I think that's true yes. That they started with mix improvements.
About ghost producing in general, I don't mind. It's just part of the industry.
But when someone says artist X is using a ghost while he's not, it's time to prove otherwise
Btw, Milli Vanilli comes to mind when talking about bad examples

 

With all due respect this is not trance.
With U-he Hive you can get these sounds easily.
Better than Sylenth and the like.

 

yes if you're a musician or a producer, it matters a lot and it's also a matter of justice, people must know that the whole EDM industry is rotten to core and most of the self appointed rockstar DJs are a bunch of clowns and performers.

 

if VanBuuren or Skrillex are your musical heroes you're part of the problem.

you guys see nothing wrong in stealing loops from the past, but let me tell you if you do so you're not a musician, you're just a DJ or at best a remixer.
let me remind you that not long ago people had to play a real instrument to perform in a bar or a disco, now they've all been replaced by a random 13 yrs old clown running ableton and pressing Play, and you like it because once again you're an integral part of the problem .. first you see nothing wrong in drum machines, then in sequencers, then in samplers, then in stolen sample packs, then in autotune, then in remix of the remix of the remix ... and finally they come here complaining that modern music is shit ?

 

Like i said on page 1 or 2: I miss the analog sound.

Just found this one:
Full Track from Deadmau5:

And i got really hard goosembumbs, when he turned the knobs:

(In my opinion) Such warm sounds CAN NOT be archived with VSTs. All that spires, and Sylenths. They all have that clinical, cold "harshness"

This is what i miss on todays electronic music. : "Warmth"

greetings

 

They're not my musical heroes. The only one here who has a problem is you. Mister preacher who 'knows' it all.
Good luck finding some followers. I'm done here. H@st@l@p@st@!

 

I can see why someone like this guy Vorwerk is selling his talent to the monkeys called "DJs" when you can starve, if you are relying on royalties and sales... Someone buys your music/pays for radio/club/festival play = most of the money is lost down the chain.

 

i don't miss at all, i had many analogs in the past and i sold them all and i would never go back.
they tend to warmer and fatter but this comes at a price, first of all their sound is also quite dirty, secondly the tuning can be less stable once they get hot, third their midi is barebone or they're run using CV-Gate, good luck saving lots of patches and this is case they even support memory and patches at all ... no motorized sliders, and finally you're stuck using a 30-40 years old piece of shit that is no match to modern gear in any way.

so, great sound indeed but you will waste hourse just to make the fucking thing going on, your workflow will be super slow compared to working in the box, i mean lost hours to find patches or setting up the machine by hand each time you recall an old song, imagine using one synth for bass, another for strings, two for leads, one for arpeggio, and then a couple drum machines and a sampler with floppies, you're fucked .. but people had no other choice, now that we're fully digital it would be crazy to even think about going back to such a setup, i see many people doing this and they're wasting their time, it's gotta be a cosmetic thing so they can post a selfie surrounded by analogs in their studio ?

even Kraftwerk and Tangerine Dream thrown their analogs in the rubbish and work with a laptop, guess why ?

 

Vorwerk is very technical, i admire him.
DJs, i hate them with a passion.

but, the core problem, the real issue, the root of all evils is still the crowd paying big bucks to go in these events, discos and festivals, that is THE problem.
the early raves were free entry and drinks were super cheap, DJs were dime a dozen and nobody gave a shit as long as the music was good, now it's a huge business and nothing else, can't even bring a beer inside, some cases you can't even smoke cigarettes in the open air, and all this for watching a DJs pressing play on ableton and jumping like a clown ??

i feel pity for the young people .. times have changed for the worse.

 

if we think there was a time when a complex and technical genre like Prog-Rock was mainstream, and now it's Tiesto or VanBuuren, we have good reasons to feel frustrated.

 

Sami (aka Aiyn Zahev) does fantastic soundsets, and his tutorial work (a bit on Sonic Academy but moreso on Groove3) is great, too.

 

guys this is a really interesting topic thanks to all your answers and stories of whats been going on in the music world. Definitely a bookmark for me.

a little off topic. The easiest way for a producer to make an income is learn two synths a subtractive and an fm synth inside out. I mean inside out.Start making soundsets for each of them , by listening to your soul, to top100 tracks ,to other synths presets and recreating, make something interesting for a well known synth. Eg 120 drum patches (kicks snares bongos hihats) on a Prophet 6 or any other synth that has sold more than 200.000 pieces (quicknote , guys if really expensive stuff like prophet6 and virus ti has sold more than 200k units each imagine how many of us musicians are out there in the world nowadays). Now even if you sell that soundset at a cheap price of 10 bucks you are definitely going to get at least 20-30k people buying it.If you go to more widely used synths like Massive or Diva or Sylenth you getthe picture

The second easiest way is unfortunately by selling off. I have composed and produced a bunch of beautiful tunes in my lifetime.I am of the belief we as musicians are nothing more than explorers, not creators. I mean we are essentially exploring the beautifull world of music. We never created it by ourselves. Its also about luck. If that guy hadnt discovered the chords that would lead to the Adagio For Strings composition played in Platoon Movie im certain by now someone else would have stumbled upon the same beautiful combination of keys and copyright it for himself. Anyway these compositions i made ,some could say are my spiritual children, i made them compositions high on feelings ,drugs ,days without sleep,others after some crazy 3day rave fest, others some afternoon after some boring work.

However due to the lack of people in my circle ,connections , nationality, financialstatus etc etc the only way to start getting some gear and building on my home studio, was unfortunately to write off many of those tunes to people either totally pretending to be musicmakers and the original creators of the track i ghost produced for them , either to big name dj's that used these tracks with many others in 40-50 track djmix compo's without any reference to who created them. Of course you as an artist lose any possible rights on that track , and sign the contract of disclosure , meaning that even mentioning to one of your pal's whilst sitting at a beachbar that the track playing on the radio was really your composition could lead to serious court troubles and sues.

Some of us here are young and other of us older. I can understand for a guy 60 years old now what kind of evolution in studio techniques ,methods , styles of music he must have witnessed. I can understand that for a 20 year old , now is the time to be, Tutorials to teach you anything from synthesis to full on gain staging, mixing and Mastering and recording ,plugins,daws,samplepacks,fast net speeds to download all of the aforementioned. I've seen 13 year old kids in audio forums talking bout how they have already spent 2 years on Ableton and stuff and i am amazed. Lol when i was 13 the mind i had and my friends i simply cant believe it. There is no way i would have the concentration or iq to learn a daw and other complex stuff like that. Has the human evolved so much in the last couple of years ? In the UK i read they are handing out rapsberry pi's to 7 year olds. Too much for me all of this.

There is no such thing as bad music since for each and everyone of us good music is the music he likes ,listens to, or produces. However we all have our personal taste , so for example i cant understand how and why a track like Garrix - Animal became a hit. I simply cant understand how ? Was it some media conspiracy ? Is it truly that it is such a beautiful track and my musical preferences are the minority ? If you read that guy's story its simply amazing and congrats to the kid. At 17 year old he had accomplished what some of us are still after so many years dreaming of. He became top 1 with a track i would listen to even i got paid to. Was it his nationality ? Amsterdam , Berlin , Ibiza ,London seem to be places that typically you see European music superstars arising from. Rarely from other places. Was it his connections ? I mean at 16 having Tiesto as your friend ? . Are the stories that all these guys are a clique supported by the Media and its circle of clubowners,festival organizers, buying off their tunes from ghost producers to keep things organized, eg this guy has 20 hit bangers versus 20 guys all playing at the same venue each one their track. I know for one that Armada records is doing a good job of gathering various artists and making their good tracks heard. In each and every one of Armin Van Buuren's collections and V/A's you will see each and every individual artist and producer's name ,studio , location mentioned. That guy is a producer too is he not. If only i could turn back time and instead release those tracks i ghostproduced with him. Yes i wouldnt be the one playing them live in front of tens of thousands cheering and dancing crowd in front of the decks. But i'd definitely be down there amongst the crowd having a good time myself.

And when asked i could definitely say that i made that track for a friend i lost in an accident ,another for the girl i fell in love with , and that hit that although masked in reverbs and 125bpm beats has a melodic composition playing that would put a couple of classical music famous orchestrators to shame was made for a loved one that had cancer. Is it worth ghost producing ? Selling off your track for 20-30k or more ? Then again you could stick to cookie cutter beats and loops and typical chords and try to make a steady income selling them off for 500-1.5k $$ at sites like ghostproducer . Point is , as a friend to a friend , if you make that masterpiece , please dont sell it off to someone else to pose off like its creator.It might put some quick cash in your pocket that will get spent in no time and provide some relief depending on your situtation.But you will feel bad for that move for the rest of your life. Better way is to release that masterpiece as your own, and slowly but steadily make sure it comes in the hands of well known dj's and teams like Armada , or radio stations keeping your creation rights on the track , you will definitely be getting a steady if small percentage of income , you will get your named heard out , which will lead to more cooperation offers, and might be just the right pathway to making a name for yourself. Paul Van Dyk , Armin Van Buuren , John Digweed as far as i know they all started out as musicmakers and later on started making their own labels and in turn helping out new upcoming artists.

Synths i would definitely check out if was into a trance are Linplug and Synapse Audio's collection.
Hardware Synths ? hmmm probably Waldorf Microwave XT, Novation Supernova , and samplers like Korg Motif
Soundtoys , Flux Plugins ,Lexicon Reverbs and Camel Audio comes to mind when i remember the good old times back in the days of Euphoric Trance , Man With No Name, and Astral Projection rocking their latest melodies out of a beautiful summer Israel festival
*dont forget to check out for psychoacoustic enhancers.This specific unit SPL Stereo Vitalizer comes to mind

This thing was the magic dust and cherry on top back in the day for many trance makers.Of course SPL are the same guys that make all the amazing SPL plugins. At least i think so.And in the Plugin Alliance bundle there is an SPL Vitalizer emu of the sorts.

Good luck to all of you with your musicmaking and sorry for the long post.

 

@Batoumba :

Garrix hit the jackpot, his case is unique, that's what happens when labels like Spinnin have a near total monopoly and act like a mafia.
and it's always been the same also in the past, lots of horrible tunes that were pushed hard in all the radios and discos and everybody was left wondering what the fuck was happening, i mean songs without even a riff, just made of drums and a couple samples, at least Garrix can play a couple chords sothat's a big step forward if you ask me ...

well, if he's as good as he claims to be time will tell, it's very hard to stay at the top and the game has always been rigged one way or the other.
as you noticed the whole EDM scene exploded in the last few years, there's so much $$$ going on but it's all monopolized by a bunch or labels and organizers, either you're in and you make millions, or you're out and you make nothing.

the core issue is always the same : for whatever reason the commoners see nothing wrong in wasting hundreds of bucks every weekend in order to get wasted with booze and drugs and Bad Music ! this will never change until they all realize they're being scammed, the scam is going on since the 60s and it's too much rooted into pop culture, and in any case people will always need a place to group together with music and booze, no matter if the music is played by a top-notch live band or by the lastest 16-yrs old DJ pressing play on Ableton and dancing like a clown.

i feel sick looking at the videos of Tomorrowland etc ... in the past going to a festival meant you would see bands like Santana or the Rolling Stones, now they give you Tiesto or Van Buuren .. it's crazy but good luck telling them otherwise, if this is the only thing they know they will think it's the best thing ever, it's their modern Woodstock and sadly it's a mirror of today's society, fake and empty.

 

i like all your comments till now Mixdowner as you can see from the ratings or whatnot, but EDM didnt start a couple of years ago , and good trance and psytrance was made and played for no $$$ whatsoever at least over here in Europe, in underground festivals , in universities , in "illegally" occupied underground subway and garages by people who loved the music the "trance" the musical journey , and i ask all of you talking about some Green Orange band playing its live on the stage being superior to the kid playing his midi sequence on Ableton . Those are just people singing and playing their instruments , their drive, their emotion, is what exactly ? just money, fame, drugs and more sex and not needing to work a 9-5 job and play cool , ? give to the people ? i have been to a multiple of live performances , but in the case of Deep Purple and Iron Maiden people where smoking weed sitting in their friends company and strangelooking the rest of us, and some people up in front waving their hands or hair occasionally. Have you ever been to a real trance - psytrance ? people losing themselves in the melody , the pure female vocals , the beat ,the universe ?

People at the end of the day hugging and talking and leaving with each of other like brothers and sisters ?

some people tend to overexaggerate what they have come to known , i understand , well this is my personal opinion but i really cant understand what so special all of you see in when Mick Jagger or Pink Floyd are bragging about beyond a couple of catchy guitar tunes.In a live from Sex Pistols there where drugs and alcohool the same than in a live from Yahel the same than in a live from Janis Joplin .Ever got lost during a midnight with friends or by yourself ,a couple of smokes and

Liquid Sun coming on then after that then suddenly

at 2:22 the dj makes the turn for State Of Mind , after some hours of dancing and stuff .the sunrise comes shining on you , the waves are hitting the beach , beautifull girls and friends everywhere, you are all friends , we are all friends , we are all the same people on this god damn planet ,whatever god you believe in and all you want sometimes is money fame success because you believe it will bring you hapiness , happiness against who ? the oil dollar selling seich with his harem of bitches he rapes every night versus the kid the was born with an invert penis ? ,everyone is an enemy unless its your family or kid or wallet , thats how most people perceive the world since they've been born, drug dealers selling heroin to youngsters to feed their fam, sick fucks bragging bout it on their tracks , they dont care , sick fucks travelling to Thailand to go to bed with 13 year olds, people with degrees showing off to their cousin who ended up working at the local plastics factory, a sick society that doesnt provide food water and heat for each and every of its own ,a society that divides each another according to his wallet,degrees,prestige,colour,ethnicity a people that destroy and devour the world ,its trees its water with radioactivity and biological warfare, drones bombing some people over there because of .and a simple mind observing ,having being born without wanting,without ever having asked , and definitely without owing anything to any gods or luck roaming out there, and witnessing all the above, raised and grown in an enviroment like this can not comprehend if all this that is happening they why the fuck should i even fight with that guy why or whatnot why my ProTools is better than his Cubase daw , or why Trance is better than Rock or Metal or Punk or why Classical is above all them all ,and after listening again to State of Mind

suddenly the sunrise comes , the waves .......the breeze in between the trees ......... the universe .......smiles ...fuckin hell Last Man In the Universe

, the morning Hymn.....then again are you pretty sure 10million dollar suit babys in your mansions that the classical music you hear only instead of rock or trance or edm whouldnt have the chords in those masterpieces been discovered if the rich fellows that worked for the kings queens and princes orchestras by a kid like Skrillex or Deadmau ? of course they would have been. The beautiful combos that can be discovered are just so many.So whoever gets to them first

then again some guy smoking his weed right at this moment going to his job listening to some trap beat browsing thru his favorites forum at a traffic stop is gonna say WTF ? Last man in the universe is up. Sunrise is up , its beams are colouring the beach , Butterfly Trip tune sounds coming up

, the girl you fell in love with , the dreams you had but will never be , you , here , against another ones idea of a society, you try to dream to comprehend beyond those bars, you try to travel your mind, will you be able ?

 

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Last edited by a moderator: Jan 18, 2026