wrong! watch again Pro-MB video, Dan changing filter slope

I disagree

There only one difference - overlap

If no processing applied the singal just pass through the plugin w/o phase changes in Dynamic mode what's default, but operates as normal MB comp.
From Pro-MB manual:
"The Processing Mode button in the bottom bar selects the algorithm that is used to split the incoming audio into bands to be able to process them separately. While developing FabFilter Pro-MB, we have gone through a lot of research and developed our own unique Dynamic Phase processing mode. It has virtually the same frequency response as traditional multiband processing, but features zero latency operation, no preringing effects, and only introduces phase changes when actually changing the gain. This mode really makes Pro-MB stand apart! Of course, we have also included an excellent Linear Phase mode and a traditional Minimum Phase mode. Linear Phase In Linear Phase mode, the resulting spectrum after splitting the signal into bands and summing them together again, is always guaranteed to have a flat phase response. FabFilter Pro-MB's linear phase implementation guarantees an excellent frequency response, even at the lowest frequencies! Also, note that changing crossover frequencies in Linear Phase mode sounds just as smooth as when using the other modes, no zipper effects whatsoever. This might sound trivial, but it is actually quite unique in linear-phase processing. Linear phase processing will give much more transparent results than the traditional Minimum Phase method, at the expense of quite a bit of extra latency and possible pre-ringing artifacts (which are an inevitable side-effect of any kind of linear phase processing). Minimum Phase Minimum Phase mode uses a traditional way of splitting the signal into bands using filters. This does not introduce extra latency, but it will introduce static phase changes at the crossover frequencies instead. Especially when using higher slopes, these phase effects will become very apparent and often unpleasant, which makes this method virtually unusable for mastering purposes. The only exception to this, is using the 6 dB/oct slopes throughout. This also does not introduce static phase changes and is therefore very suitable for mastering. With narrow bands, it is even capable of steeper filtering than you would expect! Dynamic Phase Finally, the unique Dynamic Phase mode gives you the best of both worlds: it results in a flat/linear phase response when no gain processing is applied, but does not introduce latency or pre-ringing artefacts (like linear-phase processing) or static phase distortion (like minimum phase processing). Minor phase effects will only be introduced when the gain of a band is actually changed. This is possible because the input signal is not actually split into bands, but is treated with intelligent dynamic filtering, offering almost the exact same frequency response as with linear phase and minimum phase processing. Dynamic Phase is by far the most transparent mode, suitable for both mastering and mixing, so we have chosen this as the default processing mode for new plug-in instances. Note that Dynamics Phase mode closely approximates the behavior of "normal" multiband processing, but in some cases, like muting all bands, or placing bands next to each other, it works slightly differently"

only if eq using linear phase algorithm or so

can you prove that?

You will wonder but only engineer filters are capable to do it. No one of them are musical

this is your personal opinion, not so objective as is

I meant MB is the same thing as dyn eq, not just simplified

in Pro-MB acting like shelf eq. So basically dyn eq is just eq with vca(compressor), same thing as FF Micro/Saturn with envelope follower assigned. And you can't dynamically change HP, LP filters.

That's was incorrect comparison

And MB comp works only when gain achieved the threshold. Same, right?=)

The whole plugin is based on MB concept

..with built-in compressors - what actually the same thing.

I can do same things in Pro-MB exceps HP, LP and notch filtering. But one important point here - with dyn eq you can dynamically control only gain, not frequency. Notch, HP and LP don't have gain.

What? Only plugin what I know capable of doing that is DMG audio Equilibrium, what is great!

No, same options

 

what isn't a problem

 

Pro-MB does not have a Q parameter. And you can't bracket very narrow bands, you can only bracket octaves. Seriously, Pro-MB is not a dynamic EQ.

Take a look at how a -30dB cut @ 200Hz looks on ProQ vs MB (the slope is just 12 dB on the EQ and a mighty 48 dB/Oct on MB):

And here is a dynamic EQ:

 

Last edited by a moderator: May 24, 2017

Something whent wrong with the picture above and can't edit my post anymore. This is Neutron dynamic EQ:

 

The answer is:
When you split a sound into freq bands and start effecting them differently from one another, you can introduce phasing issues. But unless your ears are trained and/or you have great monitors, you wont realize it. And it all just tranlates to muddy and unclear sounds in you mix.

Not so much with filters on a dynamic eq.

I find that multi band comp works better on sounds that are focused in a certain part of the spectrum, if youre compressing all the bands, like basses and sub for instance. For full/wide spectrum audio, dynamic eq is the way to go. I also like to use the ozone 7 MB comp module for de essing the whole mix, but Im only using one high band of it. Havent tried the dynamic eq trick yet. I will have to now though just to see if its more transparent at the task.
Learn something new every day!

 

Last edited: May 24, 2017

Ladies and gentleman let me present you with GlissEQ by Voxengo. An oldie but a real goodie.

So yes, this new Waves' creation is nothing new. GlissEQ even has a SPAN quality analyser! It must be like at least 7 years old and I trust Voxengo - Aleksey Vaneev to be one of the best quality plugin makers in the Galaxy and wider. If you crave this Waves "new miracle plugin", give a whirl to GlissEQ.

I can shamelessly promote Aleksey's plugins without any regrets because his plugins are that good and his protection scheme is one of the best.

 

I knew an industry vet on another shoutbox/forum years ago that swore by voxengo plugs. He was a FOH sound guy for major festivals and events as well as a coder. He got me to give them another go. Once I got past the GUIs I was pleasantly surprised by the quality of them. Definitely worth looking at.
Now theres a project for the GUI skinners.

 

Last edited: May 24, 2017

But a MBComp with Linear Phase (Pro MB) will also let the signal un-altered. So what's the real difference?

 

Last edited: May 25, 2017

@RedThresh more CPU? Who knows? I can see it now. A whole room of studio vets A/B blind testing eqs vs Comps, haha

 

It's not a single thing that makes the difference, see the pictures above: narrowest bandwidth control over an octave on MB case vs extremely surgical control with a dynamic EQ.

FFS how come people end up confusing a multiband compressor and a dynamic equalizer? Just put Neutron and Pro-MB side by side.

 

basically that's the distance between crossovers

Acting in musical way

As Pro-Q2

you compare two different things - notch and bell, not dyn eq and MB comp - that's incorrect

this is bell shape, but I get the point about steepness

Read above, there statements from Pro-MB manual

To prevent harshness?

so, let's sum your opinions
1. doesn't overlap
2. wide Q
And? yeah, that's it? the difference? really?

strange using of this word in this context. Why? Cuz I'm pretty sure MB comps and dyn eqs are the same things. In general. What you trying to say - is different design, nothing of it can really show the difference technically

 

wtfux this turned into now? eq curves vs multiband curves, lol

 

My fav dyn eq for extremely precisse work is Essence by DMG. Can't beat how you can dial in the slop in the center, but also left and right (not clear I know, screenshot will clear that up) and great choices of filters too (coincident, butterworth, EE, BP HP and LP for the two first, only BP for EE). Essence doesn't have to be only a de esser, you can turn off the noise detector (in setup) and it becomes then one of the most precise and transparent dynamic tool out there. Only one band though....

 

Seems to be an argument day today.

 

Repost. Nothing to see here.

 

I once saw a guy digging a hole with a spade instead of a shovel. But he was still digging, and digging, and..........

 

Last edited: May 25, 2017

If you'd scrolled just a tad below you'd find a dynamic EQ: Neutron.

Indeed. The MINIMUM distance between the crossovers I'd add. And in many cases, for corrective purposes, this distance it is not narrow enough.

Judging on this statement, all EQ's should have a fixed Q of 1.4 because is "musical". Right? All other Q values are non-musical therefore irrelevant. 1/3rd of octave is for pussies, right? One note, who the hell uses EQ on one note, right? Who needs surgical tools when one can do the surgery intervention with an axe?

Exactly my point: you CAN'T do bells in Pro-MB, just crossover bracketing.

One tool (pro-MB) is a rather fixed key (filter types, number of bands), the other tool (Dynamic EQ) is an extremely versatile adjustable wrench. Still can't see the not-so-subtle difference between these tools?

 

lol indeed but spread the mind limits

 

I start to think that's main purpose of MB comp is spectrum balancing, i.e. DYNAMIC octave equalisation. But dyn eq for resonance killing causing even/odd ratio changes.

You meant I can't do notch? I can do bell in Pro-MB as well as shelf

For mixing, there of course the some difference in purpose. But for me, this things the same (technically)

 

Last edited: May 25, 2017

The more I use Fabfilter plugs,the more I love them. They are very accomplished.But sometimes bug...Not perfect but close to it.