Intel has launched Arlder Lake desktop CPUs earlier than the original Q1/2022 expected release period. This was to force their way back into the #1 position for single core gaming performnce while proving competition to both AMD & Apple in the eearly stages. There are ARM & RISC processors in development that will further disrupt the current x86/x64 based CPU market.

Don't be in a rush to grab the new shiny object without taking a good look at what it is, what it offers and, what is required to use it's potential.

To get the full potential of the new Intel CPus. You will need:

• A Case with good air intake & exhaust (even for the i5).
• A large well designed air cooler (be certain that the cooler will mount properly even if it is LGA 1700 design) or
• A minimum 240mm/280mm well designed AIO with normal thickness & optimzed fans.
• A Z690 workstation/creator motherboard (very few available at launch date). Review baords are gaming & overclocking models.
• Updated BIOS for motherboard
• DD5 memory (very scarce & expansive as of launch date).
• PCIe 4.0 devices for the 5.0 slots at minimum. PCIe 5.0 devices (wich are currently non-existant as of launch date).
• 850W power supply (preferably Platinum rated) as minimum. CPU can draw 300+ watts continous under heavy work load.
• Windows 11 Pro or Windows 11 Pro for Workstations
• https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/business/compare-windows-11

Windows 11 is still not 100% ready. There are strange scheduler issues in the current release.
This is why the urging of not upgrading or, installing Windows 11 is still being advised. The hardware and especially, the software platform is not fully baked at the launch of Alder Lake.

Intel has truly made strides with their take on Big-Little CPU design. Intel & Microsoft, just simply, put the cart before the horse IMHO.

AnandTech Review

As of December 2021, there are still very few affordable (DDR4 or DDR5 motherboards with adequate VRM solutions. DDR5 is largely non-existent and, exceedingly expensive. PCIe 5.0 devices are still not available and, will most likely be over-priced as well when available.

So Intel...Which came first, the chicken or the egg?

Intel Alder Lake DDR5 Memory Scaling Analysis With G.Skill Trident Z5
by Gavin Bonshor on December 23, 2021 9:00 AM EST

 

Last edited: Dec 24, 2021

AMD on PC platform is still most efficient at the same power levels with equal or superior performance. Maybe the next iteration will give improved per watt used performance.

All of the serious reviewers give Intel praise for their accomplishment but, point out that Alder Lake only achieves top performance by running at a constant boost stage. It has also been pointed out that 100 degree Celsius is easily achieved just by starting a normal work load.

Reminds me of dropping a V8 in a Volkswagon. You can surely go fast. But safety & stability are nowhere to be found.

 

I'd wait for Meteor Lake, but I will probably go with 5nm Zen4.

Here is an Alder Lake review:

https://www.techspot.com/review/2351-intel-core-i9-12900k/

 

I would have to agree. The gains are marginal at best for Intel. Even with the lower CPU prices, when you total what is needed for the new platform, Intel is 30 - 40% more expensive (staying with DDR4).

DDR5 so far has not shown any benefit that would suggest it being needed for the average user or, the higher price. The one thing missing is more PCIe lanes. Why did Intel not increase that vital feature? Also why not make the remaining PCIe lanes version PCIe 4.0 which would still be backwards compatible with PCIe 3.0?

Dependent upon what AMD release Q1/2022 and, if Apple offers an updated MacMini/iMac Pro, one of those will most likely be the choice for a new system. After the delays of 2020 & 2021, I personally, don't really want to wait for Intel & Microsoft to get things right.

 

I have been a PC advocate for years.
However, I still love MAC's for different reasons. That said, there is a very good reason MAC moved away from Intel chips.
Personally, I have always liked RISC processors, also for a very good reason.

 

Started off on Apple and made the transition to IBM clone (PC) after Atari.

Looks like I may be going Linux on my current PC & Mac for a new system the way things are playing out for now. Unless of course AMD delivers a notable improvement with a Zen 3 vCache APU.

 

Apple has gone through 4 architectures by now, the first Macs were Motorola (m86k), then they moved to PowerPC (IBM chips), then Intel x86/x64 and finally their current ARM-based ones. And they provided transitions for all of these.

Your comment about Linux is also pretty nonsensical, what difference do you think it makes running a different OS on the same HW?

 

How is it "nonsense", to run a different OS other than Windows? Especially with Windows 11 showing that Microsoft has not learned from past OS makeovers or, they don't really care.

Linux runs more efficiently on a 10 year old laptop than Windows and, with no missing drivers or, driver issues. This is my test bed for current Debian based Linux RT Kernel on the AV Linux MXE distro. This will allow me to breath new life into an older main system saving time, frustration & money.

Rather than suffer through another Windows failure, I, have personally decided to move on from Windows & return to MacOS & Linux.

Cross-Platform software that runs natively on Linux include:
Ardour
Bitwig Studio
Mixbus/Mixbus 32c (custom version of Ardour)
Reaper
Renoise
Waveform

 

I agree and that's why I use Linux online and Windows offline.

 

Yes I did the Notator / Cubase thing on the 1024ST when 4MB of RAM nobody would ever use

I still love PC because for end-users it is far easier to replace individual parts and generally a lot cheaper for parts i.e.
The thing is with MAC's push on their new expensive iphones, if you fully stack up the new desktops with 256GB RAM and a High end GPU, it is around the same price or less than a PC boasting similar specs. That's a first. Not cheap but MAC's have always been up to a couple of thousand dollars more expensive until now.

 

240mm? Nah!
IF it is to be more silent(music PC), a big case like Fractal Meshify 2 XL + 420mm AIO
or better with a custom water kit with dual radiator and low RPM fans.

 

You did see that i typed 'as minimum'?

for the i5 12600K/Kf a 240mm/280mm AIO should work just fine. For the i7 a 280mm or larger for sure.

 

I'm glad if Intel competes again with AMD and the design shows promise. But...

- New and very different motherboard
- DDR5
- Only for Windows 11

Not only this is very expensive like @quadcore64 said. They're only comparing AMD with DDR4 against Intel with DDR5. Even when Intel 12 gen is DDR4 compatible. The DDR generation jump has HUGE influences on the performance. I wonder where are the new intel mobos with DDR4... oh, wait, they aren't

Only the Windows 11 thing pisses me off. The greatest low-level differences with Windows 10 are task scheduler (directly related to multi-core) and power management (directly related to different core types). Exactly like tailor made for Intel new CPU, launch date included.

Wouldn't be bad if they weren't so focused on Intel that Ryzens had big losses in performance vs Windows 10. It can be fixed and it will but smells farty. They should rename it to "Windows 12 Gen Intel". Oh, and beta

 

Last edited: Nov 5, 2021

Ok, for sure the task scheduler is different, but most people don't even know how to change it's parameters. But you're comparing (as you said) a 10 year old laptop with modern machines.

Don't get me wrong, as a server system something like Debian makes much more sense. So your comment is still nonsensical.

 

It looks as if Intel is actually selling an processor overclocked to death from the factory. :/ These 12th gen Intel CPUs consume twice the power of equivalent AMD Ryzen offerings, for pretty much the exact same performance. 240w for a desktop CPU these days is rather ludicrous. AMD is selling 8/16 cores CPUs that run at 65w with impressive specs and better or same performance.

So Intel fans, hold your horses and don't get too excited. Intel made these just to be able to compete and their CPU architecture is at its limits. There's also this "thing" with Microsoft W11... I'm not into conspiracies, but it does look suspicious, like MS and Intel have something going on under the table, and sure is not feet scratching...

I'd rather wait for Ryzen 6, but when it comes out I'm going to look for a 2nd hand Ryzen 5 5600X. Buying older tech saves you tons of money and you will have a more mature and polished platform to work with. Stability, people. And make music! Don't waste time on diagnosing problems.

Windows vs Linux? I'm very slowly transitioning to Linux, thanks to Reaper and more developers developing VSTs for Linux. It'll still take a while, though. I just updated to Debian 10 today. Works so nicely and looks great! I don't like the Windows look and usability [especially Explorer] since W7 on. I hate that I can't have a dark theme as easily as on Linux. W8 looks terrible. At least W10 has a dark theme...

Cheers!

 

Last edited: Nov 5, 2021

You seem to be cherry picking parts of comments to argue your point which is founded on lack of knowledge at best.
Linux is more than a server platform OS. Linux like MacOS is an off-shoot or fork, of Unix.

The 10 year old is a test bed. I have also run the same OS from a live USB image on a 2014 MacBook Air with no issues. This means I can keep that going past Big Sur (last supported OS for that device).

Have you seen what System76 has done with PC hardware & their custom version of Debian called Pop! OS ?
Did you know that some custom audio workstation makers off Linux as an OS option?

Please don't fanboy us to death. Technology that does what it should is to be complimented. Technology that doesn't should be called out. As pointed out. Intel has made strides. They & Microsoft have released product that is not completely ready for general use (no-Beta).

 

I love Linux, it's paid my bills for 20+ years. Yeah, I'm aware of custom versions that basically run JACK as their backend, but even then you do realize the way you have to customize the kernel builds to make it work? And Pop OS is basically a respin of the latest Ubuntu.

ALSA is fantastic, but since when I've had a compatible hardware for that? Hardly ever.

But again, you're comparing (in tech terms anyway) 10 year old hardware with the latest. I would not consider the last Intel hardware as of yet for anything, but that's by the by.

 

There was a time when programmers compressed their code and hardware manufacturers had a modicum of stability. There also was a time when programmers worked directly from the clock speeds and they found that the need for speed made that very short-lived.
Thirty years on when entire applications could never fit on floppy disks, it's like someone forgot the need for stability in the search for bigger, brighter, faster.
How anyone can call something that chews up masses of power as being efficient is an oxymoron. In case nobody noticed, the larger app companies are nearly making their products tailored to forcing people to upgrade their hardware regularly or they simply cannot upgrade.
If the computer you purchased new has a lifespan of five years now consider yourself lucky.
The number of threads worldwide of MAC users complaining about apps not working on the latest O/S update is astronomical and has been for years. The amount of PC users who have to upgrade to meet the memory, disk access and GPU requirements is also astounding.

My point is they could make it easier on the end-user and being honest, they have not. Why do people want to move to Linux more now than ever? Linux has not changed that much in decades. It still requires a tenth of the power, speed and HW grunt to run efficiently than any of its counterpart operating systems and still in many scenarios kicks their ass. If that does not say something stinks, I do not know what does. I cannot move everything over either, but I understand why people want to shift there. It does not tell you that you have to upgrade your machine. I have seen a new Ubuntu version running on an ancient Pentium 1. Linux is free, the other main two are not. Goes to show people appreciate something they pay for more than something they get for free.

To me it is like the difference between a car made in 1920 and a car made in 2020 both still running well. They both get you from A to B. One just does it faster and the 2020 one has to be faster because what is in it won't run at all unless it is faster has more space and is more powerful. Kind of says someone forgot the purpose somewhere while they were working on the bells and whistles. The function and original purpose should have remained as paramount in the pursuit for speed and number-crunching but it didn't.

 

Last edited by a moderator: Nov 6, 2021

I get the opinions in favor of Linux. I also make a living using Linux (server, no GUI) as a web backend developer.

But let's be real. Take a look at the best Linux IDEs, the apps used for programming complex GUI-rich apps. In Linux there's no alternative to C++. The closest is Java, almost extinct in desktop apps.

Code::Blocks: fine, but years ahead of MacOS (XCode) and Windows (Visual Studio)
Eclipse: totally written in Java. Slow AF graphically.

These are way less productive than Mac/Windows counterparts (C#/Swift). Both the IDE and the language. Especially when it comes to apps with GUI. C++ is fast, light and free but very hard thus not productive. Doesn't help the madness of last versions, similar related to [1] later
Why people still use Java on Linux? Because despite bloated is productive, has GUI framework and it's free. There's no other alternative.

Keep in mind GUI apps in a modern OS involve much more than the pure graphic system. The last time I saw a Linux distro with a GUI aiming at that level the Linux users started complaining. "It's slow in my Pentium with 1GB RAM" and that shit. Dozens of "lighter and faster" alternatives since that. But simpler and less features.

It's not a Linux flaw per se. Linux is free and that's great but:
- Most companies don't make Linux versions just because of that. I'm always talking of complex, complex GUI, fast apps. This also includes drivers, the issue has improved but persists
- You need a lot of time and resources (money) to make an rich-gui full-featured OS able to host also Gui-rich, fast, low-level (any kind: speed, audio, graphics) software.
- [1] For the good and the bad, you need a boss owning the OS if only to avoid a lot of fragmentation. There's dozens of Linux distros each with its own GUI and it's fine, but that means most of the work on each different one is duplicated dozens of times.

And we are still lucky because real time audio software is one of the few markets that needs C++.

You can't have it all.

Edited: before someone says there's good software like that in Linux. Yes, but exceptions

 

Last edited: Nov 6, 2021

Well, I'm glad Intel shut up my mouth at least with the memory thing. First trust-worthy reviews came out finally with Intel 12K using DDR4. The performance using DDR5 or DDR4 is almost identical. Surprisingly identical but, well, new tech and stuff I guess.

And the performance numbers although worse than "official Intel" leaks are still quite good. It's still like a factory overclocked CPU with nuclear power plant levels of power usage but we knew that already.