Slate Digital Virtual Tape Machine.. Killing my Master?

Discussion in 'Mixing and Mastering' started by Brendan, Feb 27, 2022.

  1. fishnose

    fishnose Producer

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    How on earth can a tape emulation 'breathe life' into anything? Using real tape of any kind kills bass, kills treble, kills transients, kills the attack, adds crosstalk and hiss/background noise.
    I have still a Fostex B16 from way back, really high quality back in the day (late 80s). There is NO WAY I would use it these days and destroy my sound.
    It's like having a fancy new car and putting really old perished, bald tyres on it, WTF.
    This whole tape thing is beyond ridiculous.
    Just like the "The older the rack FX we emulate, the better it will sound" thing.
    No, it won't.
    The plugin companies have had to come up with something new to sell and this is one of those pointless things.
     
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  2. hackerz4life

    hackerz4life Audiosexual

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    Gain staging, hitting the sweet spot. High end tape machine in pristine working condition vs consumer tape, big difference.
    Many plugins but only a few sound tape like.
    Nebula, AA, Softube.
     
  3. 5teezo

    5teezo Audiosexual

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    Actually there are. Analog modelled plugins are working based on certain levels relevant in the analog world which are way lower than what's used in dBFS, sou can't just max out your Bus throw a analog plugin on it and expect it to sound "nice"
     
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  4. 5teezo

    5teezo Audiosexual

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    That's not how tape works. You really should educate yourself on how actual 2 inch mastering tape works...

    https://web.archive.org/web/20121116003619/http://www.toneboosters.com/reelproject1/
    https://web.archive.org/web/20121027025946/http://www.toneboosters.com/reelproject2/
    https://web.archive.org/web/20130315163438/http://www.toneboosters.com/reelproject3/
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2022
  5. herznote

    herznote Ultrasonic

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    this is how it works :yes:

     
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  6. Lois Lane

    Lois Lane Audiosexual

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    Best Answer
    Try degaussing the virtual heads of the plugin. Digital magnetism builds up over time and bit reduction naturally occurs.
     
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  7. Trurl

    Trurl Audiosexual

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    I don't know a damn thing about programming a VST but I'm going to make a digital degausser and my life will have had meaning.
     
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  8. Brendan

    Brendan Kapellmeister

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    I processed the confabulator using the magnetic fluctuation reducer. This led me to tweaking the degaussing unit, and adjusting the parameters. Now my mix sounds fantastic! But honestly, I'm just trying softubes and VTM, for hip-hop softube's is better since it doesn't accentuate. But for other genres VTM is a nice touch on the master bus now that I'm properly using it.
     
  9. Lois Lane

    Lois Lane Audiosexual

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    For the past 6 years or so I've been exclusively using the Acme MFR mkII. For all the hype on the forums around how great it is, the StewMac fluctuation reducer really is horrible. The last time I used it it destroyed my Black Rooster Audio Magnetite which wasn't covered in the warrenty. Get the Acme and thank me later.
     
  10. hackerz4life

    hackerz4life Audiosexual

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    Your scenario is just one that can happen, but also a scenario that happens to mostly beginners. When i said no rules i meant sometimes it works sometimes it wont, depends on the material.
     
  11. Haze

    Haze Platinum Record

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    C'mon, surely you miss the calibration, splicing, tape degradation, tangles, snaps, manual drop-ins, the rewinding and all the other joys of tape! :rofl:

    It's a similar theme across many areas of digital audio, emulating gear that anybody that actually had to use it couldn't be happier to see the back of. The huge trend for analog synths these days also has parallels, though slightly more understandable as they do sound good. Good luck to anyone that wants to use that stuff live and stay in tune.
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2023
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  12. Haze

    Haze Platinum Record

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    As a more useful addition...

    Gain-staging is everything when it comes to using modelled hardware emulations. Digital plugins couldn't care less about input levels but many emu's do. This stuff was designed to be optimal at 0 dBVU which is equivalent to about -18 dBFS. Setting the levels prior to hitting such plugins will greatly improve the response - use the gain within the plugin itself to emulate overdriven characteristics if desired. If it's designed correctly that should yield much better results than feeding a too hot digital signal in to it.

    Beyond single plugins themselves, proper gain-staging will also result in better mixes in general. It allows more headroom for plugin chaining and the accumulative increase of multiple channels processed and summed once they reach the master bus.

    Oh and speaking as a former mastering engineer, take all that shit of your master bus, it's not helping. If distortion / noise is desired put it on individual channels or groups. Use a little compression on the master bus if you must but have it on from the beginning and mix into it. Leave all the additional equalisation, stereo tools, limiters off until the final mastering stage, your mix will thank you for it.
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2023
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  13. Riddim Machine

    Riddim Machine Audiosexual

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    There's is a rule (yes, a rule) when you're dealing with analog emulations in a digital mix, which is GAIN STAGING. Try to get you first input levels of all mics with the faders at unit gain and try to set the balance of your mix with the input gains instead of the fader. Every emulation has a different headroom, so i cant tell which level should you gain stage, bc i don't know your chains, but try to keep it not as low and not really loud (above -12 dbfs). Doing that, all your channels should be healthy, will tend to alias/clip/introduce artifacts less, and so will be your 2buss and anything on it.

    I'm not father of anyone, so you could ignore everthing i said above if aliasing is part of your sound and gain staging is shit for your workflow because you like VU's on red

    (and VTM from Slate is pure trash. Use Flywheel or Softube Tape)
     
  14. Stevie Dude

    Stevie Dude Audiosexual

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    Slate VTM was modeled after a Studer A80 owns by Howie Weindberg and he talks about it a little about how to use it in this video. around minute 48:00

     
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