1. Neither Soothe nor Gulfoss are really unique. There are plenty of resonance plugins. Or they unique both and I should install all of them?

2. What if I have no plans to use them? It is not obligatory, you can mix without them as many engineers successfully did for years.

 

It doesn't matter if you have one or four of something, once you know how to use them.

Blaming shit like extra plugins for not being as productive as you want is some kind of inverse of the same problem. Cheap subject matter for Youtube videos.

 

1. Nobody blames extra plugins here. I just don't understand why would I really need so many plugins.

2. The ability to use something and the real use of it are different things.

3. You just create music

or

download, install, delete and then reinstall plugins, test them, decide if they are unique enough and useable for you under certain hypothetical circumstances (that are highly unlikely to ever occur), learn how to use them, read manuals, watch videos, try to categorize plugins, decide what drive (capacity, vendor, type) do you need for your backups, burn important software to CD, DVD, or Blu-ray, upload images to a cloud etc., etc., etc. And then reinstallation of OS you use becomes a nightmare lasting several days or even a week.

 

First, your non-native English is better than that of a couple of US presidents - at least you know and care to use available tools for correction.

Second, your points are valid, and focus on the technical aspect of plugin "engineering" (or lack thereof), and on the marketing and distributing of "this junk" by "low-effort grifters."

And third, I will let the 6+ pages above speak for the technical and marketing aspects. I would rather focus - dare I say, compassionately - on the human aspect of "engineering" plugins.

We're all "musicians" here, in this forum - or let's just say we are. And this in forum, a similar-parallel topic has been raging of late: should ai be embraced as a "tool," or scorned, or publicly and technologically repudiated as a "music generating" and avaricious tornado grade revenue hoover in service of (so-called music) corporations.

I was surprised to see so many of my fellow "musicians" in this forum, side with the former stance - advocating for the embrace of ai, because it's "easier" and "more democratic" (i.e., no music theory knowledge or learning an instrument needed).

That, is the exact same mindset that (allegedly) inhabits and drives those "low-effort grifters."

Having said that, I remember hiring developers once. Once was Polish, spoke five languages fluently, and had worked previously for a high end console manufacturer - easy choice. We got along great - built award winning software together. Another was fresh out of school - nothing even remotely related to audio or video, a pure developer - but had graduated high school in Ulaanbaatar, gone to Uni in St Petersburg, got a Masters in Dresden. He basically traveled half the globe as a student, in the pursuit of knowledge and competence. I hired him on the spot. A third didn't go to Uni at all - he got his degree from Brooklyn College Night School, while working a full time job. I asked what kind of job, he said "Nurse." I was surprised, asked what hospital, he looked down at his shoes and gave the name of a Long Island Psychiatric inpatient institution. I told him: Welcome, you're hired - you'll fit right in!

My point being: there's as near infinite diversity of developer profiles as there are "musicians." Some musicians, dare I remind everyone, really suck. I mean they're godawful (no need to turn on the radio or streaming app, check out the social media posts or live streaming on any app these days - it's appalling). Some musicians, aren't really musicians - e.g., David Guetta, whose long time "collaborator" died recently of cancer, leaving him orphaned - but manage to fill clubs, theaters, stadiums even, and headline festivals. I have a couple of DJ friends (real DJs) who have an undeniable musical flair and rhythmic sense, and are quite successful at it too, so I don't mean to shit on all DJs, or sucky musicians, but (I'm getting to it), in music as in plugin engineering as in cooking as in hairstyling etc, basically in life, there's very much a pyramidal effect: very few of the highest quality at the top of the (quality - not success) pyramid at the top, some good and competent musicians or plugin engineers in the upper middle, and hordes of average, mediocre, sucky and godawful-lawd-have-mercy in the lower middle, middle, and base levels of the (quality - not success) pyramid.

It should bear no surprise to any intellect then, that plugin or music or cooking or doctoring should obey the same laws of the pyramid.

Also, it's not illegal to make crap burgers, crap shoes, crap plugins, crap anything apparently - unless your products suffocate children, cause cancer, or blow up in a ball of fire on the freeway (and even then, that's what lawyers are for). Talking about lawyers, every bit of software in the world is protect by a EULA - drafted by said lawyers, so it is up to us musicians to educate ourselves, and ask around, for the recommendations of our friends and business associates. This is how I buy my synths, my mics, preamps, and cars. I only wish I could've done likewise for my girlfriends and wives, but that's another story for another day.

I mentioned compassion earlier - what I mean is this: even the suckiest musician can evolve, can learn, can grow. So too can plugin "engineers" or developers. There's a fair trial period for most software products these days, and most of us can google, and some of us have peers in the industry we can ask for recommendations.

So start there, don't worry about the noise or the bubble, focus on your work (and stick to proven tools maybe). The high-effort plugins will rise to the top of the pyramid - they almost always do. When high-effort products don't (and this too happens, e.g., Betamax) it's always because it's cheaper, or easier (i.e., "low-effort") for the consumer or professional user. C'est la vie.

 

The point is they do not come stock with any DAW. So yes they are not considered standard plugins and now, they are not unique but they were when Soothe first came out. And you are reinforcing my point. If a person has no plans to use them then why download something you'll never use? I think that has been said in one way or another by me other than something that is not stock standard. there is an entire post I made on the prior page about doing a mix with only what comes in the DAW. So we are not on a different page though perhaps you may have thought so.

 

They absolutely do blame things like "analysis paralysis", "too much choice", "digging through menus to find the one I want".

People blame "too many plugins" like this all the time. Sometimes there are even nice "Why I deleted all my plugins" clickbait videos to go with it. And there is an audience for that advice because for those still learning, a huge number of new plugins can be the kiss of death. And almost all of them do it. What's the first real bundle of plugins they install? Waves.

How often do you know you need a compressor, but load up "the wrong one"? It should be somewhere close to never.

This is all particularly true for users with templates built. If you have some other similar plugin floating around on your machine, that's all it is doing. It may be needlessly taking up storage space, but that certainly isn't slowing you down.

This constant updating thing is a big problem for some people. The changelog of an update version will not reflect a single reason for an individual user to update the plugin, but they do it anyway. At best it is some wasted time, and on the other end a risk of breaking something that was already working correctly. That other stuff about OS reinstallation is pretty much a Windows thing. A time capsule on Mac will roll back the entire system in a few hours. And you have to really break some stuff to resort to it; usually by updating the OS! Imagine that...

 

Real ones know that if you are not lining up 50 different compressors in a rack to make sure you pick the best one for that particular track, then you aint mixing!

 

I agree with that. A useless plugin is, at the worst of scenarios, taking my storage space up. But they are not slowing me down, since i don't try to like a plugin; There are 3 types of plugin for my experience:
The ones i use on all the sessions and are on my template. Those are the ones that only will be changed if something doing what they do, do it better without hesitation. It's not a guess game. I'm not searching for artifacts my ears cannot listen. The reasons for changing need to be obvious. Some are online, some are bypassed and others on the favorites folder.
The ones i like the concept, controls and sound but didn't find a usage yet or doesn't have proper testing. Those may replace the ones on my template or deleted on a soon future, depending of my needs and the test results.
The ones i though i liked, i used to like or were considered flawed on my setup but i didn't uninstalled em yet. They don't last long TBH.

But i love to waste my time upgrading plugins, since i'm not a user of APU and Pulsar Modular.

 

who the hell uses plugins. i use hardware. ai cant get inside my synths

 

I wanted to say you that the uniqueness of a plugin isn't a reason to install it and keep it. Its use is the reason.

There is much fun with downloading, installing, upgrading, testing etc. But this occupation itself is really strange.

 

agree! im kinda doing the same... idk for what synths i would replace all the arturia ecosystem, but for now im with serum 2 and falcon 2. some synth from Hanz zimmer but no more