Any good guide, tips, tricks about Orchsteral out there

Lao · Dec 14, 2014

Hello guys

Im looking for good guide, tutorials,tips and tricks about orchester. I know a little bit about it but not so much, but I want to go deeper and want to learn more about it. I want to know how to get a real,epic, realistic Orchestral Sounds in my daw. Start from Viola to Cello, How to panning this sounds, What kind of Effect to used, how to programm the instruments to make it sounds real. And whats the key of making Orchetsral Sounds like e.g. Hans Zimmer

Any tips are welcome. And what library would you commend. Thx in advance

Lao

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Studio 555 · Dec 14, 2014

@ Lao,

I'll start by the end of your Request, and as follows :

And whats the key of making Orchetsral Sounds like e.g. Hans Zimmer
Click to expand...

The Key for that... well, maybe you should call yourself 'Hans Zimmer', isn't !!! *yes*

How to panning this sounds,... , how to programm the instruments to make it sounds real
Click to expand...

For this, you can have a look at the following Images that depicts a 'Real' Symphonic Orchestra, and above all, the (important) positions of each Instrument :

This can give you an idea of how to 'pan' your desired (used) Instruments along the 'Stereo Field' of your Project(s)...

Other Articles that can be of great interest for you :

'How to Achieve Realistic Spatial Imaging Using Kontakt'

'VSL’s Spatial Placement Secret Weapon' ('Vienna Symphonic Library')

What kind of Effect to used...
Click to expand...

About the 'Effects'... well, try to make the 'whole' sound as natural as possible, so maybe don't overuse some kind of 'Effects' ! *yes*

I want to know how to get a real,epic, realistic Orchestral Sounds in my daw.
Click to expand...

If you're a 'Kontakt' User, it exists several Great Libraries that are really well done. *yes*
Rightly, some are oriented toward 'Epic', 'Cinematic',... stuff, and of course, these sound very realistic, mainly due that these were created from the playing/performances of 'Real' Symphonic Orchestras and 'Real' Classical Musicians. *yes*

Below, you'll find some examples of specific Libraries as it seems you're looking for :

...more similar Libraries exist as well, so good Quest !!!

mono · Dec 14, 2014

This came out about 3 weeks ago

udemy Adventures in Classical Music TUTORiAL

You’ll begin with an introduction to the various elements of music -- for example,
melody, rhythm, pitch and harmony – to give you the basics and vocabulary
to understand and appreciate any type of music.
You’ll then explore the History of Classical Music
through its various stylistic periods,
from medieval chant right up to the current cutting edge.
Anyone interested in classical music will benefit from this course.

ill send you a pm

you shoud read a bit here as well and download the midi files

http://audiosex.pro/index.php?/topic/15093-are-there-any-orchestral-templatesprojects-avialable-for-free-or-saleespecially-for-ableton-live/page__p__101030__fromsearch__1#entry101030

Bunford · Dec 14, 2014

If you are interested in making orchestral music, VI Control should be you go-to forum. Even Hans Zimmer is a member there!

VI Control

junh1024 · Dec 14, 2014

I can suggest this book: http://www.amazon.com/Acoustic-MIDI-Orchestration-Contemporary-Composer/dp/0240520211 in regards to panning, EQ, and MIDI CC. It gets quite detailed, with mutiple panning diagrams PER SECTION of the orchestra (usually), and WHY. It's also available on audioz.eu .

Gramofon · Dec 15, 2014

...To answer the original question a little bit, with some random thoughts:

Start with a concept of your sonic world. Limit your palette to fit the sonic world you're trying to create - you can get lost and never write a note if you scroll through 1000 presets on average sounding synth. I got rid of most VstIs and just work with the ones who's audio engines have real depth and quality, like Zebra and Diva, or the Virus. And yes, I have a lot of great old analogue synth that I bought for next to nothing when everyone ran out to buy a DX7.
Before writing a single note, my team and I spend a lot of time programming new sounds, sampling new instruments.
If you want things to sound big, make sure you limit your upper dynamic range. All instruments - especially percussion - sound bigger when played relatively softly. You can always turn it up. When you hit drums too hard, or any instrument is played too loud, they tend to sound only bright and thin and pingy.

I write very strategically for the spaces I record in. For instance, the Hall at Air Studio has a gallery, so I put my horns up there above the orchestra in Batman. The space you have people perform in is as important as the quality of their instruments. Players respond to good accoustics and will give you a better, more committed performance. The same goes for sampling. A dead room gives an artificially surpressed performance. It's no fun playing in a dead room. Especially brass players like "using" the reverb in the room to give them time to catch their breath between notes, so they'll have the courage and strength to play the next note stronger. I like recording in churches and halls, not studios and artificial reverb. 2000 years of architects like Brunelleschi figuring out how to amplify a sound beats the 20 years we've had of fake reverb development. But if your budget is a bit tight, try a school auditorium. Or an empty warehouse. Use your imagination. You belong to the proud fraternity of poor, starving artists. People expect you to ask them for favors in the name of the great piece of art you are about to unleash upon the world Smile

I got pretty good ears ( I just had them tested...I got the frequency response of a 20 year old. Just luck. I've been listening to music in my studio too loud every day for 30 years). But the biggest thing is to learn how to listen analytically. That takes time. I learned from really good producers and engineers. Two month with Trevor Horn on a bassdrum sound will either drive you crazy, or really make you understand the damn thing (I'm not sure which side I've ended up on...). I know how to engineer, I know what all those knobs do, but I know that Alan Meyerson has a gift and is better at it then me. But at least I can comunicate to him - very specifically - what and how I hear my piece. I think there is nothing worse for a composer to be at the mercy of technology, the players or a recording engineer. It's your piece of music. No one understands it better. (I always wonder...I grew up (?) working on Neves and Trident "A"s, Harrisons, etc. So I know why I pick a 1073 for certain sounds or a DBX 160 in my UAD plug-ins. If you never used the hardware, how do you know?).

I always have my monitors set to the same level. It's the only way I know I'm not kidding myself. I don't use very expensive speakers, I just use what I really know - and can get replaced easily.
Yes, we build our own sampler, because I can hear the difference, but the comercial stuff is getting better. And my career was just fine when I was only using Akai S 1000s with 8 megs of ram.

I'm a bad player, but a good programmer. I'm forever trying to explain to great players that want to become composers that they need to treat learning and practicing the computer as seriously as they practised their guitar or piano. The computer is a musical instrument and the more virtuouistic you get on that, the better you can express your ideas.

The moment I start writing, I start mixing. Since I don't write on paper, I spend a long time making each note and sound convey the right emotion. It helps later with the live musicians. I can be very specific in my language (and I use English, not Italian) to convey to them why I want a note or phrase played a certain way. I don't make changes on the scoring stage, I don't let directors make changes with the musicians there. The recording is about getting a performance, not re-writing the cue. Nothing sounds worse then a bunch of bored musicians that had to wait while someone's changed an arrangement.

Most of the stuff I use on a daily basis is off the shelf software - and not the really expensive stuff, either. The best DAW is the one you're used to.

I don't understand why people don't sample their own stuff. I've been (more then once) asked to judge "young composer" competitions. After a while you can't hear the music for the sameness of the sample libraries. I wonder how directors or producers can tell the difference.

And no, you can't sound like me. You are not me, you are you. Just like I can't sound like any other composer. Not with any degree of authenticity.

I hardly ever get a temp in the movies I work on (Chris Nolan will not temp with anything that's not written for the movie. That whole Francis Lai thing is bull. I'm a fan, but I had never heard that score before. And if the rude ignoramus who was trying to hide behind a question mark when he called me a thief had actually analysed the score a bit, he'd have noticed that the whole thing was based on the notes C and D. Not just that riff. It's a fairly straight forward musical tension device. Seconds, anyone? And the rhythmic figure was - on purpose - a cliche. People can take large chunks of dissonance if you put a groove with it...)

I can get obsessively lost in sound design and just spend 4 days making one pathetic little sound...But it helps me think the whole piece through...

...And i procrastinate from writing by answering this question...

Hz
Click to expand...

http://www.vi-control.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=3614067&no=1#3614067

As for the sound itself, I don't think there's a 100% right way to do it. You'll have to experiment and practise.

mrpsanter · Dec 15, 2014

Regarding the libraries, you might also consider the Spitfire stuff which is IMHO top notch.

mrpsanter · Dec 15, 2014

Thanks Bunford,

I didn't knew about this forum, seems interesting.

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Any good guide, tips, tricks about Orchsteral out there

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Any good guide, tips, tricks about Orchsteral out there

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