this is why what I said.. go to a guitar instructor too.. who could lower the action for you.. and make other adjustments..
they know how difficult it can be to start playing... but those kinds of shops have mostly been killed off...

I have helped sell guitars in shops before.. by pointing out a guitar that will be easier to fret.. it's not the guitar's fault..
but the ignorance of the n00b..and maybe a lousy salesman who just didn't care... I wrecked my fingers for a while on
a supposedly nice Fender acoustic until I got the action lowered...it's almost a rite of passage,
it can dissuade you from playing I agree, but for accessibility it beats buying a piano hands down....

and for God's sake try to avoid anything made in China... maybe some of it is just ok
but that's about all...

now on the other hand ..a cheap electric piano can be had for not a lot of dough these days too..,
tho it's still not as easy to lug around or impress your friends with
would still recommend some lessons

if you just get a midi controller, then you dive right into FLStudio.. you can end
up like OP asking this question here... I liken it to skipping music 101.. then sitting
down to start your career as a composer... duh

and if you wanna go it alone.. then jump into youtube.. tons of everything of course..

p.s. I am aware fruityloops has evolved to something much more robust these days..and also what the current name is, not my DAW of choice, but I am actually considering buying it at some point because it has some policies that really respect the customer..

 

Last edited by a moderator: Jun 5, 2017

Please consider that other people have other ways to find their way into music production. That he is asking doesn't mean he has no chance to get it and learn from the answers. My daughter has a friend who visited us for a sleep over. She was 7 years old and didn't know that saucage was made of animals, when we made barbecue. But she learned it. ;)

 

oh and by the way.. I think you iced the cake on my argument for me...

 

Good thing you ended with a "LOL !"...For one second there, I thought you were getting angry as hell for some very trivial considerations...
Seriously though. A lot of popular music "poducers" (that's a very wide label, basically goes from country composers to EDM bedroom producers) are classicaly trained (even if they didn't get that knowledge the classical way which a lot did also anyway), and you ought to be really deaf to music and not be a real musician if you can't even pick that while listening to them and just hear sound. Just saying...

 

Last edited by a moderator: Dec 7, 2017

Hello AB69,

the best thing is if you find a midi file of the song, just type the song name into google and add "midi".

a good site for this is:

https://www.nonstop2k.com

unfortunately for the song you mentioned there isn't one available, for now

if you want to transfer to piano chords you can use this site:

https://www.8notes.com/piano_chord_chart/

normally you can locate chord changes by listening to the bass.

Ableton can convert any Audio signal into midi in 2 different ways, both resulting in a mess for the most part if there's a lot going on but it can help to find out. i think Logic has got some similar function now, dunno for other daw's.

then there is Chordify:

https://chordify.net/chords/simon-patterson-magnus-evoke-extended-mix-a-state-of-trance

this site can show you the chords on time, playing along to any youtube video or uploaded file.

this can be very accurate but not guaranteed, but its way more than just having some letters one after another.

playing along and listening or looping a bar in your daw and switching notes up or down in your piano roll is another way.

combining all of this methods should lead to results

 

actually many of the greatest musicians have "no clue" about music theory

 

If you really think a "lol" makes his stupid reply a joke or not an upset statement you are socially not that bright. His lol is nothing more than a sneer. He is so upset that he didn't even notice a sign like this: -> ;)

And zorgbob: You are such an ignorant and arrogant fool, its actually not worth to reply to your shitty comment. So much hate for nothing.

But here it is: Do you know anything about AB69? Do you know how old he or she is? Do you know anything beside your stereotypical black and white classification? Please ask some guys from here how they started producing music before you declare people as hopeless cases. I for myself started with mixing songs on cassettes together as the only girl who made school discos. And later played guitar in front of thousends of people. I produced several albums and remixes and now do nothing more than fun with kids and music for myself. According to your stupid world view i never ever was able to do so. So please ... SORRY! Was to upset!

 

Last edited by a moderator: Jun 6, 2017

I love girls talking like that.

 

And if you didn't catch the irony of my statement you're really socially...hum...not very able...

This little dude : , usually means there is a joke somewhere...

Like @foster911 doesn't actually loves you (yet). It's a figure of speech and irony. Just translating in case.

 

If this turns you on.. you really need to come to USA man... you will get it in spades...

@Elisea Talmi was being sarcastic, that much was pretty easy to read..

but you're right zorgbob sounds like a miserable failed musician who is mad at the world...
the fuck do I care if some kids.. (or adults) want to wank around on a computer
then call it a musical composition... it might be better than slaving for years with
music and instruments and becoming a bitter old codger.... that being said..
some people can achieve interesting things with digits and software.... I just sort of
put it in another class of auditory stimulus... and appreciate it on those terms, if at all possible

 

Last edited by a moderator: Jun 5, 2017

Got it! I was lost in translation, because i thought your smiley meant the triviality of my considerations. Now i understand what its about. But don't forget: i'am socially very able!

 

did you click the 1 link in the page(the one that has the "chords ins <blue) ?
then click on guitar (top right) and change it to piano.
nice visual animation in real time for beginners

 

If you wanna make music dosnt matter what genre. You have to learn some theory. The OP dosent seem to have a clue about chords.
This is like to say, i would love to learn a language but i dont know how to build a sentence.
A lot of so called producer dont understand that. You dont have to read music Notes from a sheet. But you have to know some scales and chord basics. Why? cause it is the magic formular (the grammar) how music is made. Yes sure you can do some nice loop tunes without knowin anything about theory. But you will come to a point where you have to learn some theory.

I mean its not that hard C = ceg - play that as an arpeggio or a full chord XD on every intrument.

 

I also would suggest everyone to invest time in basic musical theory . in the time I started with music there was no internet to ask questions about the basics of music.

 

Yeah me neither. So I got second hand books. Fortunately there are more interactives ways to learn that now, even for people who can't afford a teacher.
Every one finds their own way at their own pace, the fact that the OP is trying to find shortcuts for his chords matter means that he is at a point in his music making process where he needs those tools, he'll find ways to make sense of them or he won't be able to use them.
Even learning by "cheating" is actually learning, at the end of the day the sites that show him on a piano roll what is a C, perform exactly the same task as a music teacher would : they tell him what composes a major chord. Here just by asking his relatively naive question he just also learned that there are several types, that you can notate them differently, and I'm sure in not so long he'll understand what differenciates a major and a minor chord in term of intervals. Then who knows, maybe scales will make more sense.
There are many ways to skin a cat. When people start to interest themself at the technicalities of the music matter, the langage as some put it, it doesn't matter if they learn with a certified teacher and in an academic manner, only results count.
Theory doesn't have to be theorical as it lives in the praxis, it can be incorporated by practice alone, many method to learn an instrument rely on that more than learning the theory first and they yield great results.

 

I think the reason for refraining from spending time with it and shunning learning any theory is being afraid of any probable harassing and cumbersome tasks that the learner has to carry out. I suggest to rename the "music theory" to "music love story" for snaring and stringing along the greenhorn. Love and story are two keywords that would deceive everyone.

 

I was wondering the same thing.
How do I read Russian in books and on websites? I look at all the letters in a row and I'm like, "Where do the words start and end?", "How do I pronounce the syllables." Is it too hard for these Russian books to be translated to English letters?

I ask because I am writing some poetry and maybe a novel in Russian. And it is so frustrating seeing these random shapes but not knowing what sound is associated them. Plus, what about syntax and order? Where do the nouns go relative to the verbs? What about the direct objects or even the indirect objects. Oh shit! i just remembered the verb tenses. How do I conjugate them?

Then again, I wonder if actually learning how to read and write first then sitting down and trying create in a given language, is the best order of operations. But fuck it! Instead of doing that I'll just ask arbitrary questions out of context on a forum. Because we all know an entire language can be distilled and mastered from a few naive questions on the internet.

 

As a part of my anger management I decided to try to help.. ;)

Ok here is how I would deal with a trance piece like this if I were you. I will try to keep this simple as possible and MIDI-friendly. First, there are no "chords" per se - don't worry, we will "extract chords" from other elements.

BTW, the link you posted is useless. I've never seen such a mess. Though I was playing it just for a couple of bars (yes, changed it to piano) it seems to me like some random "chord" generator that can extract a harmony even from a beat(???) like you observed.

So instead listen to the music.
bar 1-33 bass drum and a couple of times a TONE (FX), not a chord on F. It gives us a hint something will happen on F
bar 33-49 driving bass on F (now you can be 99% sure it is a tonic of a scale) but at this point it can be a minor, major..
bar 49-65 the melody starts. Here you get the information to determine the scale type. You can assume it is F, but which - well you get the NOTE (still no chords) that is particular to the scale (F-minor in this case). It is Ab (A-flat) as you will see later.
---
Warning - theory (you can skip):
The piece is in F-Minor. But you have 3 of them. Natural, harmonic and melodic. In trance you should use the "natural". Harmonic will sound too Arabic, middle-eastern flavored and the melodic is played different when ascending than when descending, which will get you in trouble.
---
So he starts the melody with Ab (A-flat) which is a minor third above the F and practically plays all the scale down.

In fact he plays a Bb before the Ab (one time) and a G (the second time) and makes a loop. But Bb and G are not relevant because they are part of F-major and F-minor scale.

Enough theory, let's jam - I will play (here it's not about the sound, i'll take the first saw-ish thing, even for bass)
- F minor up-down
- F minor up and the minor third up to Ab


- Lead line down (simplified)
- Lead line down (original - mind the Ab is emphasized - double )


---
Warning, theory (you can skip)
Ab major is F minor's relative key so don't be surprised if now it sounds like Ab major - when we'll add bass it will be ok..
---
BASS LINE AND CHORDS, YAY!!!
bar 65 he goes with the bass from F to Db for 1 bar, then back to F for the 7 remaining (dont even like it..)
bar 93 FINALLY something happens - it's all about the bass line that goes F-> Db Bb F-> Ab Bb Db--> Eb-->
There are NO explicit chords in this music but we can put triads on top of the bass (as the root). Be careful to use only the notes of F minor scale (it doesn't matter if the chord alone comes out as major or minor)!
- bass line bass + chords


Now we can listen if it works together. Remember, this is only for "chord extraction" if there is souch a thing.. By the Mozart standards this is wrong (because I have parallel fifths..) so I should deal with chord voicing... But in today's music it's kinda ok ;)


That's all folks. As simple as it gets..

 

Last edited: Jun 6, 2017

1- Classical music aficionados can name the instruments in an orchestra based on sound alone because of timbre, even going so far as to distinguish a C trumpet from a B♭ trumpet or an E♭ clarinet from a B♭ clarinet.

2- Electric guitar players can easily identify the sounds of single coil and humbucker pickups.

3- Techno and house music producers know the sounds of various models of drum machines from the timbres they produce.

4- Popular music, although relatively straightforward in terms of melody and harmony, often uses complex layers of signal processing to produce tension and release.

.
.
.

Everyone of us is focusing on different tasks and no need to pour all of our effort and energy out into different aspects of the sound and expediently it's impossible.

 

@zorkbop
You must read this book. I found some similarities between you and the author of this book:
https://audiosex.pro/threads/the-art-policy-and-musical-judgements-who-decides-what-is-great.28229/

 

Last edited by a moderator: Jun 7, 2017