That is the weakest argument one can use.
It has nothing to do with sound itself, it has everything to do with "talent" that is being promoted.
Songwriting skills and musicianship standards have drastically lowered.
From the 30s and till mid 90s it went up, each decade offered quality bands and musicians in every genre.
Music biz has become automated and dehumanized.
Society has become dehumanized and automated.With reality shows that promote and idolize narcissistic behavior.
I passed a restaurant the other day, two tables, full, they werent communicating with each other, they all stared at their own phone.
Music biz is trying to please the smart phone-mcdonalds generation.
Dont tell me things havent changed, that is pure bs.

 

Great track, and sound!
Wow, 1983. I wasn't even a teenager yet. All I cared about was pocket knives and firecrackers. Just got my first Casio keyboard and started piano lessons. All I wanted to learn was Beatles songs. That was also about the time when I started to recognize real music. When I discovered Frank Zappa and the Mothers of Invention. I did make my parents take me to see him for the "Them or Us" tour, after Frank announced it would be his last. Also about the time that I went to see Van Halen for the 1984 tour. Now that I think about it my parents must have hated every minute of the shows (we went as a family, mom dad and my little brother) that I wanted to go see when I was young. It's their fault for making me go see Tony Orlando with them wearing a yellow suit and tie when I was 10. Tony Orlando actually called all of us kids up on stage when he sang "Tie a Yellow Ribbon Round the old oak tree". I think someone tipped them off and I was dressed for a photo op. It was quite embarrassing. I think making my parents take me to a Van Halen concert was enough pay back for that. But not enough for when my little brother made us all go see the New Kids On the Block a few years later.
But whenever birthdays or Christmas came around I always asked for concert tickets and atari cartridges

 

Last edited: Nov 22, 2016

That you think it has changed is an opinion, just as mine. No need to talk about bs, just because you don't agree.
You say skills and musicianship standards have drastically lowered. I can't agree to that. Well, I can, but only in US EDM. Look at Sia. Low songwriting skills? Low musicianship standard? What about Tools (the band, not tools)? Low musicianship standard? What about U2? Low songwriting skills? What about Kendrick Lamar? Björk? Girl Band? Vince Staples? Jazmine Sullivan's third album? Holly Herndon? The list goes on and on.

Thinking there is no equivalent mastership today than in the past only can come from people who hold to the past, who can't let go. Open your mind and you will see that there is a level of songwriting skills (in the non-EDM world) that outperforms the eighties. But of course, that's just my opinion.

 

1- Singers need AutoTune
2- No Instruments Are Played
3- Almost always about love
4- No talent
5- Stupid lyrics and messages
6- It's more famous
7- Only thing that plays on the radio
8- You hear it everywhere you go
9- Annoyingly Always Playing
10- Bad Singers
11- Most of the songs are about the artist themselves
12- No passion
13- Pop singers are bad singers (for the most part)
14- Auto-tune
15- Real music isn't on the radio
16- Idiots like it
17- Say one thing and people will try to convert you
18- It's too simple
19- Some pop fans judge people who listen to other genres
20- Modern popstars don't write any of their songs or play any instruments.
21- Music videos are vulgar
22- Several pop stars treat fans like trash
23- Lack of Creativity
24- Modern Pop gives Michael Jackson a bad name
25- Most pop stars are fake
26- No variety whatsoever
27- It's Corporate
28- Least Good Singers
29- Appeals to the General Audience
30- Male popstars are weak
31- Ruins the career of some bands
32- They are popular because of their looks, not talent
33- Hard Sexual Themes
34- It's Repetitive
35- Their lyrics feel rushed
36- Stupid songs about relationships
37- Most modern pop artists are immature
38- No sustainability over time
39- The Background
40- Songs are overplayed
41- Most modern Pop songs have horrible melodies
42- One-word song titles
43- No poetry. Just no end to the yammering, wandering talk.

Not read them completely but almost having the same view:

http://www.thetoptens.com/reasons-why-pop-music-is-awful/

http://www.craveonline.com/mandatory/1062828-11-reasons-music-sucks-now-more-than-ever

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices...-because-the-same-people-make-it-8368714.html

http://www.vivascene.com/top-10-reasons-why-todays-pop-music-sucks/

https://www.avforums.com/threads/why-is-modern-music-so-bad.1691911/

and ...
It seems that no one likes these days' musics so who are the audiences of music industry?

 

Last edited by a moderator: Nov 21, 2016

I disagree, because a lot of those genres you just rattled off haven't been forgotten -- most of those New Wave acts from the Eighties are still touring and have entire radio stations devoted to them, and their heyday was roughly 32 years ago. I think any genre of music (yes, even disco) is first appreciated as something new and different, then loses its staying power and put aside for the next "something new and different", then is reexamined over time and appreciated as simply good or bad music on its own terms. Those "fads" also inform the present, especially nowadays, when everything is recycled. There were just as many classical orchestral music turds as there are in any other genre at any other point in history; it's like saying we should all only listen to Sixties music because of the greatness of the Beatles, the Stones and Bob Dylan.

 

Why do you lay words in my mouth? I didn't say they are forgotten. I just said, when they are forgotten, classic will still be a common thread. Also, I never said "you should only listen to". So your example makes no sense. You might test me though. Vivaldi's music is almost 300 years old. We'll see if the music of Billy Idol will still be a human treasure as is Vivaldi's music in 300 years. I bet not.

 

The production does sound as though it's from the late '80s rather than the early '80s, though without the "sheen" of compression and reverb typical of late-'80s pop recordings (which kinda contributed to a sameyness about it). The point is the co-option of grassroots (in this case, "black") culture by the military-entertainment complex. I had liked rap/hip-hop in the '80s, when it was a true folk-art (being "of the people") musical form and presented a lot of sonic innovation and sometimes downright poetic lyrics.

To me, the pinnacle of rap/hip-hop was albums like Fear of a Black Planet by Public Enemy, which is a production masterpiece, and Chuck D.'s lyrics were always masterful jazz-poems. Then that music, and its message (direct and indirect), along with its cultural relevance, got sold-out to the cigar-chompers and was homogenized and made more gangstafied over the course of the '90s. Now, rappers are signed on the basis of the stupidity they can purvey. But that happens with everything that's fresh and for-real; it's hardly restricted to "black" culture.

The reason why the S.O.S. Band track sounds "way" ahead (five years being a long time in the pop-musical timeline) is that someone higher up the food-chain of the music industry had heard it and asked, "How can I get that sound?" How many times have we seen that question posed here in this forum? A cultural revolution is not fomented by conscious or deliberate imitation, but by unconscious and accidental innovation. Everything good about, say, early-'80s R&B and hip-hop stemmed from the new sounds that it was presenting and in the unselfconsciousness of it, being fearless of being peerless.

Veering into Indie Rock territory, check out how much every band whose records had been put out on the Amphetamine Reptile label might have copied the bejesus out of this album, which was similarly "way ahead of" its time (1984):

 

Last edited: Nov 21, 2016

Its not an opinion when its a fact.How many good guitar players, drummers, keyboard or bass player have emerged in your so called new wave of quality musicianship?Very, very few.
I see around me kids that rather spend their whole time on phones instead of buying an instrument, everywhere i go, fucking phones...
Trends have changed, kids just dont have the patience and the balls to be individuals today, when its so easier to buy a cool phone and post cool photos on facebook or instagram.

Music stores around Europe have been hit hard, dont tell me its an opinion, i used to run a big music store not that long ago.
I know the trends and the numbers, facts not opinions.
More than half of the bands you mentioned are slowly ending their careers.
Sia...average shit with annoying music videos that seems to please the brainless Glee generation.

 

Iggy tried to tell you that good music is good music, doesnt matter which genre and today we have shitty songwriters, the music is just bland, it doesnt move anything in me....has nothing to do with age....yes once in a while a good band emerges, but 90% of stuff is pure garbage.
Unerground is where talent has to work these days to survive.
Billy will have a status of a half god in 300 years just as Vivaldi.

 

tell me about it
in oxford HMV stopped selling vinyl
the most amazing record store called avid records also closed down


here is one floor of Avid. i used to live in the basement with Gary, Bob, Paul and DJ Vyper who sold all the house/trance/techno/DnB/jungle/breaks i can still smell it!!!!
this is now a Jamie Oliver's Italian restaurant now smells of olive oil and herbs

furthermore the trendy massive records closed down.
this all happened in the space of a year. i was a vinyl junkie DJ at the time, who hated CDJ using DJs. (Stanton final scratch was incredibly basic and new, and i dont even think serato or traktor even really existed at the time).
it was the worst year!

 

Although i meant music stores for musicians(instruments, gear), you are so right and i forgot to mention this as well.
Its saddening.
I have to resort to internet/ebay to get older releases, thank god for ebay.

 

Even Hans said in an interview the industry is mainly trying to please the mcdonalds generation(sound wise).
And the guy is locked up in his home studio 24/7 yet he still calls a spade a spade.

 

First of, I'm the one who tells that good music is good music, but you insist that good music stopped being good in the eighties. Second, whatever Iggy tried, he quoted me but then lay words in my mouth. He answered to something I never said! And I am strongly against such a behavior. Prove me wrong on what I say, not on what you wish I'd said.

 

I'll add that I agree..... up to a point, the musicianship in the Western world has decreased over the past few decades for sure. There are just too many distractions for younger musicians these days and Western world copyright laws have changed Western music too. I'll also add that outside of the US and Europe there is so much musical talent as most music is still performed live in most of the world by necessity.

A few years back I personally watched a festival in Mexico with 8-10 Banda bands, some having up to 20 piece horn sections, I was mesmerized watching these huge bands rip 32nd and 32nd triplet riffs as one unit, I mean so on point I still get shivers down my spine thinking about it. It reminded me of the old big bands from the 20's-40's, but in a modern Banda style. I'll even say that the average Banda band smokes the average US band musicianship wise, you just never hear the Mexican band because there is no real music busisness in Mexico, so they perform live to survive, like the good old days in the US. Mexico has almost no copyright laws, so no band makes money from CD's or downloads, they only profit from live shows, so they perfect their only means of feeding their families from their music, playing live.

Crazy good musicians exist, you'll just never hear them without traveling and seeing them live.

 

Just had a quick listen to the U.K top 40, and I must say it was a most painful experience, with hardly any real variety to the music.
It's gonna give me nightmares for days.

 

yeah we are a tasteful bunch

 

But you need to add 808s and nasaly voices to that EPMD/PE Equasion: "Power to the versace versace versace" ;)

 

I'm certainly not "laying words in your mouth" (is that an actual expression?). What you did say was that music only has vitality in the generation it was created in and is only important to that generation -- or as to not "lay words in your mouth": "I'm pretty sure this is just a generation thing. Whatever decade you lived your youth in, that will be counted the best music experience, when you're older. Was so with my parents generation (rock'n'roll, the devil's music), is so with my generation (80's synth wave wtf) and will be so with coming generations." You also insinuated that the only genre of music that will be around when all others are forgotten will be classic orchestral music, or again, as to not "lay words in your mouth": "The only common thread will always be the masters of classical orchestral music. Nobody that listens once to Mozart,Beethoven,Händel, Bach, E.T.A Hoffmann, Vivaldi etc. will deny the beauty of their music. They stand the time, when Twist, Rock'n'Roll, New Wave or Trance are long forgotten." Again, that's not necessarily true. I would argue that some people regard their preferred genre of music as highly as others regard classical, and that genre doesn't specifically even have to be from their generation. Plenty of kids listen to New Wave. Plenty of people in their forties listen to EDM. I'd also argue that many, many people are blissfully unaware of Handel or Mozart, despite their historical or cultural significance.

To give you an example in a different artistic medium, there are many people working in the film industry today who haven't watched a film made before 1970, hell, 1980. "But what about CITIZEN KANE or CASABLANCA or GONE WITH THE WIND?" you say. "Those are classics! They're timeless! No one can deny that!" Doesn't matter. On the other hand, there's teenagers out there that have religiously watched every movie Fritz Lang ever made, or buy PLAN 9 FROM OUTER SPACE in every medium it's ever been released in. Even the overly-tweaked plastic "product" that passes for Top Forty music nowadays will have its fans and curators, long after we're both dead and society evolves into something we'd barely recognize right now. Just because you can tell the difference between Billy Idol and Beethoven doesn't mean the masses will be able to make that distinction ... or even want to.

 

I listened to the video and thought that the musicianship and the mix/sound was thoroughly pro. I however felt that the song itself wasn't anything special at all, the lyrics were borderline C+ 9th grade poetry. I love the Butthole Surfers, always have, always will. And yes, Melvins and Jesus Lizard and many of the rest suck in such a great sludgy way. The Melvins, heavy like a hole that's black, singing angry songs of love, attack the bullshit hacks. Real music for these irregular times, like fig syrup for a clogged colon.

And there a tons of great musicians everywhere but certainly not on the radio. We all as a species grow and grow, building and improving our chops on the sweat of the ones that have come before us. Things like genres morph, some are dead-ish ends while others sprout and are given funny names. We have heard it all before. The old never truly dies but is fertilizer that the new is nourished by, roots sucking the yummy fetid mess. The new greatest poets are rap a tap tappng. Bob Dylan is alive and well and his drivers license says Kendrick Lamar. He told me it's still weird to take that first leak in the morning, staring down at his new big black dick in wonderment.

 

Last edited by a moderator: Nov 21, 2016

Even if you write 2 pages more, you still did do wrong. Btw, I don't care for your English, so please do so for my English as well. We can also continue in German, if you prefer. Everything else is just arrogant.

You correctly quoted me: "They stand the time, when Twist, Rock'n'Roll, New Wave or Trance are long forgotten." So why did you incorrectly claim I would have said that they are already forgotten? Again, you lay/put/spit/punch (choose whatever word you like) words in my mouth. Here's your original:
"I disagree, because a lot of those genres you just rattled off haven't been forgotten -- most of those New Wave acts from the Eighties are still touring and have entire radio stations devoted to them, and their heyday was roughly 32 years ago"
This sentence doesn't make any sense, since I never said they are forgotten. Once agian, I said that, when they are forgotten, classic will still stand the time. A pretty simple sentence, but you seem to have a lot of difficulties with it. Maybe you should better try to read correctly, instead of making fun of my phrasing.

Here's another highlight of you laying, putting/hammering/smashing/juggling words in my mouth: "it's like saying we should all only listen to Sixties music because of the greatness of the Beatles, the Stones and Bob Dylan." Again you didn't even understand what I was saying. I talked about classic as a common thread (that is something, everyone, no matter which genre is her favorite can comply with). I never said anything about greatness. I also never said we should all only listen to classic. On the contrary. So, don't lay/throb/squish/cram/shove words in my mouth. What I said is that Von_Steyr over-emphasizes the eighties, because that's the time he spent his youth in. And I'm right, since he already said that everything after the 80's is just shit in his eyes. It's exactly the same as what my parents did when I was young. They also claimed that everything after the early 60's was just shitty music. Sounds familiar, doesn't it?

I say we should listen to everything. Everything includes actual music as well, you know? That's what I stand for! Good music is good music, no matter the time, no matter the genre. It's you and Von_Steyr who claim good music died after the 80s. Which is pretty stupid considering all the fantastic music that appeared in the last 30 years.

But I accept your opinion that there is no good music anymore, it's only an opinion. Just as my thinking that good music ist still around, is also just an opinion.

Regarding your movie examples, I fully agree that there are classics. But classics are not bound to a certain time. For example, "The usual suspects" is a classic in my eyes. And "Memento". But "Metropolis" as well, and "Friday, the 13th". I won't continue, I think this time you understood what I mean. At least I hope so.