Hey, remember when Youtube didn't personalize the Recommendations? It was such a gold mine for digging music, it still kind of is but I prefer browsing Discogs and searching up on YT or Spotify.

 

yeah this was not so long ago

 

i would pay for a search function where you could list the videos with the least clicks.

 

Simple: goto my youtube channel

 

https://gearspace.com/board/mastering-forum/1191869-mastering-youtube-lufs.html
Post: #9

 

That's an old post from 2017. YouTube changed normalization to -14 LUFS in 2019: https://www.meterplugs.com/blog/2019/09/18/youtube-changes-loudness-reference-to-14-lufs.html

 

Thanks for the clarification.

 

and that's another problem, platforms constantly changing their standards makes it impossible to release consistent tracks and albums in years to come

 

I'm also curious whether we will be able to agree on quality standards in the future. If you want to send something to the radio station ORF, you have to pay attention to the following: File format mp2, mp3 or wav (256 kbit, 48 kHz, -9 dB)

The problem is mainly due to the many devices, one has a smartphone, the other a laptop, yet another has a tablet and many of them probably have a real PC at home. In addition, there are various types of inter-transmission, one of which already has fiber optics, the other uses Elon Musk's satellites because he lives in the desert. The rest uses a copper cable, where the traffic is constantly cut when more users are online at the same time.

Spoiler: Streaming audio

Streaming audio
Streaming audio avoids many of the problems associated with the size of files on the Internet. Instead of waiting for the entire file to be downloaded, you can listen to the file as it arrives on your computer. This is a safe transfer method for artists and record labels because the file is never actually downloaded to your computer.

Streaming audio players store data in a buffer for several seconds before it is played. this buffer absorbs the incoming data packets when they arrive from the Internet at an irregular rate and outputs them at a constant rate, which enables problem-free playback.
You can stream many digital audio formats by embedding in a streaming format, such as Microsoft ASF (Active Streaming Format) which can stream MS audio, MP3 and other formats.

Streaming audio formats
(Developer - Type // Primary Format)
MICROSOFT - Windows Media Technology // - WindowsMedia Audio / Active Streaming Format (ASF)
THE ICECASTTEAM - Icecast (open source) // - MP3
QUICKTIME //- Quick-Time

source: Bobby Owsinski - The Mastering Engineer's Handbook: The Audio Mastering Handbook

 

while it is no problem that there is a requirement for mastering (there always was, when you only think about radio, club, vinyl and casette, later CD and DVD and compressed formats) it is always a problem when somebody changes that afterwards when it is played.

the internet is full of discussions and articles about "how to produce for youtube and kaazaa", and this is not how it should be.

if people feel they have to think about that already during "making music", then these requirements already went wrong.

 

Mh, this part 'It does not say or describe anything regarding peaks' isn't really correct. LUFS is always to be seen in connection to TP, otherwise this value doesn't make any sense. TP is not sample peak but at least the sample peaks can't be higher.

 

Technical Document AES TD1004.1.15-10 (PDF)
Recommendation for Loudness of Audio Streaming and Network File Playback
http://www.aes.org/technical/documents/AESTD1004_1_15_10.pdf

iTunes -16 LUFS, Youtube -14 LUFS, Spotify -14 LUFS, Tidal -14 LUFS, Amazon Music -14 LUFS, Soundcloud -9 LUFS.

Mixing and Mastering with LUFS

 

Version 1.0: 19 October, 2015.

As

 

Yes, the PDF is a bit older and cannot be used as a basic reference for YouTube etc., but it does convey basic information on the topic: Recommendation for Loudness of Audio Streaming and Network File Playback. I think this can be useful as a basic reference for some users. In the digital revolution, you have to be able to rely on something. I think more of the qualified sound engineers.

Spoiler: Why LUFS?

Why LUFS?
The problem with different volume levels wasn't just limited to the music sector. The problem was also ubiquitous in broadcasting. The difference in volume between a television film and the commercial interruption it contained took on such grotesque features that the European Broadcast Union was forced to set a guideline for loudness. The hour of birth of the EBU R128 specification, which was first implemented in Germany in 2012. This guideline also introduced a new unit of measurement, the LUFS (Loudness Units relative to Full Scale). Where 1 x LU (Loudness Units) corresponds to the relative value of 1 dB. At the same time, a new upper limit for digital audio was defined. According to the EBU, a digital peak level of −1 dB TP (True Peak) should not be exceeded. That is the reason why Spotify and Co provide a true peak limit of -1 dBFS for music files.

Tip: I recommend adhering to this limit. Especially if we do not adhere to the loudness requirement of -14 dB LUFS. At higher levels, the normalization algorithm will definitely intervene. In this context, Spotify refers to the following: If we do not adhere to a -1 dB TP as the upper limit (ceiling), the normalization process can lead to sound artifacts. But this value is not set in stone, as we shall see later. Loudness units offer the mastering engineer a special advantage. To put it simply, we should be able to use the LUFS specification to quantify how “loud” a song is and thus compare different songs in terms of their loudness. More on that later.

How do I know if a streaming service is normalizing my mix?
The bad news: Streaming platforms sometimes have very different requirements. Therefore, you basically have to look for the specifications of each individual service if you want to follow its guidelines. This can turn into hard work, as there are over fifty streaming and broadcast platforms worldwide. As an example, the specifications of some providers with regard to ideal LUFS values:

-11 LUFS Spotify Loud
-14 LUFS Amazon Alexa, Spotify Normal, Tidal, YouTube
-15 LUFS Deezer
-16 LUFS Apple, AES streaming recommendation
-18 LUFS Sony Entertainment
-23 LUFS EU R128 broadcast
-24 LUFS US TV ATSC A / 85 broadcast
-27 LUFS Netflix

The good news is that there are various ways to compare your mix with the specifications of the most important platforms at a glance. How much a specific track is manipulated by the respective platforms can be checked on this website: www.loudnesspenalty.com
Source:https://www.elysia.com/de/schlagwort/lufs-de/

 

Last edited: May 23, 2021

That much is true.

I beg your pardon?

 

Me too...! I believe and learn from qualified sound engineers. For example Bobby Owsinski (has worked on projects as an engineer, producer, writer or arranger including music, commercials, television and motion pictures) and Thomas Sandmann (producer and graduate sound engineer).

Spoiler: Thomas Sandmann

Thomas Sandmann
- Thomas Sandmann: Effects and Dynamics, PPV-Verlag, 7th edition 2008,
- Thomas Sandmann: Music video production, PPV-Verlag, 2009
- Thomas Sandmann: Studio Basics, PPV-Verlag, 2016

Spoiler: Bobby Owsinski

Bobby Owsinski
(2017) Recording Engineer's Handbook Fourth Edition (original first edition in 2000
(2017) Mastering Engineer's Handbook Fourth Edition (original first edition in 2003
(2016) The Mixing Engineer's Handbook Fourth Edition (original first edition in 1999
(2016) Music Producer's Handbook Second Edition
(2016) Drum Recording Handbook Second Edition (with Dennis Moody)
(2014) PreSonus StudioLive Official Handbook
(2012) Abbey Road To Ziggy Stardust (with Ken Scott)
(2012) Audio Mixing Bootcamp
(2012) Audio Recording Basic Training
(2011) Studio Builder's Handbook (with Dennis Moody)
(2010) Mixing And Mastering With T-Rack S.

 

So is there a vip with spotify and others streaming apps also? I know spotify does the same sorta thing but some of these songs on there sound way louder. Uploading to spotify takes 24-48 hours usually

 

What is a vip ?

 

This is an interesting article on how the youtube online normalization algorithm works
https://aimastering.com/blog/en/youtube-loudness-normalization/

Furthermore it seems that their audio/video encoding is also views-dependent, this means that if the video is successful it will subsequently be encoded in a different format (yes: they seem to store the original file uploaded)
The truth is that Youtube has never published official specs on the current procedures used: I begin to think that they avoid disclosing technical details to prevent users from finding methods to circumvent algorithm

 

Last edited by a moderator: May 23, 2021

maybe dumb question but what brings this way for you ?
no trackin and stuff like that ?