It's been quite some time since we've had any new material out, what with the lockdowns, and trying to perfect our sound once we finally could work together again, but we're finally happy to bring you the latest fruit of our labour, Dark Paths.



Any and all criticism, and suggestions good or bad are very welcome. It's the only way that we learn.

We hope that some of you enjoy the track.

 

Wow! Really like your modern dark / melodic / tech style!

Everything is there, your artistic intentions are clear, your universe is well represented and painted, and the mix is very clear too!

The only suggestions I could make are more "artistic" suggestions, for example:

- at 1:09, for the melodic / emotional part, I would suggest to double / triple (harmonize, like a choir) your voice (at least on the most important words or phrases), and to add a little more reverb (use the "Ducking" setting to avoid drowning your voice into reverb, it haves to be subtle, as subtle as your excellent voice performance is!).

...Or you could let things like they are at the beginning (just a little more reverb?), and add voice harmonies + reverb the second time, at 3:25.

- What I appreciate particularly, is that some of your verses are almost spoken, it's not exactly "rap", but could deserve to be doubled by a second voice or, depending of your taste, only on some words / expressions. It's seems particularly important starting 3:02, for your last chorus.

- Your delays are perfect and placed exactly as they should, so please don't change!

 

Last edited: May 30, 2022

@Amore_de_la_Vida thank you so much. That truly does mean a lot to us. Especially what you've mentioned about our mix.

There are only two of us in the band, and neither of us has any background in music writing, mixing, or production. So yeah, that really does mean a lot to us!

Many thanks!

Edit: I didn't see that you had edited your comment. I'll read through it now and reply accordingly.

At 1:09, you're absolutely right, and also not the first person to suggest it. I'm going to have to revisit that section. I was going to use SoundToys Crystallizer on my vocals there, and always record a few more layers. I can't remember why we didn't do that. Quite possibly because we've been working on this track for well over a year and wanted to put something new out. That's no excuse for tardiness. Especially when the ideas are there. And thank you so much for the compliment on my vocal performance! I think this is the only track that we've put out where I've not used Melodyne to alter anything, so that means a lot to me. Thank you.

And again, I agree. The 3:25 mark needs something more dynamic in there to set it apart from the 1:09 mark. I love using Izotope Vocalsynth, and I know that there's a lot more that I could do with that. Again, us wanting to get this track finished so we can move on to something fresh.

Your third point is also something that I've been wanting to do with this track. My head doesn't stop going and going. There's always going to be something that I wish I had done better. Taken more time to think about. We do need to take more time and stop rushing.

I've always found my vocals at the 3:02 mark to be very thin. It definitely needs something in there to back them up/boost them.

Oh, there's no way I'm changing my delays! Hahaha! I spent way too much time automating them.

And with you mentioning the low frequencies on the drums, I again completely agree. I used BASSROOM and Smash and Grab to try to give them a fatter/warmer sound on the low end. I think I over-compensated. It really doesn't help to hear this track multiple times a day, being partially deaf and having tinnitus! For a good mix, that does not make!

But really, thank you so much for the advice/criticism, whatever you want to call it. That's definitely taken onboard.

And I apologise for my long arse reply. I type way too much when I'm drunk!

 

Last edited: May 30, 2022

Yes sorry, I had strange bugs with my browser today, I had to edit my message twice, surely an extension or something...

EDIT: finally, I removed my suggestion to reinforce drums in the bass frequencies, as I listened again your song on studio monitors, the basses are perfectly present, what you could try is just to rise the mediums (between 800 and 2Khz) on the toms a little, if ever you want more realism, of course all of that is a question of taste, your mix is already complete as it is.

 

Last edited: May 30, 2022

@Amore_de_la_Vida that's quite alright. I've been getting a fair few myself.

 

See, that's always been a difficult thing for me to gauge. I know very well that I have become sound-blind to this track. We've had other people say that the final mix is too tinny and lacks presence. You do start to question yourself. Well, I do. Especially with my ears being as shot as they are.

I'm constantly seeking perfection with our drums. You can probably tell that they're all programmed. The only things that are actually real is this track is my vocals and our guitarists' guitars. Everything I program.

I'll give that shot right now.

Again, thank you so much for the feedback. As I said, it's the only way that we learn.

 

I think your case is different, because you have already found your personal, distinctive style, so your technical choices IMHO directly depends on your artistic choices. The words appears particularly important, as they are very expressive, and obviously you have really worked on them.

In your case, IMHO, emotion is paramount, and should be your guide in every aspect of your art, including mixing. You don't have to worry too much, as everything is already there, your voice is there, your mix is super clear, and anyone who hear your songs can already perceive what you are, what are your influences and where you go. That's the essential IMHO.

The fact that you use samples or real drums is not important: what is important IMHO is what they express. For me, drums are organic, they should resonate directly inside the body, in your guts.

What guide me is the fact that I played with human (acoustic) drummers a lot, and I just found that acoustic drums in particular play an enormous role in the overall emotional impact of a Rock song. A drummer can - for example - underline, enhance greatly some of your lyrics / vocal phrases / guitar solos / synth parts etc...

The best way to adjust drums is, IMHO, to just listen directly to the sound of a real, acoustic one. Try for example a real bass tom. How it resonates in your room? How your body react to it ? How the vibrations of the skins are modified if a human bassist / guitarist plays near it?

Because that's what is really magic with acoustic drums played live: they vibrate in resonance with the other instruments played near them!
You can approach this effect with samples, starting by tuning precisely each part of your drum kit in function of your song's overall tonality.

Other (traditional) producers add an incredible realism, by recording the vibrations of the toms (not the cymbals, nor the snare or the pedals, who risk to introduce mechanical parasites) simply by placing them before (near) monitors or PA, and recording the entire song with a pair of mikes placed in overhead. Then, this track is mixed with the rest, but the level is set very low, as it is just an ambient effect, not prominent.

Sorry for being so long, my only excuse is that I'm a real drum lover, or I could also say, a drum fan.

 

@Amore_de_la_Vida I've only just caught your message. I've just literally had friends come over, so I'm preoccupied right now. I shall get back to you soon as!