Elemental, my dear Herr Durr: we're still tuning down our guitars.

Not a trivial thing. This is my progress during the last year:

Currently I'm trying to go another step ahead with a 6 string bass for rhythm guitars and an 8 string guitar tuned drop dead for lead.

PS: I'm not a metal head, I'm a metal cabinet.

 

The thing with impulse responses is that they can't simulate dynamics (non linearities), only raw frequency response. So you use the closest amp-head plugin (mesa dual rectifier I think with Metallica), carefully tweak it and then eq matching to simulate the cabinet and correct differences in the manual amp head plugin output. It's what Positive Grid Amp plugins do automatically.

Another case is BestPlugins youtuber. He made a lot of IRs to match popular song guitar tones using always the same TSE TS808 plus X30 amp (preamp) combination.

 

just a video i found of low tuning a# below 5 string bass tuning on guitar

here is 10 string guitar tuned to G# below 5 string bass you could drop this to f# that would be the limit with guitar of 30" scale length, if you got a guitar with 37" scale length you could tune low though.

 

Last edited: May 5, 2017

Damn, she beated me!

I have no choice, I'll double the bet. Meet my next rhythm guitar:

I'll just have to figure out where to put humbucker pickups...

I'll keep you posted. I know, I'm a winner...

 

Last edited: May 5, 2017

I see. just a matter of seeking perfection.. got it...

I'll be here waiting to hear your masterpiece Señor Xupito...

 

Well, I've several shitpieces. If you want a masterpiece I'm afraid I'm not your guy ;-) . In fact I don't even have a guitar.

This is the best I've done and it's only a cover. I don't remember what I did but at some point the guitar sound goes nuts lol

 

not bad for a shitpiece... dump some more one of these days compadre...

 

I think that you refer to how pissed off the riff sounds. What I can tell you about that, is that you can only get that straight from the source. That is how Dimebag played, and if you want to make a cover like this one you better piss off your guitar too and play the crap out of it. It's all in the agression of the playing itself. I remember a guitar teacher I had that when he saw me picking he said "are you a kid, or are you a man?". He never had to tell me that twice. You get the picture.

Indeed it was. At that time I was very into Pantera, and I remember that I had ordered a Dimebag guitar book through a local store called "Riffer Madness" (which was a compilation of all his columns in guitar magazines). When everything happened and the store called me up to pick up the book, I remember the guy at the counter looking at me with a sad face and saying "...so fucked up, isn't it?". I still consider that book a little treasure, since it was mostly all Dime's own writing and was pretty hilarious.

Well, I wanted to participate but I'm a lazy fuck who never finishes mixes, and didn't have the time to at that time anyway. I'm buying some news monitors next week and hopefully I'll do something with them

 

Last edited: May 6, 2017

Thanks! Will try those

 

Ok, so no laughters please, but only serious comments. This is a first (and very simple try). Again: I'm not trying to sound like a Fender/Marshall combo, etc. I'm after the energy. In this try it certainly reminds a lot still of a distorted guitar (although it isn't). I went a halftone deeper than a normal guitar's range, and I reduced the play to only fundamental and fifth (so no full power chord). I created the synth to raise the decay of both, amp and filter envelope depending on velocity and ran the result through a foldback distortion (with a subtle setting) first, then through a screamer, but with emphasis on low frequencies. You will hear 3 4-bars-sections repeating 2 times:
(1) the energy riff
(2) energy riff, bass and drums
(3) energy riff and bass

https://www.dropbox.com/s/6an19o2jg04g06v/energy_test.wav?dl=0

 

try a plugin called string studio

 

Thanks for the proposal, but that would be the exact opposite of my goal. I'm not trying to recreate something. The test I linked was mainly about understanding typical techniques, but not to copy them 1:1, but to understand what all plays together when that high energy metal riffs are heard. In this case it was about playing techniques (palm mute, open, number of notes produced, etc.)

 

Recreating a metal guitar with a synth is super difficult. You can get a surprisingly good "shredding" lead guitar tone by just running a simple sawtooth etc. oscillator into a distortion, low pass it to simulate a guitar cab and then add a delay (or just use some amp sim) (and a shit ton of pitch bends and vibrato with mod wheel) but that's about it.

I don't think I've ever heard a convincing simple low string palm mute riff made with a basic synth

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With samples, yes. But even with good samples things tend to get kinda fishy very fast.

And even if you're just trying to create the same effect, energy, whatever it doesn't really matter: the sweetspot is super small. If you miss it even by a little you just kinda get this weird 90's .mod scene distorted guitar thing going on.

 

Thank you very much! It is a bit discouraging, but truth isn't about encouragement, so I appreciate this answer very much! I was afraid that it isn't transferrable and the sweetspot is a very good point regarding this. I will play around with the idea further on, but in my heart I already agreed to you.

 

I agree with @Riot7 about sound recreation.
That's why i still love metal ;)

There is nothing i heard giving me the same shiver than a metal guitar.
Apart may be a good drum and bass track and agressive synths, like Pendulum, Prodigy... with a nice dose of distortion.

Distortion is the key. You can add short arp, to get that "palm mute" effect.
And some low pass filtering, to recreate wahwah pedal effect.

Here is the nearest metal guitar with synths i can think of, even if not close to your first example ;)

 

Let's be honest: Pretty much everything sounds so much more energetic, when metal is involved. That's why I love that sound - and that's why I so desperately look for ways to get the effect in electronic as well. I mean, just listen to a classic in a metal suit (and imagine driving your car on the Autobahn with your subwoofer enjoying that power):

 

Max Cavalera makes a good case for using only four strings, The 4 lowest wound one's since he always has a lead player to take care of the higher register histrionics (Andreas Kisser when it was Sepultura, Numerous sidekick's in Soulfly including two I'd highlight, Logan Madder whom was in Machine Head for the first 3 albums, He nowadays is a successful studio engineer and mix engineer/producer as well as a few side projects and Marc Rizzo, Marc Rizzo is an extremely gifted player. I love Andreas Kisser also/A huge inspiration)

I've got a lot of guitars, Their mostly metal orientated and also plenty of baritone, extended range and beyond.
Yes the lowest two or three strings when you drop the Lowest to match the third gives you a excellent base for thick heavy riffing due to it providing the root, the 5th and the octave. My lowest tuned monster is a 30" 6-string that has no unwound string on it and it's tuned a full octave lower than standard E/A/D/G/B/E but with the low E dropped down further to D for the D/A/D/G/B/E, It isn't a guitar bass though even though the scale-length would suggest it might be, I've got an EMG85 at the bridge and an 81 at the neck (I prefer the 85 in the bridge due to it being alnico V based, I like the 81 which is ceramic at the neck as it makes the neck position quite clear for sweep picking and such which can sound really mushy especially tuned so damned low. My M80M 8-String is a real monster which I tune differently often but it is generally around a F# or F on the lowest string, That has a 29.4" scale-length. The next is another Ibanez, A 6-string with a 28" scale-length, I have that in drop G mostly, That's using my preference of EMG's again as it came with EMG's, The M80M has a passive Lundgren at the bridge which is a great pickup, then there's a Schecter 7-string with a 27.5" scale-length again this is tuned to G but I for some reason like it with the Devin Townsend/SYL tuning which is a lot of fun, Then my Jackson 27" regular baritone which I have DiMarzio's in, That is in drop A. I've an Ibanez with a 26.5" scale which I have in drop B and then way too many to mention regular 25.5" Jackson's, Charvel's, Ibanez's, Schecter's, ESP's, A few LTD's by ESP amongst others and my shortest scale electric is a Gibson like 24.75" Gordon Smith flying V which is really light in weight but sounds like a beast (It's just shit for playing whilst sat down/doesn't work for that but strapped on it's ready to go).
I usually go for either an .80 or .72 on the lowest string on the longer scale guitars and on what I consider regular (25.5") I use a .56, Never have a wound third as I find I get a better chunky sound but that also means working overtime to build up the kind of power needed to get any meaningful/useful bends and vibrato on that wound 3rd, So it's a personal thing more than anything. Pickups wise along with EMG, Lundgren, DiMarzio, I also use various Seymour Duncan bucker's and Bareknuckle bucker's also, I got hooked when I ordered a set of Warpigs for one of my Jackson's before they got so popular but it's awesome now as there is so much more to chose from by them.
So yeah if you want that chunk thing, Drop down the lowest as mentioned and focus heavily on hard down strokes with a suitable amp sound dialled in and palm mute the bridge to get chunked out and even some djent maybe

Hope that helps and if I'm repeating what's already been said then I apologize, All the best to all as always \m/

Dean