https://vocaroo.com/19Y02CuFjtyl
i feel like a software synth could never sound this good.
a cheap version of it maybe.
im not experienced enough to pinpoint what it is exactly.
i feel like i heard cheap/lacklustre versions of this from software synths, but never with that much punch/pressure/presence or whatever you'd call it.

and im not talking about a small difference in the sense that all synths sound a little different, i mean a objectively better quality.


but id love your guys thoughts on this. am i tripping?? as the kids say?
because i browsed through this subreddit and you guys definitely know wayyyyyyyyyyyy more about sound design than me.

maybe if you run your massive vst through a tube amp you could get this done ?
i legit wonder if that would be worth it.
cause i saw you need some little adapter thing to even send pc signals to an amp without noise

 

Last edited by a moderator: Aug 6, 2022

EBM (Electronic Body Music) Tutorial and Performance: Elektron Analog Four, Roland SH-101, MicroKorg (from 9 Min)

How To EBM: EBM Bassline Techno Tutorial (Schwefelgelb, Phase Fatale)

 

Last edited: Aug 6, 2022

Cmon don't insult us, music subreddits are even worse than this forum (quite an achievement), younger and even more clueless demographic, basically a foster home for the lost musician, hehe get it?

I mean you are sort of correct, you usually insert (multiple) saturators after your synths (maybe also comps&eq) for this warm analogue flavour. Run Monark or u-he synths through Vintagewarmer, Sonnox Inflator, ISM Aroma and you're pretty much there.

 

I'm source agnostic.
I loved digital synths since zero delay filters (UHE ACE, Synth Squad ...)
In a mix, apart some "dirt", it will be VERY close to analog.

Same with guitar : HOW MANY albums are recorded with digital sims AND / OR IR cabs ?
Def Leppard Hysteria was ALREADY recorded with an X100 for guitars : a portable analog ... headphone amp with batteries !!!

if it sounds good, it is good
yngwie malmsteen

 

I mean theres some emu like diva , tal uno, the legend that are pretty close to analogue (yes u can tell a difference with a veteran ear but they are still reallllly impressive). it sounds like a lot of inserts in the link you sent. honestly throwing it to a tube amp would be interesting , it really goes down to experimentation. when you said "punch/pressure/presence" that sounds like descriptions often used when mixing with inserts so maybe try one of the better digital analogue emulations , throw it through your tube , and start experimenting with inserts. I feel like without real analogue gear your starting point is the most important is a baseline ( finding a good emulation) and getting as close to you can with the tone, then throw it threw your tube and /or exp w inserts. This is just off the top of my head idk I hope I can help a little

 

You'd be surprised. But the example you gave has already some important processing going on (within or outside the synth(s)), so even if you find a preset that sort of sounds like it, you'll still have to tweak, layer and possibly add stuff afterwards. So yeah, it's possible, but are you reeealy willing to spend time on that?

 

Sure you can get this with plugins. You can layer two synths and filter each (one for the bass and one for the midrange and upper midrange attack and grit), so that you get the scooped out 350-ish area. You can even add (another) sampler/synth for just the transient attack. For the ducking reverb you can triggering the (reverb return compressor) sidechain with the synth itself (compressor set to fast attack and slowish release).

Edit: Ah, feck it. I made a quick test with plugins (Spire and Surge). Not spot on but close-enough:
https://voca.ro/13arem7I3ZQb

 

Last edited: Aug 7, 2022

maybe they hate me for this but... I find quite a difference between analog synthesizers and vst. When I heard ARP 2600 in a youtube video, my jaw dropped. I can imagine what it will be like live.

 

Amon Tobin explaining about how he creates basslines.
Seems simple enough

All for show. I'm sure in reality he just uses a vst preset.

 

Last edited: Aug 7, 2022

I doubt it. You can see how little work patching it that he just did and he even commented about it. But all those eurorack modules make super high quality sounding stuff. all the work is already done figuring out building the synth. The "lazy part" is to to turn it on and have it sound sick without doing all the computer work. So why wouldn't you?

It would be like building a race car, and then taking your VW and a laptop to the track instead; hoping you can tune the muffler louder.

 

Last edited: Aug 7, 2022

today i ran some dune3 presets through my tube amp, in case anybody is interested
https://audiosex.pro/threads/i-recorded-a-software-synth-dune3-through-my-guitar-tube-amp.65945/

i certainly didnt achieve anything like what i posted in this threat, but i do feel like the amp+mic add something that the vst by itself is missing.
__
also thanks for all the answers i will look at all the videos posted right now
i was halfway expecting to get cursed out so im very happy to see everybody being nice and making interesting points

 

We would be unable to do something like that

 

i would like to push back a little bit on that & the rest you wrote.
i cannot tell you at all whats happening in the synth world, but what i do know is guitar.
i know the well known virtual amps and the promises of warm tube sound, but nothing and i mean N O T H I N G will sound as good as a expensive tube amp with the right mic.
its just not happening.

and the other thing about it is, they say "oh just program your vst better" .. well ok maybe you can check 50 presets, play with the knobs until you hit 1 combination that sounds well enough, but on your real tube amp, you litierally cant do any wrong,
it all sounds nice.
the amp just sounds good and you'd have to look real hard to find a setting where the thing just sucks.
maybe if you turn up the reverb to 10, treble to 10, bass to 0 and then u try to play master of puppets, yea maybe the tube amp would suck at that point. but youd have to try to make that happen

i strongly suspect that its more or less the same in the world of synths.
just as well as no software compressor is as GOOD as a Tube-Tech Cl 1B

 

Last edited: Aug 7, 2022

Not sure what exactly it is you are going for, but here's a stab in the dark: https://vocaroo.com/1c0U5CNKc3pX

Vital (classic fade waveform), AllPassPhase, low end bump, diffuse delay at 1% wet, OTT, bass cab at 15% wet

 

A few thoughts that came to mind (@ LordBiff great experiment of yours). I think it's the amperage and wattage.

Hardware has 220 V from the mains and, for example, a Fender Prineton with 125 watt amplifier from 2 boxes. It's used live and then amplified again. 125 watts are enough for a practice room. As a rule of thumb, at home one says that 30 watts is better than 60 watts. That's why all emulations of hardware never sound like the original!

An audio interface with AD/DA converter can do a lot, but there are natural limits to what is feasible.

If we look at live musicians, it is routed from the laptop to the mixer and then from the mixer to the speakers
to fill the room with sound so that the audience hears it.
That's why they are also called amplifiers, they amplify the input signal. It all depends on the wattage.

 

I do not hear anything you could not do with software. With a software synth, and no help from your DAW and other audio plugins? Maybe not. But I don't see why not. The trick is never getting it to sound "as good", that is relatively easy. It is when you actually try to make it identical is when it becomes next to impossible.

 

btw i just remembered, naively i tried to make a splice pack once,
and within the instructions it said that you may not ever include any synth stuff that was made by vsts + plugins. hardware synths only!
which is kind of telling when you think about it like why would they have that rule?
splice has pretty high end sound quaility.
and they won't even consider your work unless you recorded some hardware.
food for thought anyway

thanks a lot im gonna try to do that, see how far i come.
your patch sounds real great.
something about the punch & aggressiveness tho, i would still say that is not quite there yet. but i rly dont wanna talk trash about that patch cause i think its awesome.
ioriginal has sort of an aggressive snap almost, im struggling to find the right words

yea the fact that you can never replicate anything anyhow definitely muddies the waters and makes it all sort of mysterious and almost like a question of faith

 

well to me it sounds like there is a short attack, slow release. there is a noise layer, and it sounds like someone used strip silence function between the notes, if this was analog source (or nice noise gate like pro g2). the adsr envelope opens a little to the vcf. the filter sounds digital. I think the filter resonance/cutoff sweep might be the hardest part to get correctly or close. I think you could do it, but with a lot of screwing around.

 

The Analog Goes Digital (Digital Revolution) Sooner or later more and more analog hardware will disappear

In my opinion, you can no longer hear out of it today. If you say it's hardware, it might as well be software. A lot of music that you hear can no longer be clearly identified, a whole orchestra can also be produced by one person at home PC using sound libraries.

A good example is the band Yello, Yello had sold all its hardware equipment some time ago, because the software and the PC are so modern today that they can replace the hardware.

 

What most people refer to as analog is the randomness and slight modulation of parameters (like the decay time and filter cutoff, and/or keytrack, in the example in the OP. In my example I only modulated the decay, but I could easily have modulated other parameters (even if it's very little) to make it appear "analog" and probably fool some analog purists out there.
Snappy filters, like in analog gear, can also be added ITB in other ways.

As above, so you don't have to scroll. Original: https://vocaroo.com/19Y02CuFjtyl and mine: https://voca.ro/13arem7I3ZQb

 

Last edited: Aug 8, 2022