So you would use an enveloper/duck to get the same gain reduction without any additional downward compression.

Or a De-esser.

 

Last edited: Dec 4, 2023

When you play a perfectly nice drum track.. and you play it through a clipper afterwards, you realise what the clipper is doing and then you try to use it veeeery veeeeeeery sparingly and just a touch of it. But you really have to realise what it's doing and what it sounds like first. That's my philosophy on clippers. It sounds bad.

Personally, I don't bother too much. Just a bit of soft clipping here and there, through a hardware compressor. And I have a diploma in how it sounds and what the result will sound like at different settings.

Clipping occasional peaks will be unnoticeable, though. The more peaks you cut, the more noticeable it will be. Go lightly with it...

 

I'm actually a little confused. You use clipper during mastering, and your pads can be clipped? How loud are your pads? Usually for me, I set my clipper ceiling around -2 to -3 for mastering, only for capture the highest peaks. I can't imagine how you are able to clip the pads. It's either your pad too loud or your ceiling way too low.

and you can always use automation during mastering.

 

My pad would be too loud