Hi there,

I use a physical modeling based drum set. These are the snare's options:


I'm trying to get a sound similar to the one you can hear in this song from the main drummer:

(starts at 01:13:01 )

Try to ignore the punch, this is further processing through compression and transient shaping. But do you hear this metal sound? A bit like a bell, or resonance, that's bending. I try to get to this less rattle, more metalic tone sound. With above options, in what direction should I tweak the knobs? I know you can't do wonders by just watching an image, and I just need the global direction. All my tries so far where either a lot shorter or too rattling.

A drummer might have tuned her drums at least once, so maybe there's someone who can help me?

 

No one? Is it too difficult, or is my description not sufficient?

 

sorry I don't know much about it.. but I'm curious what this is you are using.. is it software that came with an e-drum kit?

 

Ooh, now I'm in trouble! I didn't want to reveal too much, because I'm afraid to not get help if people realize it's not a VST, but a part of Kong, the drum designer in Reason. Now that people know it, I probably will only get punished for using it

 

Not sure if I can help much, as I haven't had a drum kit for like 40 years. But from what I can hear in the video, is that the dampener is off, and the snare wires are loose, they're touching,but not pulled tight across the bottom skin. How this would relate to the settings on the vst I really don't know. On your vst try winding the DAMP back, and the snare tension. At this point I would suggest afairly tight top skin with a slightly loose bottom skin and go from there but with the settings on your not vst. Then again I could be wrong, someone will come along and correct me I'm sure.

 

@tulamide.. I think that is the one daw I never even tried... just couldn't get myself interested enough to jump into that
whole ecosystem... not that it didn't have it's good points. Also did that company sort of shoot itself in the foot
by wanting to force its users into exclusivity situations?

 

They did. That's why I'm still at version 5 and only use it with Rewire, while Reaper being the host. This way I can have the best of both worlds ;)

 

It seems the settings can't be directly translated to real drums? I tried what you said, but the sound was the opposite of what I tried to achieve. Here's an example, where I at least come a bit in the right direction (audio and knob settings):

audio: https://instaud.io/Bt9

 

@tulamide if this is too far off topic.. I will delete it...

since you mentioned rewiring with Reaper, I may crack open Reason 5 one of these days.. What do you find good or useful
about it to you? Is this drum app particularly good compared to others?


strange I could not open the snare on the site you posted, I had to download it.
That is a funny sounding snare to me.. but it's what you are going for for some reason
I suppose.. very metallic sounding...

 

It seems like you're going about this the hard way by JUST trying to use phsysical modelling.

To be honest, I don't think you'll get the result you're after using some cheap CM freebie alone. Why don't you try layering a sample of another snare on top of the clean transient you could make using that plugin.

 

CM freebie? I can't follow you.
Layering is a good idea, if you can live with unpronounced playing. The physical modeling allows for very pronounced playing over the whole velocity range and on 4 different positions, where the stick hits the snare. I lose a lot of that vividness by layering.

 

What you are listening from this video is the mix between close mics and overheads.
As drummer, what I'm hearing there, it's a snare with quiet high tension on top and bottom.

 

Apologies, I thought the PM in the corner said CM. LOL.

Either way, I still don't think you'll achieve the result you want with that plugin alone. Trying something like Addictive Drums/Superior Drummer in combination with layering other samples on top.

Addictive Drums has a huge amount of different types of snares you can choose from, too.

 

Strange indeed. I might need to find another host. Or was it that the 24-bit wav made problems? Normally you should be directed to a waveform display with a play/pause button, etc.

Regarding Reason: The most important point to me is probably some that you don't mind at all. It is lightweight on the cpu. I can use hundreds (!! I'm serious, indeed hundreds) of instruments and not even touch 25% of cpu load. Building sounds is very easy with all of the instruments and wiring them is just pure fun (CV editing through actually connecting with cables). And I like the midi editor, that's where Reaper could still learn from. However, the samplers are mediocre at best and the provided sound libraries almost always sound a bit light, no oomph, if you understand). All in all I'd say it's bread and butter, but the time has taken its toll and modern VSTs offer so many new exciting features!

 

Thank you very much! This is helping me a lot. I won't be able to re-produce the overhead, and I also thought it must be high tension (which I used in my example). Yes, I won't get to that result with physical modeling, but at least I got something. May it helps if I design a drum room effect as overhead replacement? Ah, probably not. Well, thank you!

 

Brass snare drum, and the drummer is hitting a rimshot (ie hitting close to the center of the snare, while the shaft of the stick strikes the rim at the same time.) You might have to use a few samples of a Black Beauty or Black Magic snares, and randomly round robin layered on top of your original modeling .

These subtle nuances of the drum kit are very organic and are extremely difficult to program from scratch. Nothing beats the real thing

 

I'm late to the party. Didn't realize this was a Reason thread. Kong is a long time mistress. Don't tell my Maschine that.
@tulamide Kong has a Rattler effect and you can load two simultaneously.
Don't forget you can fine tune the sample with this section:


You can also load an MClass EQ to cut the sound into shape.
If you flip the rack load a BV512 Vocoder, connect the Snare's Gate Out to one of the Vocoders Band CVs and things get even more metallic. Add slight Reverb and you're pretty close.



If you connect ReDrum's Gate Outs to Kong's Gate Ins you can use the ReDrum sequencer to play your Kong kits. You have to use 2 ReDrum devices if you want to playback the entire Kong kit though.

Whats wrong with the Reason samplers? NN-XT is a beast. It's no Kontat but still.

 

Thank you! Yes, I know about the fine tuning. Unfortunately it totally destroys the shape of the sound, if for example I increase "tone" or "pitch". The rattle effect wouldn't be that much helpful as there is almost no rattling in the original sound of the video that I'm aiming at. And of course I know about all the little tricks like using redrum as a sequencer.

Using the vocoder is a great idea! I will test it. That didn't come to my mind.

re: NN-XT Well, first of all, since it is a sampler, I find it pretty uncomfortable to record sounds. Also, the GUI is not very flexible, which makes editing real pain. As rompler it is a fine thing, can't complain about that. But for tweaking there's too much limits. Modulation routing of the lfos for example, or that the second lfo only does sine wave, only one amp envelope per group, or look at the options to route velocity. For useful modulations you have to use automation via midi editor. Ah, well, you see I'm not so much into that sampler.

Btw, I'm always open to talk about all the little things in Reason. Exchanging patches, or help each other out. I'm working with it since 2010. However, I relied on samples most of the time when it came to drums (which is easy if you're doing mostly electronic). But from time to time I'm looking for a more natural sound, and I never before used the physical modeling modules so specific. I hope to learn taming those as well

 

I'll try to replicate this playing style. Thanks a lot!

 

Obsessing over a snare for days. Thats me right there. LoL