I did the test. Also been doing a lot of my own testing the last year since I switched permanently from Sonar to S1. I have no issues with the mixdowns. I really do like S1 a lot. A year ago you guys woulda called me a Cakewalk employee how much I loved Sonar. 15 years on Cakewalk since it was Cakewalk Pro Audio, but the switch to Platinum looked awful. No fixes I desperately needed from an upgrade like that. So it made me wander a bit. Demo'd S1. Made my world and my daily sessions so much easier and faster. S1 v2 never made me look twice...but v3 made my life easier, so now I'm stuck to it. Did the test Zoom did and had the same results....no difference here. Do you have the latest update? If I had that issue I'd be pissed too, so I hope it's some internal setting you can fix. In the prefs there's a setting to dither playback and renders...make sure that is off. Hope you can get it working correctly, if not, definitely call PreSonus and biyatch about it for sure. Cuz that ain't cool if certain systems behave differently than others with regards to mixdowns....too essential

 

Hey Zoom, I don't know why you say things like "they want you to accept what ever they write.." I don't mean to make you accept anything... I'm just raising a question about something that called my attention...that's all.... relax..

I heard the file you sent and didn't see any difference between the sections... maybe I'm wrong, or doing something that is leading to wrong conclusions. By the way, how did you do the recording of the test? Was it a mixdown from the DAW or another interface? Thanks for your help.

 

wasn't referring to you! I actual made the test for you! what did you think of the Audio test I did ? can you hear a difference ?

 

I dragged and dropped the stems from a loop library...Simply put them in S1 went straight to export...then imported to track to S1.
I only used S1...NO other piece of hardware and no plug ins...just an EMPTY S1 session.

 

I'm not in my studio right now, but tomorrow I'll try to make a recording of what I'm hearing, maybe I'll plug the output of my interface straight to the input of another interface, and make a wav file, so maybe you guys can judge for yourselves... Sorry for not doing it before raising the debate... =)

 

The moment I saw the title of this topic, even without renting a quantum computer to check parallel universes with all imaginable outcomes and possibilities I absolutely knew that in this one Von_Steyr will be back (again), striking over S1 with Steinberg weapon. I bet that the Von_Stayr version of him, the version that I also remember as the original, does the same in original branch of reality which we've split from and also I'm inspired to speculate that there in mighty all-universe (shall we call it: allniverse) might not be enough parallel universes where we could find a version of him not doing that.

 

Last edited: Jul 30, 2016

Try importing a wav, export with DAW with same settings as original wav file. Import that track back in on a new track. Invert its phase. If there is no sound, they are the same. If there is some sound, they are not.

 

Are you using ASIO or DirectX/MME? The sound is very different for each, at least on my machine. DirectX generally sounds more brittle with pumping compression, ASIO is a clean signal (I hope lol). So let's say you are mixing with ASIO and then you playback in another application that is using DirectX, it's possible you are getting different sound because of that. The file itself is not the problem, it's the driver in this case.

 

Try the null test, invert the polarity of the render mixdown and reproduce both, render and live session, if there is any diference you will hear it, if you don't heear anything there is not any difference. Thats all. Any other apreciation is subjetivity.

 

Haha,loved your post man
S1 is a cool daw though.

 

Uninstalled it long time ago . It has very limited routing options not suited for my needs. I think it was lacking in routing output directly to other channel, say fx channel (if correctly remember). Am not talking about pre-fader or send.

 

Unless it's sooo dramatic to a point that it's ruining your track (means thousands of users have shit in their ears), if your track doesn't impact the listener as it should, maybe it is because it just sucks or your mixing needs to be improved ? even ntrack studio has more features and possibilities than what's been used to create some legendary music. a bad carpenter blames his tools. just my 2 cents

 

right... so... the bulletproof test would be a phase cancelation test for those who want to try it... import a loop to S1, bounce it at the same rate, bit depth, and no dithering, bring it to the sesion again sided with the original loop and flip the phase of one of the two... if absolutely no sound, then absolutely no difference (you can check all that with osciloscopes, phase meter and spectrum meter... theoretically there should be absolutely no movements in any meter... altho it will in the spectrum meter by its nature, but it should be below the -100db mark)...

The reason it could happen this you say you hear might be one of a few...

-difference in the buffers between realtime and offline rendering:

Someone already have mentioned this one, there'll be tiny gaps in realtime, and this'll be more noticeable when loaded with tons of effects.

-dithering in offline rendering:

the DAW will introduce noise to counter-up rounding errors in the file. I even believe this is also the case when the dithering is off but will need to test it myself

-up-sampling at import:

if the audio rate differs with the session rate it will have to perform interpolation (or upsampling) in between the samples to match with that of the session. Downsampling can also be an issue.

-up-sampling at export:

this can happen for antialiasing purposes in where it extend the usable frequency, lowpass-it, and then downsample it to the original.
If for some reason the imported signal at realtime is aliased (I wouldn't know how such case would occur), when exporting it will get rid of this aliasing, thus taking out the extension of it (most likely occurring between the high and mid-high frequencies).


I don't really know how S1 manages all that but that would be my wild guess. Phase cancelation test would give you some idea of what is going on

 

Tried to post yesterday but Audiosex was down for a while.
Ok, here are the two files for comparison. One is "in session", wich in my opinion is great and the other one is the mixdown file.

Using Studio One 3.1.0.35191. Recorded my main output with another interface.




http://s000.tinyupload.com/index.php?file_id=78232435303745426650 (in session)




http://s000.tinyupload.com/index.php?file_id=00771379971517881288 (mixdown)




Anyway, I'm downloading the latest version of S1 and maybe even doing a fresh Win8.1 install....




I have to agree with ericdared, two posts above. Maybe I am, like many other musicians, getting too crazy about not so important details and putting the art aside...




Thanks for all who gave their opinion. =)

 

I have just encountered this same problem a few moments ago and discovered this thread for some answers.

I was bouncing a nice airy pad in S1-4 using Zebra and no matter how I bounced the audio, the result was missing the sizzle that I was really digging from the midi playback. I literally tried every way one could bounce to audio.

What seems to have fixed this was disabling "Use dithering for playback and audio file export" from the Options/Advanced/Audio menu.

I got my sizzle back :D


S1-4 for the win.

 

impossible

 

This is probably where you did it wrong... The problem seems to be connected to the way Studio One managed processing.

That can be part of the problem but automatic offline oversampling applies to every DAW though.

 

Last edited: Jul 15, 2018