Noo, TMT is not dual mono with linked settings.
if you run a mono synth and mess with the dynamics section in the strip it becomes pretty clear they are actually different settings for each channel

 

It's bullsh1t. It was "invented" because you have to have something that separates you from all the other vendors. Simple. If these "inventions" make sense or not is of no interest. On top of that comes the idiocy, that on the one hand there is this need for working "surgical", whatever that means. (In my opinion that is another buzzword to make clear, that there are things that are for the really "pro's", that you have to strive for, because you do not get the real problems that can only be solved by this new fancy "plugin-technology".) On the other hand they bring in a momentum of randomness.

This whole plugin-thing is nowadays very often a fight for any new invented "niche", trying to sell solutions for new invented problems. And Brainworx is no exception. Be real: What is left when you want to sell a channel strip? No joke, but have a look at the free Tukan plugins for REAPER. And then prove that Brainworx does a better job. I am waiting. Be quick, I will start laughing soon. Or, if you go really fancy: What can be done to prove that there is anything that is clearly superior to Pro Q-3?

Dirk, come down, don't try to go the cheat-route. Make good plugins and be done with it.

 

"The Channelstrip is dual mono with the TMT and linked stereo when TMT is off for the dynamic section I believe"

TMT ON - dual mono
TMT OFF - linked stereo

 

Sorry i'm confused. Does dual mono means the settings are not linked?
To my understanding you could use dual mono either with linked settings or without linked settings.
What i meant to say earlier is that the TMT is Dual Mono but without linked settings. Different settings for each channel.

 

BX SSL TMT: https://disk.yandex.ru/d/vxlY8plTE474vA
BX SSL no TMT all 1 ch: https://disk.yandex.ru/d/hc8j9ifmnCas-Q
There are 45 copies of the plugin (mono) in the project. I thought the difference would be more significant.

 

Would you share?

Which of them?

One thing I can say: driving the fader on the API channel with the API bus maintaining gain structure allows you to get some juicy saturation in a way I hadn't heard yet. Maybe it's just the workflow...

 

Look at the pictures.

There are 2 things I want to mention:

1. The TMT has NOTHING to do with real hardware behaviour. It's a gimmick, made to sell more plugins and be "better" than the competition. And here's why:
• I boosted at 1kHz, but you can see that at 1kHz is actually a DIP, simply because TMT shifts left and right channel up / down from the frequency that you boost. This is NOTHING that hardware would ever do!
• When you turn TMT off, now the frequency does NOT center itself to 1kHz, STAYING at the left channel's position! This is fu*** ridiculous. Because this means, that when TMT is disabled, you NEVER boost or cut at the frequency that you selected in the plugin, but always at a LOWER position. Sometimes this can be really dramatic. Yes, I know, you should use your ears, but this is stupid and has nothing to do with hardware.

2. Both plugins are modelling the SSL J console. Look at the difference with the same settings! The bx J Console is only capable of VERY broad strokes, almost like a Pultec EQ. (The Console1 SSL 9000 XL plugin is also very broad.) It's not the right tool for more surgical moves, whereas with the White Channel, you can do at least more narrower cuts or boosts. I don't know if the J console is meant to be that way. But just remember that the J console is VERY broad.

 

So, I've made some more tests with Focusrite console, Lindell 50 and 80, SPL Iron, Shadow Hills Class A (the other one doesn't have TMT) and MC 77.

The link option is handled differently in these pluggies. Focusrite has switches, 50 a knob for the compressor (0 and 50 - 100%) and an overall link = TMT off, 80 doesn't have this feature for its sections, only for the whole pluggie with link = TMT off.

For the channel strips it looks like the older the ori hardware is, the less effect TMT has (especially when I have a look at the SSL J screenshots here) - which is a bit surprising to me because I would've guessed it's the other way around.
For gates and all compressors (of these plugins) I could not recognize an audible difference between left and right.
Means, the extend of TMT depends heavily on the plugin itself.

When it comes to mono sources (great hint, thanks a lot for that) it could be that different DAWs handle this differently.
Reaper processes both channels and spits it out in mono again and this means, TMT does have an effect on mono sources. The resulting sound is a bit less defined in the center, it feels a bit smoothed, which may or may not be welcomed. This is also easily measurable with a goniometer.
Left dry signal, right focusrite activated, no knobs turned:

 

Last edited: Sep 18, 2024

Sure it does. This happens in every console - to different amount, ofc, but it happens. If not it would mean that all EQs and all their bands are calibrated down to a single Hz. Have a guess if his happens.

Which is what basically every analog HW EQ is doing.
BTW, this goes for the EQ gain too.

Both are a different story when it comes to high end mastering EQs - that's one reason why they're so expensive.

In my tests, they always chose the left channel, not the lower freq.
Keep in mind, even with TMT turned off, it's still an analogue emu.

 

It's just the casual term, "dual mono" usually means everything is separated, "linked dual mono" only exist in digital world, but then we are torn between how the controls are linked but the detection path for the dynamic isn't. In analog, anything that is "linked" will go straight to stereo linked, controls are linked (only using one side of the hardware) plus the detection path for dynamics also linked. Digital is too flexible thus terms become confusing I guess.

 

Last edited: Sep 18, 2024

idk to me just feels like emulation of the SSL J channel's TMT was based on chinese knockoff

Yes i guess, the term is confusing. And the linked term is also confusing, because like you just told me, when we talk linked stereo we are not talking about the settings but talking about the signal path. So by that logic Linked dual mono doesn't make sense indeed, that would be stereo again.
But still tbh in digital world i expect DUAL MONO = 100% STEREO UNLINKED.
And even if I was in the analog world and matched the settings by number and the difference was noticeable like in the SSL, then i would just try to match the settings by ear, thus being closer to a 100% stereo unlinked then the 'dual mono' in it's classical sense.
Also as you said it yourself, it doesn't make any sense that the GATE is also changed to DUAL MONO.

Lastly i want to give a DISCLAIMER:
I said earlier LINKED SETTINGS, but i meant MATCHING SETTINGS. The settings are linked alright, in a proportional manner.

 

Last edited: Sep 18, 2024

unfortunately I was not following anymore this insteresting thread, will try to read what I have lost and add my experience which is related to Lindell API only, it's important to underline which plugin we are talking because they have different behaviours

just a few lines about this:

that knob is the original you find on the API 2500 VCA compressor, so it's not added by the developer "because of the TMT" or something, it has no relation to the TMT. That knob can make the 2500 compressor a true 2 mono channels or progressively make it a "linked stereo". Faithful to the hardware. And its an amazing feature to have on a stereo channel strip. If you use it on a Lindell 50 with the TMT off and the sound source is a mono kick it wont have any effect, obviously.

There is a second compressor on the Lindell API 50, it's a FET compressor, very different sound. I very rarely use it because I dont like, it doesnt have the same knob, faithful to the hardware as well.

on the original API consoles there were no compressors on the single channels, so Lindell decided to add a classic 2500 or the FET which should be from a 500 series if I am not wrong

 

There is this 527 module for 500 series, which is 2500 in mono.


the FET one is the 525

 

ok thanks

I had the memory that the API console that Lindell was emulating had no compressors, so created this hybrid, but Ive read about it when it was released so forgot many things.

 

I have no prove, but I don't think anyone that modeled an API console ever modeled it from a console. It's time wasting to pull each of the channel especially a vintage unit that would require a specialist, then separate the cards and all... when there's hundreds of 500 series lying around which is kinda the same thing. Smaller, easier to jump the cables to test and all. It makes no sense at all to pull apart the console when every studio ever has API 500 series. The modern API console usually has 500 series slots and use the same module. The closest thing they'd do is run an impulse through the whole channel. That Lindell dude was in Thailand all the time back when he was releasing all these plugins. You can find interview videos back when the plugin was released. The Helios channel strip were only released when the reissue 500 series starts selling.

EDIT : Same goes to the famous Motown EQ that is rare, pricey and all suddenly there's tons of plugin emulation just a month after Heritage Audio released a clone. Ain't nobody gonna advertised it's an emulation of a clone, why ? because you can sell more saying it's modeled after the original. Ampex preamp too after Warm Audio released a remake.

 

Last edited: Sep 22, 2024

Right, I mentioned it because Lad and Stevie talked about it.

 

Just found out that this product https://sonimus.com/products/aconsole features something similar:

• Optional Stereo Crosstalk feature creates a sense of depth and three-dimensionality in your mixes. Choose “Vintage” (more evident effect), “Modern” (less audible effect) or leave the crosstalk OFF.

I don't know how this specific feature compares to TMT, but judging from the demo audios on that page, at least the saturation aspect is way less subtle. From the manual:

 

Last edited: Sep 22, 2024

I dont remember if I wrote, but in my attempt to build up an API virtual console in my DAW I use the Sonimus "bussing system". At the beginning I used the Lindell 50 bus emulators, wit the same concept as stated for the channels: 1-1 for the kick bus (yes, I have a dedicated kick buss), 2-2 (summing kick and bass), 3-4 all drums, 5-6, 7-8, 9-10 emulating an 8 bus mixer.

After sometime I decided to test the Sonimus A console and switched (for a series of reasons...)

I can say that the crosstalk thing is not comparable to the TMT. We shouldnt mix the things. The TMT is related to frequency response of each "single channel", so gives an "open stereo image" if used in the digital world where we have "stereo coupled channels" (different than analog world).

The crosstalk is emulating a phenomenon from the analog world: one channel will always "influence" a "closed one" : ) someone will explain it better, but consider that 2 close channels on an analog console (1-2 3-4 5-6 and so on...) or on a tape machine will "influence each other". Due to electrical reasons, you will end up hearing a little bit of a channel inside the other one, that will influence the stereo image (phase, frequency response, saturation and more...)

Technically the effect is "narrowing the image" lol but the result to our ears will be like a more "interesting stereo image", which was proper for analog world

Thats what is trying to emulate Sonimus with the crosstalk in their "system". I call it System because it gives you the opportunity to have BUSS emulations on your groups, and a MAIN emulation/controller on your mixbuss which can control each single buss (without moving your DAW group faders). If you know the Waves NLS it's 100% the same thing. I decided to switch to this workflow and I am enjoying it.

As stated for the TMT, after some testing I decided to deactivate the crosstalk emulation for: kick buss, bass buss, kick&bass combiner buss, all vocal buss. But I use it for other busses: synths, guitars, background sounds-vocals, FX return buss and so on. Thats due to the genre of music I make mostly lately, which is modern pop-hiphop-electronic-synthwave. But I would use it for classic-acoustic rock, or jazzy or similar stuff.

NB: forgot to mention that I decided to deactivate the crosstalk on stereo buss, as I didnt use TMT when I had the Lindell 50 buss emulator on my stereo buss.

 

Last edited: Sep 22, 2024

It's rather 1<->2<->3<->4 and so on. For busses, AKA subgroups it's L1<->R1<->L2<->R2...

 

I cant understand what you meant sorry.

You mean that the crosstalk is on channels and subroups as well? Yeah, no doubt. I think even on headphones out/to REC2 out lol (on crappy consoles) I just quoted single channels as example, but every track is included. Main outs, Direct outs...everything.